Open Cell Attic Insulation. No baffles/No vapor barrier?
snkscore
9 years ago
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9 years agolast modified: 9 years agoenergy_rater_la
9 years agoRelated Discussions
condensation in attic with open cell foam on rafters
Comments (11)I see someone has been doing some reading.. Yeah lzearc, unfortunately I dont think any state has adopted it yet. Heck, most areas still dont enforce some of the 2006 requirements. NC has a hybrid that is mainly the 2009 versions with a few of the easy 2012 details. Most of our homes do use the performance path, but all our homes use third party certifiers. The software can be used by anyone but the final result is best served by a third party professional. The performance method is necessary to not stifle innovation. Its intended to allow freedom of design and is a great tool for achieving a balance for designs that may do something that doesnt quite meet the prescriptive guidelines but is still an efficient and comfortable design. It is NOT intended as a way to circumvent the basics set forth in the prescriptive guidelines. The performance software is a great and amazingly accurate tool in the hands of the experienced and knowledgable. Its also easily manipulated and can lead to very bad design, performance and comfort by those unfamiliar with the many variables of the program. The software is looking for the same R values as the prescriptive guidelines. Skimping in one area can be made up for by adding in another. If someone is making their home pass the 2012 IECC in RESFEN or other modeling software with only 7" of Open Cell foam at the roof deck, they must have some seriously efficient (and not cost effective) mechanical systems going on or are using the software wrong. For the most part, following the prescriptive guidelines is the most cost-effective way to achieve the intended code which most experts feel is the sweet spot in balance of upfront costs and energy use/comfort....See Moreclosed cell foam insulation and radiant barrier
Comments (2)I am skeptical of what 1/4" of foam would do for a house with a lot of openings. I am also skeptical of any bubble insulation that claims to be a radiant barrier and provide an R value of 6. These seem like odd choices. What climate are you in and what is the exterior cladding?...See MoreInsulation for a new house - alternative to spray foam open cell...
Comments (43)Nothing about your home should keep you up at night. If concerns about using a particular construction material or method will do that, then don't use it. However, if we never applied any new materials, systems, and construction methods in residential construction, our homes would be no more comfortable and perform no better than homes built in the 1700's. We wouldn't have, for example, air conditioning, which makes living here in coastal Virginia much more pleasant in summer and which keeps certain contractors in the Houston area employed. The energy crisis in the 1970s gave rise to the use of house wraps and vapor barriers which caused plenty of unintended consequences. That doesn't make polyethylene or house wrap bad materials, it's simply that the building science wasn't established at the time. We continue to rely on the researchers to thoroughly test new ideas (and real world testing is better than computer simulations) to minimize, if not preclude, unintended consequences. When considering the use of the latest and greatest materials homeowners would be well advised to remember the old adage: The early bird gets the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese!...See MoreOpen cell spray foam to the attic and HVAC sizing and Ridge Vent
Comments (11)"He suggests closing ridge vent and soffit holes from inside with spray foam. Is that an acceptable practice? Do we need to replace the ridge vent with cap shingle from outside to prevent moisture damage to the roof under the ridge vent?" I retrofit spray foam insulation under the roof deck in my former home (climate zone 4c) to convert a conventional, vented attic to a conditioned, cathedralized attic. Based on my experience, you'll need to remove the ridge vent and install cap shingles (it was an easy path for insects to enter.) I'm not sure what type of soffit vents you have, but there is a possibility of spray foam finding its way through the openings as it expands and making a royal mess. "There is a website saying ridge vent is still needed with foam insulation. Do You Need Attic Ventilation With Spray Foam Insulation? (mcclellandsroofing.com) . Is ridge vent needed or not?" The website you linked is a great case in point illustrating that not everything you read is true--especially on the internet. The point of installing spray foam insulation on the underside of the roof deck is to create a conditioned attic. A conditioned attic does not depend on air exchange with outdoor air for ventilation. It does not require a ridge vent. That said, a vapor diffusion port is recommended to reduce the relative humidity in the attic. We didn't install vapor diffusion ports in any of the conditioned attics we've constructed to date, but each attic houses HVAC units and duct work which regulate the conditions. The first conditioned attic we installed was back in 2001 so we've got plenty of history and no problems thus far. "Foam insulation seals the house tight, would that reduce the air quality inside the house? I prefered batt insulation and breathable house out of this concern." Your house is not a living organism and it doesn't need to "breathe." The interior conditions do need to be controlled for both the comfort of the occupants and the sustainability of the structure. If your home is "tightly constructed," and spray foam implies such, you'll need a provision for fresh air exchange. A properly-sized energy-recovery ventilator is a must, in my opinion for occupant health and safety. "Is open cell foam insulation effective enough to reduce AC unit by 30%? Due to the hard-to-reach space in attics, I am not sure if close cell insulation is an option. Should HVAC be sized differently for open cell foam vs closed cell foam? If Open cell is applied multiple layers, would that achieve the same R value as closed cell foam?" HVAC systems are sized based on the insulation R-values and surface areas. You can achieve equivalent R-values with open cell, but it needs to be installed at much greater thickness. Ask to see the ACCA manual J calculations and the manual S equipment sizing to see if the required capacity is indeed reduced by 3 tons....See Moreworthy
9 years agosnkscore
9 years agorwiegand
9 years agoenergy_rater_la
9 years agoDan D
5 years agorwiegand
5 years agoDan D
5 years agoseabornman
5 years ago
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