Thank you, Dawn! That is so helpful!

What about squash bugs? Are these varieties also resistant to squash bugs? I thought that was the case but now I'm wondering if I got mixed up... I'm excited to try Seminole Pumpkin this year.

• Dawn, maybe they'll drown in recent rains.
• Canokie, if the Seminoles are anything like Old Timey Cornfield Pumpkins (OTCP), they'll simply outgrow any damage the squash bugs (SB) do to the leaves. Last year my vine was decimated by the SB in late July, I believe it was. I did't mind. Kinda expected it. That area of the garden is still dirty so they hid well from my attempts at war and flourished. The SB moved on to my birdhouse gourds after the leaves died on the OTCP vine because there was nothing else for them to eat. And the OTCP sprouted new leaves all along the vines very quickly and continued to thrive.
  
  I saw where Squash Vine Borers (SVB) larva began burrowing into the vines when it was younger and more tender but it grew faster than the SVB larvae could create damage.
  
  Quite impressive. And I have NO idea why this stupid format inserted bullets.

Outgrowing the pests and pest damage is one way the C. moschatas are so successful. I've had Seminole run 30' in a year with adequate moisture. Sometimes I let it just take over and run all over the garden, climbing the fences and even up into the trees. One of my friends asked me once what kind of pumpkin trees I was growing because as he drove by all he could see was smallish pumpkins hanging from the trees on the edge of the woods.

Sometimes I let the vines climb the tomato cages and take over the tomato beds once I've canned all the tomatoes I care to can. Last year I let Long Island Cheese vines run the whole length of the garden from west to east until it reached a SunGold tomato plant, and then I pulled it off the cage and stratedically rearranged the end of the vine to run northward so it wouldn't bury the tomato plant. It buried pepper plants instead (but they still produced peppers).

You cannot ignore squash bugs and let them run rampant because they will carry and spread diseases that you don't want to affect your plants or to become endemic in your soil. I find the diseases spread by squash bugs and cucumber beetles become a much bigger issue in a wet year than in a dry year.

Oh great.

You know how I mention that maybe twice a decade I won't have squash bugs or squash vine borers show up at all? Those years, so far, have never happened in a wet year. Sometimes they happen in a very dry year that follows a very wet year. So, if this year continues to be wet, we'll likely struggle with squash pests and diseases, but then if next year is a pretty dry year, it will seem like a piece of cake by comparison.

A wet year can be deceiving. Pumpkins and squash plants will flourish and grow incredibly large incredibly quickly. A gardener can get all excited about that. But then, reality sets in as those large, rampant vines become fodder for diseases and pests.

I rarely spray my plants with anything because I don't want to eat food that has been sprayed with stuff, and I mean even organic stuff. Some of the organic pesticides are just as harmful or just as dangerous as the synthetic ones, or even more harmful. I hate to even spray fungicides. In a wet year, though, I have to occasionally spray fungicides and usually Bt 'kurstaki' as well because wetter weather also seems to encourage fungal diseases as well as the amount of caterpillar activity I see in the garden. In many ways, gardening is easier in a dry year (though you have to irrigate more often) than a wet year. It is relatively easy to give plants more water when rain isn't falling but there's no way to suck up the excessive moisture out of soil when it is very wet nor can we make high humidity just go away.

I purchased "Old Fashioned Tennessee Vining Pumpkins". Any suggestions or advice? I also bought Seminole. Do either of those look "cute' for Halloween?

Last year, my Connecticut Field pumpkins took off--so pretty--and then they died. SVB, I figured out too late. Didn't get a single pumpkin.

Dawn, this is about your comments about organic pesticides. I'm guessing (from your posts) that you grow most of the food you eat. The things that you do buy from a store (if any?), do you prefer organic or non-organic? Like, with milk, cheese, meat, bread? Do you think the organic products are less healthy? I'm just wondering...most of the food we buy is organic. It is more expensive, but it's worth it to me if it's better for us...and the animals are treated more humanely. Anyway...I just noticed your comments about organic pesticides.

Hazel,

I grow as much of our food as I can, and that means spending tons of time preserving the harvest (via canning, dehydrating, blanching/freezing and root cellar type storage) so we'll have home-grown produce year-round.

I buy a mixture of organic/non-organic food from the grocery store. I'd love to buy only organic food but we have a budget to live within and it does not allow for only organic food.

I do not know if non-organic foods are less healthy and will leave that debate to the food scientists. What I do know is that I'd rather eat food that was grown in the most natural way possible. For me, eating as much naturally-grown food as possible is a personal choice. I am a 16-year cancer survivor and as soon as I was diagnosed with cancer, I began eating only an organic vegan diet. The vegan part was really hard for me because I grew up in Texas and love meat, especially beef. My family wasn't crazy about a vegan diet, but put up with it (at least when they ate at home) for me. After about 6 months, I began adding meat and dairy back to our diet. We still eat healthier that we used to but not as healthy as we did during those six months.

When the National Organic Standards Board was developing the standards to be used by certified organic growers, there was much debate and compromise. Some organic food advocates felt the standards were watered down and weren't completely happy with the standards as written and implemented. Some organic advocates were disappointed and felt the organic standards were too lax and were quite vocal about that. I watched the debate with interest. For me, though, I'd rather eat organically-grown food even if the standards under which it is grown are somewhat less than perfect. One reason I grow as much of our produce as I can is because that is the only way I know exactly what was or wasn't sprayed on it. If the choice is between a strawberry grown in our garden with no chemicals sprayed on it versus a conventionally-raised strawberry that may have been sprayed with various synthetic products from 1 to 3 times a week, guess which one I'd rather be eating?

Just because a pesticide, herbicide or fungicide is organic in origin does not necessarily mean it is safer than a pesticide, herbicide or fungicide that is synthetic in origin. There are some organic products I've never used and never will use. I'm planting my 18th spring garden right now (my first was planted a year before we broke ground for the house), and I have used a synthetic pesticide once (last year, to save the garden from huge hordes of grasshoppers) and it almost killed me. I won't say I'll never use a synthetic pesticide again but I hope it will be another 18 years before I feel like that is the only option left to save my garden. I even use organic pesticides sparingly and, in fact, most years I don't use them at all. I use them very selectively and only for the worst of pests. Sometimes I'll spray neem oil, for example, on one specific plant that has a pest issue but won't spray the whole garden or even that whole row. I'd rather hand-pick and use other methods to remove the pests. I never spray Spinosad because it is a broad-spectrum pesticide that can harm some beneficial insects, but I'll use it in a granular product (Slug-Go Plus) that I sprinkle on the ground to kill pill bugs and sow bugs. I also use a granular organic fire any product that contains Spinosad. Other than neem and Spinosad, I sometimes use a product containing Bt 'kurstaki' on brassicas and that's about it. I mostly rely on our population of beneficial insects to help keep the pest levels low, and on hand-picking bugs or using floating row covers to exclude them from crops.

I think that produce grown in the most natural way possible tastes better, and we all know that produce fresh from the garden is the best-tasting, healthiest food around. I like being able to harvest in the morning and then use some or all of that harvest in the meals we eat that day.

And, on the list of what really matters, the use of synthetic pesticides bothers me the most. I have less of an issue with synthetic fungicides or fertilizers. I think every gardener has the right to grow their plants, whether ornamental or edible, in whatever manner they choose. I just choose to grow mine as naturally as I can. When I first transitioned from conventional gardening to organic gardening in the 1990s, I essentially kept gardening exactly as I always had with the only change being that I was substituting products that were organic in origin for those that were synthetic in origin. After moving here, I began to take steps to go beyond that and that was the beginning of my progression to go sort of beyond merely growing organicallyand focus more on gardening in the most natural and sustainable way.

Whether you will be pleased with the winter squash/pumpkins you chose as fall decorations depends on whether you think all autumn pumpkin displays must include big orange pumpkins. I love all the C. moschatas for fall decorations because I like their various shades from buff-colored Seminole to the almost brownish-buff color of Musquee de Provence. For 7 or 8 years before the squash vine borers found us here, I always grew huge numbers of winter squash and pumpkins in all colors---including orange, yellow, white, buff, green and some that were speckled, splotched, striped or warted. It was fun while it lasted and they made great autumn displays, but the SVBs have made it impossible for me to have that wide variety of colors now, so I am content with the colors of the C. moschata group, which mostly are in a range of buff-colored shades. Having become used to what I have now in terms of sizes and colors, I am content with pumpkins that aren't traditional jack-o-lantern types. And, sometimes I want a big orange pumpkin in the fall and plop it down in the middle of the display with my home-grown ones.

Dawn

This isn't much defense against SVBorers, but ducks are what I started using to combat the squash bug plague we get. I used to try to do it by hand, but I grow too many winter squash that just sit there all summer for me to remain vigilant. The ducks quite enjoy the work though, doesn't take too many and as long as the plants are decent size when I introduce them they do little if any damage.

Also, watching them chase down grasshoppers and squash bugs is endless hilarity to my kids.

Thanks, Dawn. This morning I woke up thinking about my post. My questions were personal and I apologize for asking them. An excuse I offer is that I was really tired last night--the filter wasn't there. Thank you for answering them so kindly.

Recently, I've read a couple of articles about organic pesticides being as bad or worse than the others. The thought of spending more money (we're on a budget too) on organic foods and they're not any better than the non-organic cheaper versions makes me a little ill.

We sold our big pretty house in town and bought this little, not-so-pretty house in the "country", so that we can begin doing sorta what you're doing with food preserving, etc. Grow as much of our own food as possible. However, I'm still working many hours and I'm really new to gardening and caring for chickens. I've grown stuff before, but not on this level. I realize I can't do it all in a year. Add to the food growing, my fascination with making medicines with herbs--that's a whole 'nother thing. Good thing herbs can be food and medicine.

I like the variety of pumpkin squash colors too. But, I do like a big orange jack-o-lantern--at least one. I suppose I can buy a fake one or get one at the pumpkin patch. The Tennessee Vining and Seminole are good choices? I've read y'all's comments about the seminole, I think. But not the Tennessee Vining one. I ordered them from Southern Seed Exchange.

jdevers, I want ducks. Do they need a coop like chicens? We used to have geese and one male duck as pets. We just made sure they had a kiddie pool and shelter. But now I would like eggs. DH and I were talking about it the other day. What breed are you using?

We like Khaki Campbell the best so far. You have to provide protection, actually even a bit more than chickens. Chickens will roost in a coop, so they.are relatively easy to protect. In my experience, if there isn't snow on the ground ducks will sleep on the ground itself so you have to provide a safe fenced area.

If you go this route, look into the quantity of eggs you will produce before buying them. We only ave 8 hens and we give a lot of eggs away since we just can't use the shear quantity of eggs they produce. It isn't that big of a deal for us because I grow all their feed as green manure anyway, but if you are paying to feed them it is hard to justify that any unless you eat eggs every day and have kids which do the same. Some breeds aren't nearly as prolific.

I was thinking 2 or 3. We live in town. DH wants chickens and while I want chicken manure, I'm not ready for the commitment and expense. I was considering muscovy, for reasons that I have now forgotten, LOL.

Dawn thanks for those great explanations organic vs synthetic. I am attempting all organic gardening and most of the produce and foods I eat are organic unprocessed.

I too am getting ducks this year. I just have to finish their sleeping quarters. I have pens already.

Hazel, It's okay. I didn't mind the questions and I didn't mind answering them. The topic of organics versus synthetics is complicated and there's lots of controversy. I just try to make decisions on growing practices by asking myself "Do I want to eat food or cut bouquets of flowers sprayed with Product XXX ?" If the answer is no, I don't use it.

The truth is that some organic products may be linked to some diseases like Parkinson's Disease or various forms of cancer, just as some synthetic products may be, so we all need to think about what we do and how we do it. I just always try to use the least dangerous product that will do the job I need done.

Tennessee Vining Pumpkin will work better for carving than Seminole will if it is your intention to carve a jack-o-lantern. You still will not necessarily get the standard shape of an orange carving pumpkin. TVP gives you some variation in pumpkin size and shape, and not all of them have a flat bottom that will allow the pumpkin to be carved into a jack-o-lantern. I practically know the SESE catalog by heart and am pretty sure there's a photo with the TVP description that shows some of the variation in shape. I got some that wouldn't sit upright---I had to lie them on their side for holiday decor. Frustrated with that, I put some hay in the bottom of an old, rusty wheelbarrow and piled pumpkins of all kinds that we'd grown into it, and used the other pumpkins to hold the TVPs upright. Mine weren't carved either. If I carve a pumpkin here and set it on the porch, possums or skunks eat it the first day or two that it is out. We are very rural and like living surrounded by plentiful wildlife, but it makes it impossible to do some things....like having a jack-o-lantern on the porch. Old Timey Cornfield Pumpkin, Long Island Cheese Pumpkin or Tan Cheese Pumpkin might be a better carving pumpkin because of their shape.....but TVP has the thinner rind so it is easier to carve. Dickensin pumpkin (the variety used by Libby's for canned pumpkin) also has variable shapes but might give you a more rounded, traditional jack-o-lantern type pumpkin than TVP would.

I love ducks and we had them our first year here, and they are not a good fit for our very rural location. We just have too many predators and the ducks didn't want to come to the safety of the coop like chickens and guineas will. Ducks are wonderful for pest control as long as you can keep them safe at night. I hope you all will keep me posted on how the ducks work out for you.

Our guineas were great for almost a decade and then in one horrible predator summer, they got wiped out, during the day, in broad daylight during a horrible drought year when we had lots of predator issues....big time. Now we have only chickens, but they aren't allowed in the garden much during the growing season because they like to eat all the plants....and especially tomatoes.

Dawn

The geese we had as pets adored tomatoes. Little garden was fenced but tomatoes were alwas trimmed as far as their necks could reach through the wire. They loved dandylions, too. Even for several years after they were gone we didn't have dandylions. I think the last goose went to an urban hunter. She disappeared overnight, there were no feathers, and I think she was too big for an owl. Unlikely anything 4 legged got over the fence and left without a trace. This is one of the reasons I hesitate to get ducks or chickens. We also had to fence the patio, because the geese wanted to roost on the step to the house. I cannot tell you how nasty that can get in July.