She's getting married at 7 but no food until midnight snacks? E-vites for a formal wedding? She' s dictating that people need to bring money or a gift and what they should wear? Cash bar at a formal wedding? Sounds like she was raised in that barn she was considering for the ceremony.

Needs the money for another cruise. Let her jabber, I would stay home.

I once went to a wedding that started at 6:00pm. Around here, that's the start of the dinner hour. Guests started arriving at 5:30ish to be seated. After the ceremony, guests waited in the hotel lobby as the room was "switched out" for the reception. By the time we were allowed back in the room, it was close to 7:30. When it became clear that the couple chose to have a "candy bar" instead of dinner or even hors d'oerves, half the guests headed for the nearest McD's. We too were starving, and ducked out as soon as we could following the crowd to the nearest restaurant.

That said, what the couple decided to do for the reception was none of my business even though it was a train wreck that could have been predicted from miles away.

In your case, I recommend you quietly "dis-engage" from the wedding talk with this woman. The bride-to-be clearly doesn't want any suggestions. To continue offering yours may end up causing issues at your work. The last thing you want is to have your opinions come back and somehow bite you in the behind during your next performance review.

So, next time the bride reveals a decision that conflicts with what you would do, bite your tongue/remember that you have something important to do in the other room/etc.

By the way don't be surprised if, despite all the wedding talk at the office, the bride doesn't actually invite you and/or your co-workers to the wedding. You'd think that most people know not to talk about a party in front of people that aren't invited, but some brides are just dense. Based on how the planning is going so far, I wouldn't be surprised if she blithely picks and chooses to invite only some of her co-workers without realizing the fall-out that will create in the office.

Frogged:

She is obviously on a budget for this wedding. Many people have delightful weddings for little money, and maybe a little help and advice and perspective might be much more than any bought gift you could give.

Oh my. I would have to decline the invitation, unless I just went to the "ceremony."

I'll show my age here, but in a time and place far, far away this was how the "formal" weddings in my northern rural Arkansas community were celebrated.

She lived at home, or if she was a real rebel, in a small place shared with other single women.

He lived at his parents home, or on the road if he had a traveling job.

He asked her father for her hand. Father agreed.

An engagement announcement spread either by word-of-mouth, or there might be a local newspaper announcement. Sometimes they'd be posed for a photo so that her engagement ring was seen.

The wedding usually took place three to six months later. There would be one bridal shower, hosted by a close female friend and usually with only women attending. If you gave a shower gift you were not expected to bring a wedding gift.

Many of the brides, and/or their mothers and aunts, made their wedding dress and veil. Some went to far as to make the dresses for the maid-of-honor.

The wedding invitations would be ordered, along with darling printed napkins, and mailed about a month before the ceremony. I never received an invitation that wasn't for a Church wedding.

Some couples did "elope" to the court house; most of them sent out hand-written announcements later. Couples that had eloped sometimes hosted a cookout/cake-and-coffee reception a month later, usually at the home of one of the parents.

The weddings took place in mid-afternoon, or after 7 p.m. Flowers were a special touch, and live. There would be a bouquet for the bride, corsages for the mothers, boutonnières for the groom and fathers. Sometimes there would be special candles or flowers at the alter and simple tulle bows (made by the bride's friends) on the pews.

The receptions would be "cake and coffee" in the Church basement. There would literally be a "reception line" where bride and groom, maids and groomsmen, if any, and the parents and grandparents formed a line to greet each guest and receive "congratulations."

The wedding cake, sometimes with ice cream on the side, was served. Fathers and groomsmen made tasteful toasts. Various ladies manned the punch bowl, coffee maker and tea pots. People would mingle, eat cake, watch the couple open any gifts (usually few) that may have been brought to the Church, then a friend would pack the gifts away in the trunk of one of the parent's cars. Bride and Groom would beam their thanks and then dash off from the front steps under a shower of rice to begin the honeymoon.

Of course, the remaining young single bucks had decorated the car with cans, banners, shaving cream, etc. so the couple could arrive at their destination in style.

During the next month a wedding announcement would pop up in the local newspaper with every tiny detail of the couple, their education and jobs, wedding clothes, flowers, rings, special guests, cake - and who made the cake - the minister, music, honeymoon, and their future residence.

About a month after their return from a honeymoon - if they took one, or a few weeks after the wedding they'd be treated to either a pound party and/or a good old fashioned shivaree!

this is a train wreck waiting to happen by serving booze and sugar (cake) at same time with no food! if the cops get wind of it they'll be outside to handout the drunk driving tickets!

I certainly can see the need to economize, and the first place I would do so would be with no favors. We asked our kids what they thought of favors at their friends' weddings, and they said they usually left them on the table or threw them out on the way home. So we skipped favors for DD and added a service of candy dishes of chocolates served with the dessert.

To me, a 7pm wedding needs a meal served with it, or at least heavy hors d'ouvres. I have no problem with a cash bar personally as I have seen too many people get far too drunk at weddings, and I don't like seeing that. A cash bar helps limit consumption.

I certainly would expect guests to dress nicely for a wedding, and I also expect to give a gift for any wedding I attend.

If she wants to save on the cost of feeding her guests, she ought to have a mid afternoon wedding. Then everyone knows there will be only finger foods or punch and cake. If she sticks to her evening time table, people will depart in droves to find a place to eat and then head home. That would be sad for the bride who expects to party all night

She sounds like she has her own ideas and does not want input, so I think I would just avoid the topic.

We have been to some lovely weddings in the past few years. They are more personal now, so none of what you seems that unusual. Trying to control costs is something most couples attempt. Celebrations are done differently in different regions. In fact, I have never recieved or provided anything other than packets of jordan almonds. The only problem I see is the guests waiting so late to eat. It is the brides day, and she should have it just the way she wants it and not worry about what others think.

I don't see a problem with this. It's her wedding day and my thoughts are that I don't get to plan it. I would have a meal but I never go to a wedding expecting a meal even when I know there is a reception. When I have gone to a wedding without a meal, we went out to eat somewhere and went back for the dance. I rarely go to weddings now where there is a free bar. Most weddings I attend now only have a cash bar. I like it better that way. I think if you don't like listening to her wedding plans, just leave the area or work on something else.

Co workers are not invited to the wedding, so I do not have to worry about going, She is not outright telling people to bring gifts or money but it is clearly expected. She is definitely trying to do this frugally, but wondered about the places where she was cutting costs. Instead of saving money they went on a cruise, and spending 2 grand on photos seems extravagant to me. I do worry that people will not enjoy her wedding which could put a cloud over her day. But its not my business. I don't think I have been pushy, more asking questions but going foward Jewl657 your advice about keeping my thoughts to myself is good. She has plenty of people to agree with her about her plans.
Caroline your description brings back memories of they way my Mom described weddings of her generations I remember Mom taking about a shiveree. Some of these things are still done in my family and people I grew up around to me these traditional things are what weddings are a celebration.

This post was edited by frogged on Wed, Nov 5, 14 at 19:09

This feels sad to me. Yes, it looks like she is planning on a budget, but for me, the last thing to compromise on is the food.

My niece had her wedding reception in a community center. It was actually a center that serviced the homeless and drug addicted. My sister was upset, but her daughter has been on her own for years and basically planned it all herself.

My niece has a doctorate in public health. She was instrumental is saving this center from closing. It has a special place in her heart.
The wedding and reception took place in the gymnasium. She made the center pieces. The photographer was a good friend, the caterer was a friend who owned a Metiteranean restaurant and the entertainment was a friend who was a klezmer dancer! Basically, this wedding cost practically nothing.
It was unique and personal. We had a fabulous time.

Economics had nothing to do with this wedding, as she could have afforded anything.

I think the most important thing is for guests to know what to expect. If budget is the issue, an afternoon wedding with a dessert reaction would be an option.

Your co worker is not asking your opinion. It's a shame that she doesn't have anyone helping her make good decisions.

Honestly, the only thing that seems unreasonable is the food. If she doesn't want to feed people, she should change the hours to be mid-afternoon or late night, and make it clear that a meal won't be served.

As someone who was just married less than two months ago, $2k for wedding photos is a VERY good price. I paid significantly more for mine. I don't blame her at all for splurging on this. They will last forever. Everything else is just a day.

It's hard to plan a wedding. Everything is so very expensive. We had a very modest wedding with 20 guests. Just a park ceremony and a nice steakhouse dinner and it was very expensive between the photographers, the dress, the flowers, dinner, open bar, officiant, setting up chairs, hair and makeup, etc. It just all adds up really fast.

I can sympathize with the bride. She has to choose her priorities, and everyone is different. There's no way to make everyone happy. Some people are more into food, others want a fancy dress, some want tons of beautiful flowers, some want the dramatic, luxury locations. For me, the comfort and enjoyment of my guests was more important to me so I spent more on their food/drinks and less on things like decorations and my own personal items.

Try to be gentle with her. It's so encompassing and exciting that I had to try really hard not to talk about it constantly with everyone even though I know no one cared even a fraction as much as I did. :) It's also really hard to realize your budget isn't going to pay for everything that you want.

Also, I agree on not having favors unless they are edible. Most people don't need or want a little keepsake. We did a candy buffet as a favor and everyone seemed to enjoy that, but in hindsight I don't think it was necessary at all.

This post was edited by chi83 on Wed, Nov 5, 14 at 20:20

"... spending 2 grand on photos seems extravagant to me. I do worry that people will not enjoy her wedding which could put a cloud over her day."

The day after the wedding, the flowers will be wilted, any food will have been consumed or thrown away, and the dress will have been put away, never to be worn again by that bride. The only thing that will last forever are the photographs and memories. (Queue Jim Croce.)

And as long as the bride and groom have a good time and look back on it fondly, let them do what they want.

Having said all that, I DO think there should be something for the guests to eat before midnight. Not everyone is even going to stay that late, even if there is a ton of food.

True, the bride and groom are free to do as they please, but it sounds like a recipe for a lot of irritated and frustrated friends and family. If I went to that wedding, I would be surprised and unhappy about the situation. 7PM screams feed your guests. And favors are cheap, especially things like chocolates or mints. On the drinks, we didn't have any alcohol at ours. If I was getting married now (mid-30's, not early 20's), I'd serve alcohol, in moderation of course.

I've been to a LOT of weddings. I've been to ONE with a pay bar and was entirely embarrassed for the bride and her family. She's inviting guests, and should serve them what she can afford whether that's wine, beer, or a coffee/tea table set up - but IMO guests are not asked to pay for their beverages. Ever.

She needs to prioritize her expenses if she has a limited budget. Tighten up the guest list, and provide those guests from a shorter list with some food.

Skipping the favors....that's fine with me. There are ways to economize on flowers, ie using fewer blooms and more greens and the result can be stunning. But the guests must be given some consideration.

We were invited to a wedding that was really lovely a couple of years ago and executed on quite a limited budget.
Many of the candle holders, mirrors on which to put individual table centerpieces, little touches to make things pretty....all borrowed. It was a morning wedding with buffet breakfast, several dollars less per plate from the caterer.

I've been to weddings with no wedding cake, not a big deal to me. One that was especially nice was a cheesecake bar in place of the traditional cake....liked that one ;)

Just attended one "just like THAT"! Country, barn, burlap, / family prepped food, DJ, Red cowboy boots under lovely bride dress etc.etc. Travelled 1700 miles(one way) to do so.....and have not really shared how the whole event left me saddened. But.... it was the Brides' wedding.... I just hope (I really do) that it works out well for them. Five or 6 weeks ago.... and no thank you for cash donation as yet. (and sour grapes for and from me, bad Nanny) There! I said it. Finally. But it does not make me feel good.

I agree that $2000 for wedding photography is a REAL bargain around here. I remember when my son accompanied his then girlfriend to her sister's wedding in the boonies of Montana. They were doing the wedding themselves in a party barn friends were donating. I warned my son to roll up his sleeves and plan to spend the day moving tables and chairs and helping things happen. As it turned out, though she had hired a photographer, they asked him to take pictures too and the girlfriend provided her own nice camera. He had taken a photography class in high school 15 years earlier, so he seemed to understand more than most people how to take a good picture. We were all surprised when we saw all the pictures to discover that his were far better than the poor job the professional photographer did. I am glad for the bride's sake that he was there to shoot posed and candid wedding pictures.

I don't mind a rustic wedding. Went to one in a barn, burlap, straw bales, etc. Food was family prepared but very good. Wedding cake was piled cupcakes. Drinks were a choice of three pre-mixed drinks in mason jars, plus lemonade, iced tea, and coffee.

Music was a stereo set up running a playlist created by the bride and groom through an ipod. There was also a bit of live entertainment country style (a local fiddle player who I think was related somehow).

I thought it was awesome, cowboy boots under the wedding dress and all. Of course we brought a gift/money. That is what you do when you attend a wedding, in a formal country club or a back yard.

Dances.

I think it's sad what weddings have come to. I have been to five weddings in the last two years and each one was more of a show than a celebration of the joining of two hearts.

I don't know why people think guests need to be entertained. DJ-ing is big business now. Instead of someone coordinating the music, you now have the "DJ Johnny Show". At the last wedding, in addition to playing the music, the DJ kept up a steady monologue of what he considered humor, kept interrupting the music to make lewd remarks concerning the bride and groom, and gave us a play by play of what would be happening next. Just play the music!

Sure, the couple wants to have memories. But in their effort to outdo every other wedding they've been to, they are likely putting themselves or their families in debt that will surely last many years. And even if they can afford to have their wedding without going into debt, what really is the point of spending thousands upon thousands of dollars?

Nowadays we don't have weddings at a location or a place, we must have a "venue".

I have enjoyed myself more at weddings that were far more simple than the productions of late.

They often don't invite children because they don't want their production spoiled. IMO children and their antics have made some of the most me memorable moments at receptions.

I'm sorry, I could go on and on, but I won't. However, I truly do thinks it's a shame that a wedding is no longer a gathering of family and close friends coming together to witness a joining of two hearts and instead appears to be a competition to be biggest, best, most expensive event of the year!

Well said Donna.

Well said Donna.

I know there's wisdom in the advice to disengage...
but.

I think I'd have to suggest to the bride that "it's traditional" or "etiquette" or "gracious" to feed guests at an evening wedding...way before midnight.

What would I think? I'd think I was lucky to avoid having anything to do with this train wreck. Stay out of it -- planning, execution and fallout.

Her day, her way! Although I think not serving food is big no no. She's got a bit of time, so maybe she will change her mind. I agree with Sylvia, I would offer a suggestion. The bride appears to be sharing quite a bit with you, so maybe she wouldn't mind your thoughts.

I too agree that $2000 is a great price for the photographer. I've hosted 2 weddings for my kids in the past 4 years and we shopped around quite a bit, and I would have been quite happy with that price!

I've been to 7 weddings in the past couple of years and I am seeing a less extravagant trend. Most brides (thanks to pinterest) are finding more inexpensive and creative ways to achieve their dream. I see a lot more diy.

I used to be one of those people who thought anyone who spent thousands on a wedding was crazy...until I priced a wedding! The premium on anything wedding-related is just insane.

For example, it cost over $1,000 to book our officiant and 20 rental chairs for a 20 minute ceremony. My hair and makeup charged an extra $300 "wedding fee" just to show up at my house on top of the $700 hair and makeup. My pretty, non-designer dress was $1,200. My very pretty but basic flowers were $700. Photographer and videographer to record the day was nearly $5,000. That's just a fraction of our cost, and I didn't have anything elaborate like a DJ.

Of course there are cheaper alternatives but I don't feel like anything I did was unreasonable. I wanted to feel like a bride walking down the aisle instead of buying a regular white dress at Macy's. I wanted to be able to share our ceremony video with dear family that couldn't make it. I wanted grandma to have somewhere to sit, lol. I didn't want the hassle of trying to make it to two different salons before the wedding for hair and makeup to avoid the surcharge.

I am SHOCKED at the attitudes about a cash bar. Back in the day I was told the #1 rule for a successful wedding i.e NO DRUNKS, is no cash bar. Often a toast or short duration of champagne is provided--but a free bar--that is just STUPIDITY!
As far as the rest goes--e-invite--no food--she will not get people in FORMAL attire. It sounds like she should have set up a table in her back yard and called it a day. Costs for anything wedding related are so inflated there is no reason to even try and discuss "worth". My entire wedding didn't cost $2000 let alone the photographer. If you pay that much--you didn't shop well. We really need to stop these train wrecks. A blow out party for the sake of a party is crazy. They already had the honeymoon--that alone would keep me away.

Cash vs. open bar is also very regional. I wouldn't dream of having my guests pay for anything, including alcohol. We had a full open bar and almost everyone indulged but no one got drunk.

As for not shopping well for a photographer - you can find photography for cheaper than $2k, sure. But in my opinion, with few exceptions, photography is one of those art forms where you get what you pay for. I can definitely tell the difference between an average photographer and an exceptional one when it comes to wedding coverage. You can't re-capture a wedding once it's done.

I work at a college and am always surprised at how many people think that having a photography student shoot a wedding (for their portfolio) is a real dollar saver. I don't recommend it and I tell students NOT to do it. You get what you pay for...
And all the lovely things you paid for: dresses, hair, makeup, flowers, food, drink and guests will be gone in a day (ok, so the dress will stick around in a closet for decades). Photos should last a lifetime and into the next generations.
$2000 is not a high price.

I'm not sure that there's one norm that fits all locations, ages and faiths. In general, when I'm in a situation where I am listening to someone's plans, I try to let the information flow in one ear and out the other while smiling and nodding. It's not my shower/wedding/party/event so I don't think my opinion is needed. The planner clearly isn't asking for feedback; she just wants to share her excitement. It takes very little energy to be supportive and rejoice in her happiness.

Everyone is different is the understatement here. I do think photos are important but personally I wouldn't spend the bulk of my budget on them. Which she seems to be planning to do. We recently went through my Grandparents photos of all the kids wedding pics after they passed the common theme re wedding photos was that no one had looked at them for decades. Cash bars are not uncommon in my area and most people I know unless their parents are paying for the wedding go this route. As for favors I was assuming they were candy or food of some kind at least the weddings that I have gone to this is what they were. The notion that it is the brides day and she should have what ever she wants doesn't seem right. There is a spouse family friends, they should get to enjoy the day too. I clearly think differently then my co worker so it will be best to wish her well and keep my thoughts to my self and the KT of course :)

Ours was a very traditional afternoon church wedding with a large reception at the country club -- live music, open bar, canapes, dinner, wedding cake, dancing, toss the garter and bouquet, off to honeymoon while the band played on. The last guests left before midnight. No brawls ensued. LOL (There were no 'favors', but boxed pieces of the wedding cake were available for those who wanted them.)

We were early twenties. My mother paid for the whole thing. My DH paid for the honeymoon. My MIL paid for the rehearsal dinner and a second dinner reception at a hotel in another state when we returned from our honeymoon -- to introduce me to members of her family who had been unable to attend the wedding. We have still photos of the flower bedecked church and scenes from the reception. My engagement and wedding were announced in our local paper.

Then, that was just 'normal' for a young couple. People didn't 'do' destination weddings-- in barns or on mountaintops or on a tropical island. A few couples had a civil ceremony, honeymoon, reception afterwards. That was also the form for a second marriage. Women didn't do the whole shebang twice; for a second marriage you had a small ceremony and sent announcements.

Gifts were send to the bride *ahead of the wedding*. There was no 'showing' of wedding gifts. (Showers were given by friends of the couple, never by a relative. Shower gifts were small things. Wedding presents were more expensive -- the sterling, china and crystal I now use once in a blue moon!)

I agree that when you invite someone to something, you pay the freight, regardless of the event. This includes a wedding reception. Whether it is large or small is up to you.

She's getting an awesome deal on the photographer, but sometimes you do get what you pay for. I know a few that would charge $4500 for wedding photography. It's an all day job (follow the bridal party all day, pre wedding, wedding, reception) then go home and process the pictures--it's a lot of work.

I see no problem with family making meals for weddings. My husbands family does it quite often. My favourite wedding meal was pulled pork and oven roasted potatoes with home made dinner rolls. Saved the bride and groom a bundle of money.

When I got married, we used a JP and got married at my mother in laws back yard. Only the bridal party and immediate family had dinner in a restaurant, and everyone met back at the house for a fire pit party. We got married for under $1000 (including the JP, our clothes for the day which included our kids and my wedding dress, and dinner out) and 24 years later, we're still married.

I don't expect wedding favours (who does that anymore?).

How much one spends on their wedding is up to them. I specifically asked for no gifts when we got married as I had been away from home for 13 years at that point and didn't need or want anything. People feel they have to give a gift anyway.

I'm not a fan of e-vites. If you have a computer, print your own invites and RSVP note cards (there's a million templates online) and mail them out. I used my typewriter to do that 25 years ago. LOL It took FOREVER!

All in all, it's her wedding. She can do as she likes. In the end it doesn't have to affect anyone else. Also, I can't remember ever going to a wedding where the guests didn't pay for their booze. Other than a bottle of wine on the table to toast the bride and groom, we've always paid for our drinks.

ETA: also, the wedding is all about the bride and groom, and not what's in it for the guest. Just because you spend $ on a gift, doesn't mean they have to give you a gourmet dinner and a 'favour'. In my day, we went to weddings to be witnesses to a joyful event. We danced. We had fun. And we gave gifts. We didn't expect anything in return.

This post was edited by debby_ab on Fri, Nov 7, 14 at 8:19

'Just because you spend $ on a gift, doesn't mean they have to give you a gourmet dinner and a 'favour'.'

This reminds me of some of the stories on etiquettehell...
but they more often tell of brides & sometimes grooms demanding that each guest bring them a gift worth at least the price of the reception dinner!

I'm guessing open vs cash bar at a wedding is a regional thing. I have been to 40+ weddings in my lifetime and never once had a cash bar. I do not recall anyone being drunk or causing problems.

The only cash bars I encounter are at fundraisers were I also pay for my meal.

Yes, I guess it must be a regional thing. Here in New England, a cash bar is typical and expected. Nobody I know would think anything of it, and if there happened to be an open bar, we'd all look at each other with widened eyes and say "Wow!".

The champagne for the toast is gratis, and I'm tempted to say "of course". But I've not been to an open bar wedding or other occasion for a long, long time. And I don't think anything of it.

My DH is from New England so I am familiar with cash bars. His family thought they hit the lottery when we were married in PA many years ago. We had to keep reminding the family to quit tipping the bartenders because my parent's contract included a 20% gratuity. To each his own.

Some of these cost quotations/reports...

... sort of make my hair stand on end (what there is of it).

A thousand bucks for an officiant and a few chairs? Think I'd better look into becoming a (retreaded) clergyperson ... or a J.P.

Have you ever heard of anyone suggesting enclosing with the gift (especially if it's money) a (rather wry) note that ...

... should the wedding last less than five years ... that the participants owed the givers 20% per year refund? Or would you recommend ten and ten?

ole joyfuelled ... with a bit o' help from an occasional piece of wedding cake

I've never seen a cash bar at a wedding reception. I have seen NO bar, just wine and champagne passed, along with canapes.

Personally, I think wedding favors are silly. Just a piece of clutter that you have to drag home and then figure out what to do with.