Does your GS know how to swim? If not, get him lessons. It'll make it MUCH more safe for him to be alone with his fishing buddies.

Otherwise, if he doesn't want to learn to swim, tell him he can't go. Stick to your guns.

HTH,
Ellen

Ellen - yes, he does know how to swim. It would be wonderful if he could go with the other boys but I'm just not comfortable with it. He gets to go fishing once or twice a month but of course it isn't the same as going with your friends.

Our DS is also ten. We do not allow him to go near any water without adult supervision. He is a good swimmer.

I do not think you are being overprotective at all.

How safe is your neighborhood over all? If you don't have specific problems like gangs or severe drug issues than I say let him go as long as he's in a group.

In my opinion a normal ten year old with decent common sense is old enough to go to neighborhood park with his friends without a babysitter.

He needs to learn how to be aware and handle himself in his own neighborhood. Having buddies helps. Not having buddies won't help and will make him miserable at school.

If he's closer to eleven than 10 he's almost middle school age. In a short year or tow he'll need to learn how to get around by himself a bit more.

It does depend on the area and his level of common sense though. Give him the tools he needs and let him grow.

I have a 10 yr old, 13 yr old and 18 yr old..I trust my 10 and 13 yr old much farther than my 18 yr old..

I would let my 10 yr old go with friends and definitely with his 13 yr old brother..

Maybe you should go with him and the boys once or twice..bring a book and a blanket and "watch" from a far...

Then decide from there.

Another thing you might consider is getting him one of those cell phones that allow kids to call just 4 or 5 people. That way you and he could stay in touch while he stretching his wings.

I tend to agree with wildchild, but have him bring a cell phone.

BUT, my kids are not even close to 10...ask me this same question in 6 years. My answer may be different. LOL

The area is very safe. And you have to have a key to get into the park. But, there -is- access by water.

I'm still listening!

Is he an outgoing, largish, 10 year old who gets along well with others, or is he a physically smaller, shy youngster? I think that would have some bearing on how well he can take care of himself.

Like Terri suggested, go along a time or two, unless doing that would "embarress" him

I understand your feelings also.

Sue

If she brings juice boxes and cookies...she'll be welcomed..

My 10 and 13 yr old still ADORE their grandma..they like doing things with her..the 10 yr old the most..

I think it's a prime opportunity to let him make some decisions and see how he handles them.

I am going to go out on a limb here and say let him go. Never alone but with at least one other friend.
Fishing is such a great hobby, and he should be encouraged to do things that are good for him.
In a few years you may have more to worry about, but right now, I say let him spread his wings. In fact, buy him a new rod and reel.

Trin

I sense your main concern is the water...not the kids, or the neighborhood or the fact that he is away from you.

I'm with you...but I'm overprotective when it comes to water. Accidents happen...I can deal with a cut knee, concussion, or a broken arm...but a fall or accident around water can be deadly. A cell phone probably won't help that.

Do you leave him alone otherwise? Does he babysit himself in the safety of your own home (with or without his friends there)? Then why would you leave him without adult supervision around water?

I wouldn't. Maybe I was a little overprotective, but my kids weren't allowed on or at the water without adult supervision until they were a few years older then that. It's not so much a matter of whether they are responsible enough as whether an accident might happen and someone ends up drowned. I also embarrassed my kids by insisting they wear life vests when on or at the lakeside. They are 28 and 31 years old now and they did grow up reasonable normal so I don't think I did them too much harm :-)

Well, one of the reasons my GS is living with me is because his mother would not/did not supervise him at all. He has pretty much come and gone as he pleased for several years. Although he is very self-sufficient, I'm not sure that being allowed around the water unsupervised is wise.

terri - unfortunately, I am not the adored grandma. GS has had a very difficult time adjusting to homelife with rules. I don't mind being the "mean" grandma, but I do want to be fair.

trin - his other G'ma bought him a new rod and reel just a few days before her car accident, if you remember seeing that post. She took him fishing the evening before. His dad took him sunday. Gramps took him a couple weeks ago and my other son took him around the same time. But like I said, it's not the same as fishing with your buddies. :)

carla - yes, it's the water. About 20 years ago, a grown man making a stupid decision broke his neck when diving off that same pier.

For me this is all about the water, not about the safety of the area from "dangerous" humans. 4ft of water is enough to drown a kid. Your kid might be able to swim, but can all the other kids swim? If one of the non-swimmers falls in, will your kid risk his own life to save his buddy? Are these kids going to dare each other to jump/dive off the pier? Or decide to use their fishing poles as fencing swords and accidentally knock someone into the water? Ten year old boys can get themselves in a mess of trouble, quite quickly.

Excellent points!

There are countless ways to get injured or killed other than being around water.

Maybe it's because I grew up around water but I worried far more about my kids when they were out on their bikes then I was when they were swimming with friends.

We all have our fears. I don't like the open wells of the rapid transit system (like a subway) but in many parts of the country kids your GS's age ride them every day.

City kids, country kids and suburban kids face all kinds of potential dangers every day. The best we can do is prepare them well and let them practice their independence while still under our wings.

Look at what country kids survive...open ponds, bulls and loaded firearms in the house.

City kids learn to navigate transit systems, scam artists and how to avoid gangs and what neighborhoods to bypass.

Suburban kids are the least lucky of all sometimes. They are often so sheltered they become a mark for everyone once they go out on their own. Or they are latchkey kids who come home to an empty house every day with no supervision at all.

I understand your concern and overprotectiveness. That's not out of the ordinary. But unless there's something here I don't know, I'm not with you on this. 10 yo raised properly shouldn't need a watchdog, especially in relatively safe environments. It's a good time for them to learn a lot of things.

First, I'd probably give an FRS radio and have him keep in contact with you to keep you informed and more comfortable. Cell phone (prepaids are cheap) are an alternative but I'm not sure I like 10 year olds having cell phones. Tell them to give you a call when they're ready and you'll bring down some sandwiches and beverages. Bring them down, ask them how it's going, don't loiter obviously but you could find a discreet spot and watch a bit to set your mind at ease.

How much does he know about fishing? Is he safe with hooks and gear? I'd assume he is and unless there's an issue there it supports him going.

Fishing is a good, wholesome, cheap, entertaining and educational sport. You can learn a lot from nature.

Teaching him to be afraid of water is a bad thing and will haunt him the rest of his life. I know people who were overprotected in the same way and it's a problem.

Assuming the flow of the river isn't extreme, again it supports it.

Wildchild brought up a lot of points I was thinking. Good points.

Also with other people around a lot, that supports it too. It also sounds like you trust the kids he would accompany. He sounds like a responsible kid. I just don't see the extreme danger here, that wouldn't be comparable in most other situations. I can just imagine the look on his face bringing you a fish he caught with his friends!

I lived near lakes and would go with friends. I spent a lot of time near water so I learned water safety early on. Then again I was raised a bit differently than *some* kids are raised these days but it sounds like there's not these issues with him.

Compared to playing on the highways, no doubt in my mind. What would set your mind more at ease? Methinks that's the big question here.

terri pacnw said it best. It's not so much the age of the child but the individual child. I let my ten year old daughter babysit for me (generally we were out but in the neighborhood.) When my other daughter was ten I wouldn't dream of letting her in charge. Not even when she was thirteen. Each child matures at a different rate. You know your GS better than anyone here. When my son was ten, I use to drive him to a pond nearby, drop him off and let him fish for several hours. It just depends on the individual child.

Many excellent points have been made on both sides.

I would have to side with letting him go. You mention that he is self-sufficient and use to being on his own. By letting him go you demonstrate your trust in his judgement. That could be very significant in his eyes. My parents trusted me with a lot of responsibility at a young age and it was always a boost to my self-esteem to have them come home and I'd have all my chores done. ( I grew up on a farm with a lake and they started leaving me home by myself when I was seven. I suppose now that would be considered child abandonement. But, then my teachers always said I was mature beyond my age.)

Ron

I would let him go--w/ a cell phone. You will lay the rules down to him, and he'll be so overjoyed to get to go that chances are, he'll obey your rules. It would be a great way for him to make friends, and that's always a good thing.

It would be good for him to be allowed to go....if he knows you trust him to take care of himself he will live up to that trust.
Keeping him too close doesn't help him develop his sense of self.
I know it is worrisome.
Let us know your decision, please.

Having raised two boys who LOVED to fish I know exactly what you are going through. I think that if he knows how to swim you might consider letting him go. I would also let him know that he will be checked up on! Let me go and then go see for yourself. If there is horseplay anywhere on that pier, off he comes. At 10 he does need to earn some trust. As long as he can swim! How close is this fishing place to the house? Is is easy for you to pop in when ever?

Trish

I think even so, Terri has an excellent idea. Tell him, you really like to think he is old enough, but you aren't. Take her suggestion on juice and snacks, and a blanket and book.

Set up nearby, and read and observe. Then, at some point saunder over, and offer the snacks.

After you do this a couple of times you both will know how things go, and how to proceed from there.

Moni

I am in the camp of letting him go. If it is a relatively safe area other than the water and you like and have met his friends and their parents.
He is the perfect age to start learning about trust. I would sit down and tell him what your expectations are: absolutely no getting in the water for any reason...come home for lunch....no where else but the pier...must be with another friend at all times...etc. Make it a written contract to refer to if you think it might be needed.
I used to tell my step daughter trust is freely given...breaking my trust is your choice... and comes with severe consequences. And then trust must be earned...Rules/laws are part of life.
A child with a troubled past needs to know someone cares about his wellbeing, but also trusts him.

I say skip the cell phone...give a him a watch and some rules.

With water only 4 ft deep, it is a hazard, but not the main one. The major hazards are: boys horsing around, and errant fish hooks. It all depends on the fishing style employed. The fish hook hazard is not as great with cane pole style where the hook is swung in front of the caster and gently laid into the water. The real danger casting. 10 yr old boys do not watch behind themselves and some may sidearm cast instead of overhead. A lure with a treble hook can dig in deeply. My fear would be someone getting hooked in a vital spot like an eye or nose. 10 yrs old casting needs supervision. Cane pole fishing, maybe not after a period of learning. I, as a 10 yr old (once a long time ago), did my share of dipping a hook in a creek and river that were nearby our farm. The sport gets boring after awhile and boys look for other things to do.

However, being able to swim is a good idea when around water. It just make good sense.

When there is only one or two boys, things remain calm, but get a group together and pushing and shoving will occur. Someone's gonna get wet.

I gotta chime in here again. I don't think moonie has a problem with trusting him, letting him grow up or him being independant... it's the water...and I know many people grew up around water everyday and they were safe. The fact is, though, this kid hasn't been around that pond, so throwing him in that circumstance may not be all that safe for him. Even if she gives him rules, she may miss an important one that she didn't know had to exist for his safety. It's like putting a country kid in gang teritory...the city kids may know how to handle it, but a country kid may not, even if he's mature, and even if you give him instructions and trust him -it may not be safe for him.

You don't throw a kid in a possibly unsafe environment to gain trust and maturity. Real maturity would be a child understanding that maybe this isn't a safe activity for him to engage in without an adult.

I would consider going with him for a few times if you can. You can see what kind of things may or may not happen and see if you are comfortable with things enough to let him go on his own. These kids are 10, not 15. You're really not going to embarass him to the point of no return. Act like you want to go fishing to or something.

Around here, some parents go to the pool with their kids, some don't, some ride bikes with their kids, some don't, some let them walk a mile to school, some don't. One mom doesn't like the kids playing football in the park alone so she goes and watches - no one cares. I doubt you would stick out like a sore thumb if it's his first time with them. If the kids are mature enough to be going there, they should be mature enough to handle you being there.

Not to step on anyone toes...but if he falls in water and can't swim..what good will a cell phone do him.

Better safe than sorry.

I know what I would do...but I've never had to work and always had time to do what I wanted...I would take a book and go along...but give him space to his friends.

patti

I just ask my grandson what his mom would do. He said she would say no.

But I have to say...I was thinking 4 feet would be over his head...My grandson is 10 and he says he is 5 foot tall...If your grandson is that tall they should be able to just stand up...unless of course he'd hit his head on the dock or something.

We're having sort of the same issue with my 10 yo ds. My answer is no. My kids just got finished with a round of swimming lesson so swimming isn't the real issue. The ponds around here slope at the edges instead of dropping off. We also have other issues that contribute to my answer such as a lot of people driving through the neighborhood that don't live here and the fact that I don't know the other kids.

I would discuss water safety with him, whether you let him go or not. He might decide to sneak off one day, or he might be at a friend's house and go with them without your knowledge.

When my son was a Boy Scout of maybe 11 he and his buddies were on a winter camp-out skipping stones on a lake. One of the boys fell in and the slope was too steep for him to get back up. The water was cold and it was hard for the boy to keep treading water. Another boy jumped in to help.

One quick-thinking boy had the presence of mind to find a long stick and hold it out, and the second boy had enough strength to grab it and be pulled up.

So I'd definitely discuss with my grandson 1) never to go alone but always with a buddy 2) how hard it is to swim or treat water when the water is cold 3) how easy it would be to drown if he jumped in to save someone (how drowning people will grab the other person and push them under) 4) hold a pole out rather than jump in to help someone.

If you live so close to a pond, I would take my grandson to a pool or something and help him learn what to do if someone is drowning and grabbing him - the way lifeguards are trained. There's no telling when the boys may go swimming in the pond without permission.

Like jemdandy I'd be more worried about the fishhook in the eye. But my kids swam like dolphins from the time they were little.

A cell phone would be great for the boys to have down there in case someone did get in trouble - one of them could call 911.

"I was thinking 4 feet would be over his head...My grandson is 10 and he says he is 5 foot tall...If your grandson is that tall they should be able to just stand up...unless of course he'd hit his head on the dock or something."

It's the "or something" that can be a problem. A kid (or an adult) can suddenly find themself under water and panic. The thought of standing up doesn't enter their head at all. Ask me how I know. Yeah, when I was a kid I was sitting on the edge of the pool at the Officers' Club on base. My legs were dangling in the water. All of a sudden I was pushed in by someone who had silently come up behind me. I was caught off guard and started to panic and gulp water. All I could see were the legs of the other people in the pool. It wasn't until I heard my dad's voice telling me to stand up.... If I'd been on a fishing dock with a bunch of other kids, I probably wouldn't be here now.

My first thought was to let him go, but on second thought you said it was a river. Rivers have current and undertow and even a good swimmer can be swept away. A bunch of 10 year olds are going to goof off, maybe no one will fall into the water or get hurt... but then again.

Jemdandy had a good point too about children casting rods. We live on a lake and even I am surprised by the number of times a hook hits someone else. My adult BIL got a hook caught deep in his palm and had to go to the emergency room.

I agree with the others that say to go along and sit a short distance away.

SO many things can go wrong. I don't think I would let my 14 year old, even that he is an avid fisherman,and been around water all his life. If something happnened, I would never forgive myself. Things can happend so quickly and unexpectedly, I would not take the risk.

I would let him go. If he doesn't return home at the time you tell him, then he would lose the privilege of going.

After reading some of these posts, I'm curious what you would do "if something happened". You're reading a book 200 feet away, just how fast can you move? And many have suggested they can't handle water, it's just a curiosity.

Cane poles vs rod & reel. If you're using a bobber, what's the difference? Actually there is a difference in that a cane pole has the line out and not reeled in so it's flying all over whereas a rod & reel is closer to the pole, plus the pole itself is shorter. If you're not using a bobber, then a rod & reel would likely have the advantage from my experience. Cane poles are long and more likely to hit someone, both the rod and the uncontrolled line than a rod & reel. I think you're confusing a cane pole with a drop line.

Many things can go wrong, yes. That's life. How do you protect people from every inconceivable possibility? You can't. This is where common sense comes in. Or you lock the kids in the basement. Nobody's suggesting throwing a kid into an unsafe situation, to challenge gangs or otherwise to test him. That's just plain silly.

One word... WOW!

After reading some of these posts, I'm curious what you would do "if something happened"

Great point Cynic. I love reading your posts whether I agree with them or not. (I mostly agree). It's nice to have someone on here who has a pragmatic viewpoint rather than an emotional one.

This is a bit off topic but my DS once asked me to drop him off at the hospital a distance from where I live while he had knee surgery. I did and then hung out in town while I waited to pick him up. He said he's call me once he was either in recovery or have a nurse call me.

You wouldn't believe how many people were just flabbergasted that I wasn't in the waiting room the whole time. What if something happened? What if they had complications. What if God forbid he died under the knife? How could I just go on like nothing was happening? The implication was that if I was a good mom I would be holding vigil. of course my DH and DD should have taken off work to keep vigil too. We're a cold-hearted family ,we are.

Well duh. I'm not a surgeon. I'm not a nurse. I'm not anyone other than someone who would be in the way. But being in the way wouldn't be an issue because I wouldn't be told anything until after the fact.

Yeah Like I'm sure they would come running out of the ER to get me if something went bad. "Go get the mom, we're losing him!" "Clear" Riiiggght. Sure that's the way it works.

Sometimes you just have to let things go and hope for the best. It's not always in your hands.

Parents never stop worrying about their kids. Not even when the kids get to the age where they start to worry about us.
But you can't let the fears and worry take hold to the point where the child isn't allowed to grow.

You know the child. You know his friends. If it does not feel right to you it isn't. Ten year olds do not always make the best decisions but you have to live with the consequence of yours. ...no matter what you decide.