Long-term lurker on these forums, finally joining the fray! After a year long process, complete with immense sticker shock and a total redesign, I am about to start my kitchen renovation - it will be really exciting to finally get the kitchen I've always wanted. I am struggling with a couple of my appliance decisions (range and fridge) and am hoping that some of the Gardenwebbers out there can lend a hand, as from what I can tell some others have had to make similar decisions. Needs - I bake and cook a lot so both the cooktop and oven are important to me; I've decided to indulge in dual fuel since I have really liked having an electric oven (the only thing about my current range that I like!) It's only me and my yellow lab, so I don't need a big fridge, and I don't want water in the door or a water dispenser. And I'm not really concerned about being matchy-matchy, though the appliances will be on the same cabinet run with about a 20" cab in between. So...after the frugal Mainer in me dropped the fantasy of the Wolf range, I've come up with the following set of options (in order of preference, though this seems to change daily): Bosch Integra 700 slide-in dual fuel range (the higher end "pro style") with Kitchen Aid Architect II 19.7 cf fridge, or possibly the LG 20.7 cf fridge. This range would be my no-brainer first choice EXCEPT that when I actually saw it I was taken aback by how high the grates seemed - a good 2" taller than the others in the store. I'd like to think that when it's actually in my house and installed I won't ever think about the grate height again, but the nightmare option is that I end up kicking myself about it every day. I would love to hear from anyone who has this range and maybe struggled with this question - do you even notice the height of the grates now? One salesman also mentioned the much-documented problem with the knobs (which seems to have been resolved, though not with metal knobs) and that one customer had reported that the labels on front had melted off (first time I have heard that one). Both fridges seem to get good reviews and I'd be happy with either though the KA seems a little dated - those LED lights in the LG are seductive! Electrolux wave-touch slide-in dual fuel range and Electrolux FD fridge (entry level version with no water and ice in front, and no water dispenser). Beautiful appliances but my personal preference would be a simpler control panel like the Bosch. A little high tech looking for my traditional kitchen (but they are so gorgeous that I'm not sure that is really an issue). I'm also concerned about reliability (though I will be buying from a dealer with a good service department) and about the relatively small oven size (but those rollout grates could be worth the size sacrifice!). Kitchen Aid Architect II slide-in dual fuel range and 19.7 cf fridge (or possibly the LG). This will be the most economical package, but from what I can tell KA ranges aren't universally loved. The oven racks feel a little flimsy. GE Cafe dual fuel slide-in range and fridge - I like the looks of the range but was somewhat taken aback when I was checking it out at the appliance store and another customer was in to try to exchange hers because the oven fan was so loud. Build does seem a little flimsy compared with the Bosch and Electrolux. Fridge seems to have mixed reviews. These packages are all close enough in price that I don't really see that as a factor - I just want to make the best decision I can. Chime in please, especially those of you who actually own and use these appliances!

I'm reading this with interest - I grew up in a household w/11 people (9 children, 2 parents, DH & I now have 7 children between us & 2 grandchildren - For some odd reason I am extermely sensitive to noise. We did an entire home renovation 2.5 yrs ago and I was adamant about noise buffering/lowering solutions to every application. Our home is plaster walls (which provide excellent sound deadening)& we lost the largest ceiling (LR) so I came up w/a soundproofing solution for the GC who applied the materials. If you live in a home built after 1950 or so - and it is sheetrock - noise travels quite readily through sheetrocked walls, moreso through the joists the sheetrock is applied to. PVC pipe which replaced that nice fat old black pipe which was thicker & quieter. If flooring is "floating" it is more likely to increase the noise in the house - A material used prior to flooring being installed is MLV (Mass loaded Vinyl) 1/8" thick comes in large roll like rolled flooring. I used that on the ceiling in my basement renovation, after applying mineral wool between the joists - then I applied an acoustical tile - I know it sounds overkill - but my dream is that will eventually be the home theatre. I'm shocked at the amt of $$$ people pour into systems, wiring, LCDS, audio without doing anything to improve the sound quality in the room. Sorry to ramble on - My point really is to please do your research before deciding on anything or you will be throwing good $ down the drain. What was your home like prior to the flooring? When was it built, how long have you lived there etc... Below is link to an excellent site/Company (no I'm not affliated, they helped me though) with great detail on soundproofing - you can pick up the phone & get great advice Good luck Here is a link that might be useful: soundproofing

Ok, so I just re-measured to be sure. I should have pointed out that the 11' x 9' did not account for the hallway closet that intrudes on the space. So footballmom, you are right. Because of the closet, functionally I guess the room is a lot smaller, as the closet takes up space next to the dishwasher. So here are the more specific dimensions; - Long wall with range in the middle: 140" (currently about 54" to left of range and 56" to right) - Sink/pass-through wall (up to closet): 87" - Window wall: 115" - Wall where fridge is now (up to doorway): 60" Note that the window isn't centered, so there's only 23 3/4" on the right side of it, but 37 3/4" on the left. This is why the fridge sticks out beyond the window where it is. Part of the reason we were thinking of "regular-sized" appliances is resale. Not that we are planning on selling soon, but are trying to take into consideration what potential buyers would want. Also I wonder whether smaller appliances might actually make the room seem smaller by association? Maybe not I will definitely give the idea of a smaller fridge and DW some more thought. 3" of space next to the fridge is do-able. I think that this would only allow opening the door to 90 degrees -- I would be able to pull the right crisper drawer out enough to reach the contents completely, but not quite enough to remove the crisper drawer. I don't think this would bother me. Would it bother other people? Buehl, what do you think? The OTR is vented to the outside (that wall is an exterior wall). Jillypie, I don't think I would have room for a fridge where the D/W/ is now. Bmorepanic, we don't have a basement, just a crawlspace. We had toyed with the idea of moving the sink and making an opening through the passthrough, but it would probably be too costly. No heating in that closet, just a million coats and shoes and an electrical box. I'm interested in the idea of running cabs under the window, but then still have the problem of where to put the fridge. In one way, I do like the idea of the fridge on the range wall, as this would help to visually break up the cabinets on that wall - esp if we get a nice-looking ss one. Divamum, I very much appreciate your Sunday morning musings :) I agree that the kitchen should be a place to live rather than just cook. I'm thinking that maybe if we open up the pass-through wider as well as taller (ie above dishwasher), then maybe we could put a couple of bar stools up to the counter there. There's not a whole lot of space in the DR, but maybe just enough? Kitchenkelly, we are planning to go crazy with lighting too :) I really like the idea of pendant lights over the sink area. Definitely undercab lighting. Hmmm a sconce is an interesting idea maybe I can find a place to put one of those Seems like everyone is in agreement that cabs should all go to ceiling in this space and not be varied heights. Anybody disagree? A couple of KDs (I'm still deciding which KD to go with) have suggested leaving a gap at the top and putting lights up there to flood the ceiling with light and make the tops of the cabinets "glow". One of them had suggested having only the cabs above the range go to ceiling. What do you think of this idea? Thank you all so much! I will try to post some pics soon of different options. Meanwhile, please keep those ideas coming!

When the Prep & Cooking Zones are so far apart like this, a prep sink is usually needed to make the zones work efficiently...sometimes just to function at all! Right now, you have to cross a very wide aisle (> 7 feet) and through a very busy thoroughfare just to empty a pot of boiling water. Not very safe! Nor very functional! The reason NewbieRemodeler's layout works so well is b/c she has the Prep & Cooking Zones together (the prep sink on the peninsula) and her Cooking Zone and range are protected from traffic (again, the peninsula does this). Also, notice how much workspace she has in the right places...around the range and on the peninsula. Your workspace is very spread out and you do have a lot of it, but it's not in the right places. Ideally: Prep Zone...works best when it contains a water source and is next to or across an aisle no more than 48" wide or so from the Cooking Zone. Trash & recycle bins should also be in the Prep Zone. If across from the Cooking Zone, the aisle b/w them should not be a busy aisle (i.e., no through-traffic and very little other kitchen traffic). Cooking Zone...works best when next to/across from the Prep Zone (see Prep Zone). It's also nice to have a water source nearby as well as trash & recycling nearby. Cleanup Zone...works best when separated from the Prep & Cooking Zones. This can be on the opposite side of the sink in a one-sink kitchen from the Prep Zone or it could be in a completely separate location (the latter usually only works well if you have two sinks). Obviously, it also needs a water source and the DW. Right now, you have the Prep & Cooking Zones separated by an aisle more than 7 feet wide...much too far. While having the Prep & Cleanup Zones together isn't bad (see above), in this situation it doesn't really work. Here's one idea that might work. I have other ideas, but I don't have time right now to draw them up...I'll work on it some more later, if you like. [Let me know.] One idea, btw, is to switch the table and kitchen...but that depends on how high off the floor the bay window is as well as how flexible you are with water, etc. Are you open to a banquette? A banquette might solve some problems regardless of the table/kitchen configuration. So, how high off the floor is the bay window? .. [You could reduce the prep sink to an 18" sink base and gain those 6" for either an 18" cabinet on the left or a 21" cabinet on the right.]