I have the previous model of the GE Cafe dual fuel range. I have used it both in convection and regular bake mode, and did not notice a difference in fan noise. The fan runs continuously regardless of whether it's in convection or not. I don't find the fan noise to be particular bothersome. In fact, I never even really noticed it until I started seeing people posting about it here. Now I do notice it, but mostly as background white noise that I don't really hear until it shuts off, and then I notice it is suddenly very quiet in my kitchen. Everyone has a different threshold for noise. I have a busy household with four kids, so maybe I tolerate more noise than others? The fan does not seem to be any louder than the exhaust fan I have (I don't have a range hood yet - current have an OTR microwave that eventually will be replaced with a hood). I wish I could comment on the length of time to preheat the bottom oven but I actually haven't even used it yet (I've had my range for about 9-10 months but did not host any holiday meals here this year so haven't needed it). Right now it is storage for my cookie sheets and baking pans. If I remember, I'll try to test it out tomorrow for you. I've been very happy with my range. I was able to see it in action before I ordered it because one of my good friends has the AG version (same older model). I'm bummed I didn't wait another year and get the new model with the 20K burner, but mine suits me just fine w/o.

Hello again. I am a member of the Manhattan NKBA as such monogram invited me and about 12 others to their experience center in Louisville last year for a few days. This was not to sell their products but to show us how to use them and also to pick our brains as to what consumers want and what they can do better. One part consisted of us going around a room with 4 pro ranges ( 48" models) and clipboards simply comparing the 4 and features. The Thermador simply had amazing quality and everything felt great and solid. Things like opening the door etc. We also had specs and the burner output on Thermadors star burners is the best in the industry. Knobs feel good, there is great lighting and it is all easy to read. We were told that WOLF has amazing customer service. I am aware of that. Their range was the worst. Compared to the others it actually felt " cheap" borderline rickety and I can not believe I am saying this as I always loved the way it looked.. The GE had a lot of great features. Like racks that can stay inside the oven when self cleaning. I do believe I remember all the others have to be removed as they are plated and can not withstand the very high heat.Clean by hand this means. The oven capacity was also very large. Top is easy to move pots and pans around on as the entire cast iron surface is large and level. You can flip the iron around and have a moulded surfaces for wok pans... The parts are pieced together and can easily fit into a dishwasher. The knobs are easy to turn and read. Soft closing door. Great burner output. Easy to install with feet that have huge wheels under them. Can be leveled easily. The list just went on..... Still our main criticism was that it looked " boring" LOL. Not much personality. It's still pricey and it all checked out but a secret part of me wanted those red knobs... I know it's probably a sick personality flaw of mine... Like lusting after Loubotin shoes. We all know they hurt but want them anyways... After all this I just ordered a 30" dual fuel monogram for my place in New York. I will get it next week. I have an older Viking in Florida and all the lettering on the front has come off simply by cleaning it! I like the Viking but that alone is a shame. No one seems to sells those decals to have them stuck back on!!! I have no idea how I am cooking on that thing. I believe VIKING was sold last year and its been upgraded since then but I have no personal experience with the newer models so far.

NEWS from CPSC U.S. Consumer Product Safety Commission Office of Information and Public Affairs Washington, DC 20207 FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE April 8, 2009 Release #09-189 Firm's Recall Hotline: (888) 352-9764 CPSC Recall Hotline: (800) 638-2772 CPSC Media Contact: (301) 504-7908 GE Media Contact: (888) 240-2749 GE Recalls Ranges Due to Fire and Burn Hazards WASHINGTON, D.C. - The U.S. Consumer Product Safety Commission, in cooperation with the firm named below, today announced a voluntary recall of the following consumer product. Consumers should stop using recalled products immediately unless otherwise instructed. Name of Product: GE Profile(tm) Freestanding Dual Fuel Ranges Units: About 28,000 Manufacturer: GE Consumer & Industrial, of Louisville, Ky. Hazard: The wiring in the rear of the range can overheat, posing a fire and burn hazard to consumers. Incidents/Injuries: GE is aware of 47 reports of overheated wiring, including 33 reports of wiring that caught fire. Of these, one fire caused structural damage to the home and there have been 14 reports of minor property damage. No injuries have been reported. Description: This recall involves GE Profile 30' Freestanding Duel Fuel ranges. The ranges were sold in white, black, bisque and stainless steel. The following model and serial numbers can be found on the left inside corner of the bottom drawer. Brand / Model Number Begins With / Serial Number Begins With GE Profile / J2B900 / LD, MD, RD, SD, TD, VD, ZD, AF, DF, FF, GF, HF, LF, MF GE Profile / J2B915 / MF, RF, SF, TF, VF, ZF, AG, DG, FG, GG, HG, LG, MG, RG, SG, TG, VG, ZG Sold at: Department and appliance stores nationwide from June 2002 through December 2005 for between $1,300 and $2,000. Manufactured in: Mexico Remedy: Consumers should immediately stop using the oven and contact GE for a free repair. Consumers can continue to use the cooktop burners. Consumer Contact: For additional information, contact GE toll-free at (888) 352-9764 between 8 a.m. and 8 p.m. Monday through Friday, and between 9 a.m. and 3 p.m. Saturday ET, or visit the firm's Web site at www.geappliances.com To see this recall on CPSC's web site, including pictures of the recalled products, please go to: http://www.cpsc.gov/cpscpub/prerel/prhtml09/09189.html Here is a link that might be useful: CPSC Website

"Commercial bakeries use nothing but gas ovens." This is not true. If you are talking about bulk bakeries, they are more inclined to because it is often cheaper but they also have steam injectors to add humidity when needed. I know several specialty bakeries that use electric ovens. Many deck ovens in commercial kitchens are electric. I knew of a bakery that was called "the Electric Bakery". It really depends a lot on what they are baking. I know a baker that has specialty ovens for pies. This really has nothing to do with home ovens because they are a different breed anyway as they are expected to do many different things. "Dual fuel is excessively expensive, and overly complex for no benefit in performance ." Performance is different things to different people. They have different needs so there is no one size fits all. If I were selling appliances, the first thing would be to assess that person's needs and make individualized recommendations based on those needs. I most likely would never recommend ranges to begin with unless there was a compelling reason like space or cost issues or even a preference for "looks" over cooks. Pick out each component because it meets individual needs in the best way possible. As far as cost, you can buy electric ovens with features that have high utility for less than some gas ovens with limited features. Electric ovens can be complex, but so are our home computers and cars these days. This is not necessarily a bad thing. These ovens can have features that many consider helpful in how they use their ovens. It takes a computer board to coordinate fans, heating elements and tight temperature control. I love being able to control the direction of heat and fan speed in my oven. I can have air movement slow or fast to facilitate browning or not if I am baking a cake. It has a lot greater range of temperature, with or without the fan than many ovens gas or electric that cost a lot more. There is a learning curve with these features especially with the many choices something like Gaggenau or Miele give you. The combi oven is the king of control of the cooking environment but not in a range yet. The other side of the coin is some ovens have this figured out and others, not so much, so you have to read as many reviews as you can. To minimize risk if you want these features, buy the longest service agreement that you can. They can be difficult to evaluate and compare because a feature named the same name in two different brands can mean two different things. Even the term "dual fuel", in most ovens it means gas burners and an electric oven but 5 Star when they say dual fuel means a gas oven and electric oven together in the same range. You have to decide what is a benefit and what is a burden? No one answer. "could you please explain why all gas is fine" "All gas is fine." I might agree with that statement depending on how you use your oven but that in no way means they are the same and it in many cases gas is not the best choice. Gas and electric ovens are constructed differently. Because you have combustion for your heat source, another difference, gas ovens are vented more to remove products of combustion including water, so those products of combustion and humidity from food move out of the oven and into the kitchen. That may be good or bad depending on where you live, but how is that significant to cooking? It is much more difficult to keep added steam in a gas oven if you are doing that for bread or adding a pan of water for cheesecake. Because there is more of an air current, in a gas oven, this removes more moisture from the surface of what you are cooking. This inhibits starch gelatinization during the first part of baking so inhibits rise and changes the appearance of what you are baking. On the other hand, because it evaporates moisture from the surface and allows it to heat more quickly, the Maillard and other browning chemical reactions take place more quickly. This is why meat, vegetables and even baked goods brown more quickly. Will you notice? A lot of people say they don't. I have baked in gas and electric ovens for over 50 years and I used to attribute differences in outcomes to different ovens rather than a difference in fuel but with the many books and websites that have come out on food science, you can see the rationale for the differences in outcome that cooks report in cooking/baking forums. It was kind of a "aha" moment to put these comments with the science. All of the information coming out challenges what used to be conventional wisdom and yet it might be hard to see if you are not baking the exact same recipe side by side. You do see the same observations cooks make repeatedly in terms of cooking on cooking and baking forums and people seem to notice the difference more coming from electric to gas but you do see the occasional comment about excess moisture in some electric ovens when they are coming from gas. Most advertising literature and websites about ovens actually say a gas oven provides moist heat and electric dry but they are only looking at the heat source and not the oven as a whole and the process of cooking which provides a lot of moisture to the oven chamber. Another difference is that there are more and more features being loaded into ovens now as noted above, mostly electric but sometimes gas too. Some electric ovens have added steam. Combi ovens are very useful in their ability to control humidity and really make the case for buying ovens separate from the range top instead of having to pick the priority of the burners or the oven. I am not a fan of the current trend of hiding the bake element in electric ovens. Sometimes with pies, you need that bottom element exposed. It used to be you could put a tray under the element to catch spills. If you put it on the bottom now, it will melt. Some other things to consider. gas broilers are of two types. There is the traditional gas broiler, but they are not very good. Many prostyle gas ovens have an infrared broiler. They are very hot and even, but can be small. They are great for a couple of steaks but not so much trays of appetizers or broiling larger amounts. How big is the oven? Do you want a quick preheat or need room for full commercial sheets? Look at the rack size for usable space and size top to bottom. What is the temperature range, lowest and highest? What are the increments that you can set your temperature? 25F or 5F? Ovens are not an easy choice these days but I think it helps at least some people to realize the differences so you can at least make a somewhat informed decision.