wow--i did it!! way cool, my kids will be SO proud of me,lol!

if it's too small hold ctrl while touching + and it will get bigger for you.

Here's the layout...you'll get more comments if it's embedded in the post.

I like the fireplace 'inglenook' and the overall layout, very much. I think you may have too many stools at the island, but that's an easy fix. What are you using the little sink for, by the inglenook?

The big windows, over the main sink are wonderful, too. The pantry isn't very large, but it has great details. Do you have more space, over by the desk area...with the fridge/freezer?

Also, have you thought about putting cabinets on each side of the washer/dryer? There might be enough room to slide out laundry baskets, which would be great storage. You only slide them out, when you're doing laundry, so the doors shouldn't be a problem. Just a thought...lovely plan :)

Seems like a huge improvement over prior ideas. I can't remember why you might want that lone sink, so am also curious.

Inglenook and fireplace.... COOL!!!

On the sink wall, I would sure run the upper cabinets straight over to the side walls and forget those diagonal cabs. Not attractive (especially when not connecting to an adjacent run of cabinets), hard to access because of the narrow opening, and too deep.... In my opinion, of course.

This kitchen completely confuses me but whatever... what is the top sink and area for?, what is the sink by the fireplace for?, and , (if I knew how to whisper here I would because i'm going to feel like an idiot when someone points it out but....) where is the DW?

If the top part of the kitchen is for another prep area, maybe include a couple of fridge drawers in that area.

ah, thankyou for your questions!! (and thankyou buehl!).
finally i have interested people (aka tko) to play with!

so, the dw goes next to the sink which faces the water--at noon on the plan. we so very rarely use it it's easy to forget!

we have a couple of differently-abled guys who live with us and we need to supervise handwashing many times during the day. that little sink by the inglenook is for them, so they can wash while we're getting meals togther and they can go through that doorway and sit at the table while we're watching. lol, or they cheat and don't use soap, or whatever!
that handwashing station should be big enough to also be a bev station.
and i really have 4' more or less there to build a beverage bar/handwashing station if we forgo the inglenook and place a sofa and coffee table in front of the fireplace. while i lov e the inglenook, the handwashing is more important and i think i'll also love a sofa in front of the fire too.
little fridge goes under that bar for cream, lemons; uppers will have mugs, cups;french press, electric kettle,in and on there.
to the left of the desk space is a fabulous 16x12 mudroom entry, my 12' sliding doors will be facing the water with patio for outside dining and the desk it's right in that right hand corner. dh will love having his stuff there, as the kitchen is his domain. he can work at his desk and look out at the water at the same time.
island is actually an old drafting table, no cab below. i see max of four stools myself.

dh will have his 'cockpit' between the drafting table, his vulcan range, his pot/prep sink and his fridge. he prefers to be in his space, and us out, so this plan accomadates us all.
that little window next to his fridge is our current front door entry---the kitchen is taking over the entry and the entire room is pushing out towards the water by 12'. this doubles the 24x11'6 kitchen we now have, moves the entry into the transition space in the living room, and gives me a new huge mud room right into the kitchen.
that tiny bath and laundry room are existing, we're saving that room altogther fortunately.

the extra fridge and freezer are across from his desk, for easy access for the rest of us and convenience.

mw and toaster oven to the right of his desk on that window/sink run, just across diagonally from that fridge and freezer for me to have my own lunch spot with mw and toaster oven for the guys.
that sink at noon btw, is mine for dishes from the dining room, which is just beyond the handwashing sink--through that doorway.
that pass-through cab will be a custom unit, so i can stack clean dishes there and set the table from the same cab without going from room to room.
i think i may do matching cab finishes on both the bev/handwashing cab and that pass-through, so entering that dining room will be flanked by matching finish cabs with differnt functions.
i see them as matching the finish of the pantry front, which will be modeled on that wonderful gustavian grey pantry shown here over the years. it's not going to be a deep pantry, but at 11'6 across i'll have a beautiful glass door facade and entry into it. the two windows in that space stay for natural light in there.
whew, so many details!
oh, and see that corner between his fridge and the pantry?
there's just enough room for my rocking chair, a tiny table and that wall will hold my antique oak and slate chalkboard!
we'll be able to comfortably seat almost a dozen people in there!

ok, next?!

Have you tried drawing the rocking chair and table in that corner by the pantry and fridge to scale on the plan? I'm concerned that if you're seated, especially, no one will be able to get by the corner of the inglenook.

I don't think you'll seat a dozen people in the kitchen, if that's what you're saying.

I hate to be a wet blanket, but in the kitchen I see an island big enough for 4, the inglenook for a snug 4, and maybe your chair.... for a total of 9... in 3 different places not facing each other. But maybe you're not looking for everyone to be able to relate to each other?

Will dh mind people seated at the island...so in his cockpit? Or will he do all his chopping between the sink and stove? I hope he's doing well.

How do you see the inglenook functioning in the kitchen?

The interrelationship between the island and the inglenook is the part I am having trouble with.

You might get a very tight six on the island if you clipped the corners and had one on each end, one on each diagonal and two on the long side, but I don't think it would be comfortable for long. Four is probably more realistic.

he's feeling well most of the time, thanks.
he's in a good remission, but having much pain post-op. probably has surgical adhesions, hopefully resolve-able without more surgery.
anyway, you are right, though with a couch and a chair or two around the fireplace, plus my rocker and four at the drafting table, and one at his desk, we'll fit a dozen if we really need to.
my rocker will be in front of the stationary glass display door on the left of the pantry entry, and should fit, but i'll double check to be sure. if not i'll place it in front of the fireplace instead.
i'm not determined to seat a dozen, but we seat exactly two now, and usually five of us are squeezed in there; so this is going to feel huge to us!

yes, that is not really an island, it's a drafting table which seats four comfortably.
the inglenook is probably going to be sacrificed in favor of a bigger bev/handwashing station. i really like a sofa and coffee table in front of the fire too, so it works.
i see myself sitting at the rocker or draft table while dh cooks or preps in his cockpit, while my guys hang in front of the fireplace with a cat or three waiting for dinner.
and in the mornings dh and i will have our coffee together in front of the fire.
when the grandkids are all here i see them climbing all over grandpa's table while he preps, and in front of the fireplace for story time and hot cocoa.
we all like to be in the same room, not necessarily interacting, but together.

Wow! I am no longer confused. You have obviously thought about your needs, both in terms of DH, your housemates and yourself. Well done and thinking about form at the same time. I cannot wait to see this finished.

Couple of thoughts: Not shown but probably easy to do is a landing space by the fridge/freezer across from DH desk.
You don't have a door shown for the pantry - if you are going to do one do a pocket door going to the right (or left if you are facing the pantry. It will clear up the area for your rocking chair and chalkboard. I'm with the others and concerned about space between DH's counter, his island, and the nook. What are the aisle measurements and how wide is the island? Looks like the whole kitchen is 18'6" - is that right?

hmm, i'll double check with the architect about those aisle widths, but i think they are 42".
the fireplace will have a raised hearth, i sort of see the couch or easy chairs pulled up close to set feet on it, if we don't have room for a coffee table.
it's a high tech easily regulated wood stove which looks like a working fireplace, so i'm told that we won't have to worry about getting too hot too often.

as far as the pantry entry, i may just leave the entry open for easy access. the counter against the back wall is a marble slab i've been saving for years and years.
it's only 19" which works well in that 3' depth, and i love being able to look in and see it.
since it's so narrow we'll use skirted shelving below for rarely used items.
the side walls will be single depth food storage with sliding doors and out in the mud room i have a huge antique ice chest which holds tons and tons.

btw, see those walls between the desk and the sink run and on the otherside, next to the extra fridge?
those are destined to be half walls, with old glass windows hanging above them between desk and counter, and fridge and counter. don't worry, they'll be fixed in place. since i don't really need to look through the glass to see the side of the fridge, i think that's where i'll stash pics and memories in the glass mullions.
this will help keep the rooms very open feeling and yet connected i hope.

i'm going to ask the architect to tweak that plan, label the aisle size, remove the inglenook and add the rest of the first floor so you can see how it all relates.
thankyou all so much for looking and commenting, i'll email her tomorrow, and will be making an appointment with the kd for next week to iron out the actual cabs.

Falling- It's such a beautiful space...and it's obvious you've planned everything out very carefully.

My only other suggestion...is the dining room doorway fixed? Could you move the doorway closer to the inglenook and incorporate your small sink and beverage center into the dishwashing space? This would allow you to keep the inglenook (which is a wonderful feature IMHO). The plan shows 4'10" for the inglenook and since most sofas are 3' to 3'6" deep...this would leave you very little space (about 16" to 22" between the front of the sofa and the hearth.

If that doesn't sound like a possibility, maybe leave the small sink and incorporate the beverage area in with the sink/dishwasher area?

All of your details, especially the pantry and half walls/windows between the kitchen and desk area, are so well planned...I look forward to seeing them. Your kitchen is going to be an inspiration for many of us...beautiful, but not like everyone else's space. Best of luck with the remodel :)

What an interesting space. You've put so much thought into making this space work for you.

The only thing I can add to the concerns of others besides aisle space and the ability to seat 12 people in there is that I would increase the space between prep sink and range. For me, 36" is not enough space, especially considering how huge the overall room is. I'd scoot the range "up" on the plan for more room. If your DH is fine with a space that small, then never mind!

Please hurry up and reno so I can see how this all turns out. ;)

You can have the 4 foot beverage station and the inglenook by rotating the handwashing sink 90 degrees and running the beverage station across the back of the inglenook wall.

You might want to raise the fireplace to around table height to improve visibility.

So, now the bummers. I'm saying these to try and help you end up with the best kitchen you possibly can have.

It's a pretty big fantasy that no one will ever go into the kitchen ref for anything. Salad greens, carrots, butter, eggs and possibly onions are examples. That in itself would be fine IF the ref was accessible without disturbing the chef. If your guys are small now, their interest in cooking may change with age. I would REALLY move the prep sink or the ref or both.

Also, having the pantry on the other side of the room, when you're planning breakfasts and lunches to be made/cooked at the cleanup area with the refs in the mudroom might not work out really well for the differently abled and is a pretty good sized distance to go to-and-fro a couple of times a day. If I'm doing this right 32 plus feet round trip to the pantry and maybe 20 on average to the mudroom ref. Also echoing the lack of landing space for the mudroom ref except for the desk area.

What I'm seeing for a simple tuna fish sandwich is -- ten feet to the ref, pile stuff on desk, take stuff ten feet back to kitchen counter, run 17 feet to the pantry, get some bread and ?onions?, back 17 feet to the counter, get some lettuce or tomato from where ever they are (kitchen ref?) make some sandwich, reverse and take everything back.

So, I'm encouraging you to think about whether this is a good enough answer for everyone's needs. It's a good answer for your spouse, but does that make it a good balance for everyone? Your answer can be yes, and that's fine.

i guess i should clarify; my 'guys' are adults with disabilities we care for in our home. they like to hang in the kitchen but not cook, though as the grandkids get older i can see them helping grandpa around the table someday.

dh's fridge is mainly for his cooking stuff, while the extra fridge near the desk is for sandwiches, leftovers, excess stuff i'm most likely to use for the guys. dh takes up a lot of room with his stuff, and we already operate with two jars of mayo, ketchup, milk, eggs etc with two fridges in two different rooms, but i am looking forward to less steps.

i plan on placing my toaster oven and mw on that sink run where the windows face the water, adjacent to the desk.
dh rarely uses those, while i do all the time.

i have thought about rotating that handwashing sink against the inglenook, but i worry that will mean big butts sticking out into the aisle while i'm bringing dishes to the table. we plate in the kitchen cuz family style is a free for all--our guys have little control about food--if they see it they eat it!
otoh, what if i made that bev/sink another pass through into the dining room? the guys could wash up in the dining room relatively out of the way, but still visible. would that be too weird?
unless--coffee/tea stuff in kitchen, and alcohol wet bar/sink in the dining room?
could that work? (no worries about booze, they are strictly milk and soda (ick) drinkers).

about raising the fireplace height, do you think much more than 14"? i'd like to see some pillows on that hearth for cats---we have four indoor cats atm!

the pantry is to be for canned goods and pots and pans, we are already used to almost all of our canned goods and larger pots and pans out beyond the entry in that laundry room, this actually makes things much closer to us.

lol, this is fun, sort of feels like defending my thesis!!!

i've asked my architect to double check those measurements and to send over the entire first floor plans so it makes more sense.
am going to set up a meeting with the kd to get her take and advice too.
thankyou so much for your observations and questions!!!

Falling- I hate to say this, because I like the style of the pantry...but if you're going to take out the inglenook and have the larger beverage center...I don't think you're going to have room for much seating.

Instead, have you ever considered having an L-shaped seating area, where the pantry is, in the plan? You could add another window in the middle and have a large sofa with an end table and a chair...maybe even an ottoman, instead of a coffee table. Or you could have two smaller sofas...even a small sectional, with an ottoman. Lots of comfy seating for the guys and/or the grandkids...and still a view of the fireplace. Maybe have your rocker by the fire? Just an idea :)

If you scoot the washer and dryer a little closer to the powder room, you could install drawers in that blind corner for laundry room storage...

I enjoyed looking at your plan and seeing the concrete results of your family's needs worked in so well.

Now, I'll segue into my wood-stove fire-safety spiel:

No matter how "high-tech" or "easily regulated" a woodstove is, it still will have some surfaces that are fiercely, even dangerously hot. You didn't describe the wood stove as a masonry heater, so I'll assume that it is some variety of cast iron/sheet metal even if it has some soapstone facing. What I write below applies to all of the above, except a true masonry heater.

We heat our upstate NY farmhouse entirely with wood so I have more than 40 years experience with them. I also have dozens of small burn scars on my hands and wrists from accidental contact with the stove while loading it. Woodstoves when properly running are so hot almost any contact will instantly burn some skin right off.

You mentioned that some members of your household are challeneged. Are you absolutely sure they will be able to appreciate the potential danger and protect themselves? I have had members of my household where that was not true, though I had thought so initially.

In addition to potential human contact, I have a cat at present that will jump up on to a burning woodstove (650F)- resulting in terrible burns on her pads. I have had dozens of cats living here (I do rescue fostering) and this is the only one who has done it (and more than once). Now we have to have the stoves "walled" off with exercise pen caging to keep her safe.

Finally, all woodstoves have minumum safe clearance distances to combustible materials (walls, wooden furniture, soft upholstery and books and papers) these must be observed or you risk starting a house fire. The manufacturer of your stove will have this info in the specs. While it is fine to draw up a chair closer to the stove while you are sitting there, and awake, you need to build in safe guards so that when the stove is burning any combustible material cannot be inadvertently left closer than the specs allow. It is easy to forget the requirements when busy with your day. Woodstoves do NOT turn on and off quickly, they often require hours to wind back down so whatever is used near them has to default to safe distances without needing too much second thought.

If you are thinking of having a hearth, but perhaps want to avoid some of the extreme temperature risks of a wood-burning appliance, then you might consider a stove or insert that burns wood pellets. The surface temps are generally much lower (all our cats fight to sleep on top of the pellet stove while it is burning) so it safer to be around. The wood pellets are easy and clean to move around (come in 40 lb bags), which is an improvement on the messiness of wood fuel. The chimney cleaning issues with pellet burners are less intense, etc. The only downside is that I believe all pellet burners require electrical power to run their fuel feed and combustion blowers, so they don't work in power outages. Many have very nice fire-viewing glass fronts.

Another option (though a good bit more expensive) is a masonry heater. These rely on massive amounts of stone warmed by short hot fires, perhaps only two per day. As a rule masonry heaters are completely safe to touch, sit on, etc. I'll add this as a teaser for your DH: some masonry heaters also come with wood-fired ovens for pizza, bread- making, etc. They do not require power to run, so during power outages can be counted on to function as your oven as well as heating the room. For some reason, wood-fire ovens are perennial man-pleasers; there's some atavistic draw to them, I think.

HTH,

L

Liriodendron, yours was an informative post. I mostly saw reference to a fireplace and not to a woodstove. They are different.

I grew up with an open fire. You will want to have glass doors on an openfire, and a blower or you will not get full use out of it. I am a little concerned about a sofa next to the fire: Keep those glass doors shut; sparks can and will fly out. That makes for the worst kind of slow, smoldering fire. Blowers typically mean you won't have as good of use if there's a power outage.

As another thought, my parents have a raised hearth that is in front of their fireplace and stretches around one side. It is a popular place to sit at their house anytime of year, fire or not. My mom would bean me if I posted pictures of her house on the Internet but suffice it to say it is a lovely focal point. I would feel better about putting the cat's cushions along the side hearth.

Also, I am not good at reading plans and we don't have elevations to look at. I don't see a place for wood storage, both the larger split wood and the kindling. My dad has it set up with a cabinet with doors on both sides. He loads it in to the back (where he can come in and out with his muddy shoes) and it can be taken out next to the fire place opening.

These ideas may be too late for your plans, so forgive me if so!

@Colorfast,

I share your concerns about clearances and convenient wood-storage space. The clearances, even for a fireplace, seemed very tight to me.

The OP described it in her text as:

"it's a high tech easily regulated wood stove which looks like a working fireplace, so i'm told that we won't have to worry about getting too hot too often.

Wood stoves get hot (that's the point, of course) but few people who haven't lived with them on a regular basis beforehand really appreciate how hot is HOT. At least not until you miscalculate slightly and are suddenly looking down at your own skin bubbling and charred just from touching the hot edge of a loading door for an instant.

No matter how high-tech, or easily regulated, you can never, ever, forget that it's live fire you've got penned up in that metal box. And given half a chance, it will eagerly leap out of the box and start chowing down on your house, and all, and everything within. It can do this either directly through the escape of coals or a spark, or indirectly through raising the temps of nearby surfaces enough to cause them to begin to burn on their own. All the fire needs is combustible materials (that's pretty much all the stuff in your house except for your cast iron skillets) and oxygen from room air.

I am a former volunteer firefighter and have "attended" more than a few devastating - and twice, fatal - house fires started by woodstoves so I always chime in about safety and clearances. Predictable and boring that it may be, if it alerts one person (especially a new wood burner) to a problem before it becomes a fire scene, I'll be content.

L.

thanks so much foir the reminders about fireplaces and woodstoves.

it's been three years since we took out our winter warm fireplace insert and we really miss burning wood. all of us have been raised around woodstoves and my guys are very high functioning thankgoodness.
we have woodboxes on both the new front entry porch and the soon to be hidden current entry which is a fully covered 6x24 porch, plus 30 acres of firewood we harvest regularly.
we have a big firescreen we used in front of the winter warm insert, which catches sparks and keeps one from accidently hitting it.
that's awful about the cat, no survival skills i guess!
i will play with the hearth plan a bit, and the neighbor is the fire chief; i'll make sure to run it all by him.thanks for the reminders, fire is dangerous!

i can't even begin to wrap my brain aorun d giving up my pantry--but i'll try! wonder where else i can get that look, it's not function i need as much as i crave that look; we have plenty of storage actually in the laundry room, mud room and stairs to the second story.

maybe matching butler pantry cabs on either side of the entry into the dining room?
can't wait to meet with my kd to flesh all this out next week!

hi, at your advice i've gone over the important details with my architect and have made certain the aisles are all 42"; besides going over the table seating with her.
her five stools are grandchild sized; four adult size stools will be more likely. I don't really need a dozen seats, but i think with the rocker and dh's desk chair we'll get ten, which is a huge improvement over ONE!).

the inglenook stays, YAY!, and the bev center can be incorporated into my prep area near the desk.
handwashing station will fit better next to the inglenook then.

still waiting for the builder to come back with a bid, and more importantly waiting for the engineer to come back with a yes or no on the new additional septic.
the kitchen addition is part of a three bdrm apt (over the ktichen) and without the extra septic approval i won't go forward on this kitchen for a long while. (sob...)

that means i will have to build an entirely new home elsewhere on my property; so matter what i'll get a new ktichen--not as spiffy as this one perhaps though.