Those pesky tall people again.

Are you the primary cook? If so, design the right counter height for you. Don't end up with a kitchen that is uncomfortable for you. We have a friend who is around 5' 2'', and she says our 38'' high countertops are ''made for giants''. She would not be happy living with our kitchen.

If his main role is as unpaid dishboy - poor guy - you could simply get a shallow sink, which would let him slave away with less stooping. You wouldn't have to raise all the counters and uppers. Or, some people use sink grids to effectively raise the bottom of the sink, I've never had one though.

If he is occasionally unchained from the sink and pressed into service as veggie dicer, then a thick butcher block cutting board with feet can add 2'' of height. It is easy to add height to a work surface, but it is hard to lower a surface.

If you do raise your counters - the ''typical'' clearance between counter and uppers has increased over the years. In older kitchens 14'' or 16'' is common. Today the standard seems to be 18'' or so.

I imagine it has to do with the increasing height of small appliances. The latest do-everything espresso makers can be a lot taller than the old Mr. Coffee, the macho VitaMix blender towers over the old Osterizer, and so on.

Maybe you can measure the height of your favorite countertop appliances (the ones you own and the ones you plan to get), figure out where they will live, and make sure the clearance in those spots is high enough.

Don't forget whatever clearance you'll need for any undercabinet lights, and whatever heat they might produce (don't want a hot halogen puck to melt the lid of your blender, etc).

I think some people would not like the ''look'' of the uppers not all lining up, while others wouldn't mind varied levels.

Also remember the clearance from the tops of the uppers to the ceiling, and think about how that will look.

DH and I are some of those pesky tall people. ;) The tops of our counters are 39 1/2" tall. We have 15" of space between the counter top and the bottom of the uppers, which as johnliu mentions is shorter than today's standard of about 18". But honestly I never noticed that we had less room. That could be because our MW is a built-in drawer style and when I use the blender or mixer they sit on the island. So the only counter top appliances we have are the toaster (plenty of room) and coffee maker (sits under and a bit to the side of an upper. I have to pull it out to fill it, and I keep it to the side the upper with open space over it when it's running because I don't want the steam hitting the bottom of the cabinet or u/c lights. I would do this even if I had 18" between counter top and upper cabs.)

Don't know what to tell you about reaching the upper cab shelves... even at 5'11" I have to stretch to get stuff off the highest shelves. Some people have incorporated a clever spot for a folding step stool into their plans, whether in a pullout lower cab, pullout broom storage, or a toe kick drawer. (Wish I had something like that!)

I can tell you that DH and I are much more comfortable with our raised counters, and even many of our shorter guests have said they like them. Also, for me, I find the handiest storage to be in my lowers (mostly drawers) and because our lower cabinets are taller than standard, they give me a few extra inches of drawer space.

How is your kitchen laid out? Is there a separate section of cabinets or an island that you can raise up a couple of inches? My kitchen is sort of a large galley. The main sink and dishwasher are one one side, and the prep sink and cooktop are on the other. I had the sink side cabinets made 2" higher but left the other side of the kitchen the normal height. Not a single person has ever noticed!

This has been our recent dilemma. For us, the countertop would be an okay height but our sink's height was bugging us, being so low. So we just had the sink raised, and found the perfect compromise of having our actual countertop being only an inch high which is more period-appropriate for a 1913 kitchen anyway! So in the end, our countertop will be at the standard 36" high, as it was before.

That said, our original uppers have always sat lower than others. My coffee machine barely fits under there, but does, If it didn't fit, I'd just move it to the side since at the end of my long countertop are walls which have nothing above them (they're between the uppers and the main doors coming into the room).

I was thinking about it and the reality is that human beings are getting taller all around the world (I think I've read this) so over time, things will only be getting taller and taller. ;) Good luck w/ your decision! I agree that whoever works in the kitchen the most should be most comfortable..

There are some very good tips in this article, written by a firm specializing in ergonomic design -- check it out:

Here is a link that might be useful: What We Can Learn from Commercial Kitchen Design

That is a great article. The upswing doors are interesting. I've never known anyone who has those.

somethings may be getting taller, but I'm not! I can reach a glass on the 2nd shelf IF it's right at the front edge - lol!

I've notice some having counters at different heights. rhome does. you could do that - or compromise and just add an inch to it and get a shallow sink put in.

here's a pic of (someone on this forum) a counter at different hghts that I saved in case I decide to do that -

{{!gwi}}

Thanks for all the interesting responses-I am especially appreciative of the mise en place article.

In our household my husband is, literally, the dishwasher. We don't have a mechanized version, but will in the new kitchen. Poor guy, he has spent the past 2 decades washing dishes multiple times daily with his legs spread wide to be able to use the sink.

The layout lends itself to raising a counter, I think. It's a galley kitchen and the stove is on the opposite so there's no issue with that. I suppose the DW would have to be raised slightly since it is adjacent to the sink.

I try to accomodate him ergonomically wherever possible in our home. When I remodeled the bathroom he uses I made it a tall person's bath: raised the height of the shower head to 7' so he doesn't get sprayed in the face, raised the height of the vanity to 38" and placed the mirror correspondingly, got a comfort height toilet, etc. It is very funny when someone short is visiting; my SIL literally can only see the top of her head in the mirror! He is just outside the design range--I believe it stops at around 6'2". The world isn't designed for my tall fellow so I try to make his home a bit more comfortable.

I'm curious about something:

"So we just had the sink raised"

I just can't picture this-could Theresse, or someone else, show me how that works? I can't see how just a sink could be raised and still have a granite countertop installed.

Thanks again-am going to discuss this with the contractor.

I think you'd need to raise the sink and the area around it.. if there is a way to do it so it looks nice it will give you additional storage! You can raise the dishwasher on a platform with a false drawer front, or put a drawer above it.. maybe a drawer below? Im not sure about that but maybe it can be done..

Do you have a pic of your layout? Maybe these great people can help you find a good spot to start and stop your raised area.

I don't have any experience with this, but happened on a couple of photos you might like to see. The first and tenth photo in the link below show counters at different heights. Looks like you can raise the sink cabinet to raise the sink.

Here is a link that might be useful: Photos of Varying Height Countertops

I do adore that article -- it was the one that got me thinking out of the box, as it were, and realizing that just because some things are accepted as standard doesn't mean they can't be individually tweaked. The world won't explode if someone installs their upper cabs 2" higher than normal, or has an empty blind corner, bathroom-urinal sink, drawers on pogo sticks, etc etc.

Life is long and resale short. Build for what YOU need.

John, there are a few GW folks planning those flip-up uppers in this current thread: Short Uppers w/lift up doors?

If your DH wants a higher counter for the sink, then I suggest making the entire Cleanup Zone higher...with a raised DW. He will appreciate the raised DW as well! A byproduct of raising the counters (especially if you have taller cabinets and not just placing them on a platform) is extra room under the sink for storage (or trash if you like trash under the sink...I don't, but some people do.)

As to installation of upper cabinets...it depends on what you plan to do there...if you plan to also use small appliances there (or keep a coffeemaker on the counter), then be sure to leave enough space for what you plan to do there. If nothing else will be there, than a somewhat shorter backsplash height might be OK...as long as your DH doesn't feel cramped with the shorter workspace height there.

The rest of the kitchen could then be designed to fit your needs...whether that's standard height (36" high including cabinets + countertop) or shorter.

The thread linked below has information about backsplash heights and how to measure for the height that works for you. Just do this for each area of your kitchen...not all the heights have to be the same if they're separated by doors or walls. (I would probably keep them the same height if there's just a window b/w them.)

Here is a link that might be useful: Thread: Wall Cabinet and counter-top height code

Check for portable appliance clearance.

I can barely fit the antique pizzelle maker under the 18 inch high cabinets when it is open for filling with batter.

Having the handle bash the lower edge of the upper cabinets has been a problem previously.

Your counter top should be high enough so that with your hands placed flat on the counter, your elbows are bent about 45 degrees.

I donÂt see how one would have the leverage for slicing and dicing if the counter was that highÂ

runninginplace - raising the sink an inch worked in our case because we put plywood under it that raised in an inch since it was sitting on a heavy plywood shelf anyway, due to it being a heavy fireclay farm sink that needed extra support. Because the sink will be undermount, we had to have the plywood underlayment raised (which surrounds the sink and on which the countertop will sit). In the end it will be the standard 36" high (the countertop) because I decided to get a thinner countertop since I like the look better w/ this particular style/period. I wouldn't have minded extra hight w/ the countertop but since our upper cabinets are so low to begin with, I thought I'd keep it standard and mostly was happy to get the sink raised. HTH!

Your ideal counter height is determined by:

1. Stand up straight with your arms hanging straight down at your sides.

2. Now, keeping your arms at your sides, bend your elbow 90 degrees.

3. Have someone measure the distance b/w your bent elbow and the floor.

4. Subtract 6"

This is your "ideal" counter height.

Subtract 6"

I'm 5'7 and that works out to 36" for me while wearing sneakers. I just Googled it, and the average height for an Adult Woman is 5' 3.8". Based on this, counters have always been too high for most women.

OT: When did the average height for women shrink? The last I knew it (and this was back in the 80's or so) was 5'7" 'with 2" heels' (the 'with 2" heels' never made any sense to me...does that mean 5'5"???)

Anyway...just looking around me, I find 5'3.8" hard to believe...unless you're talking about world-wide and not just in the USA...that I might believe.