Didn't notice any bad odors coming from my computer. I'm just not good with layout stuff. We laid out our kitchen 25 years ago and are now doing a facelift on it--keeping the same layout. So I'm probably no help. Good luck. I hope you hear from the layout gurus soon!

I'm not a layout guru so I don't give advice. The only thing I personally don't like/recommend is putting a cooktop on an island. There are about 10 or so here that are really good-rhome410, beuhl, bmorepanic are a few that I can remember. Hopefully you will get feedback from them. Timing is important too. Some layout geniuses may not be on the computer when you post and posts move quickly down the page here. Hang in there. There's nothing wrong with bumping your own post up also.

I was going to echo what Chris said....I have often bumped my own post to bring it back to the top if it hasn't gotten alot of feedback...some of my posts get 10+ replies while others get 0....I think everyone here is especially helpful but sometimes the timing is crucial - those that usually post may take a day off or two, or on a certain day with less replies, etc.
I don't give layout feedback either...since I am by no means not an expert and needed alot of help on my own kitchen layout recently.

If hard to read lay-outs - fuzzy, faint, confusing, no dimensions provided, too small, or, conversely, are so large they require side to side scrolling on my extra wide monitor, etc - translate to bad computer breath (funny!), well, then you just might have that problem. If I have to struggle to read and decipher a lay-out so that I can provide useful feedback (or even wacky ideas), I don't even try, sorry. I should also add that, for whatever reason, I also seem to have a harder time reading lay-outs than rhome does (I know because she's asked if I checked such and such lay-out and I'll reply that I can't make heads or tails of it). Not sure if others have this issue, though.

No, no bad computer breath! I've had few responses to my posts. Other times, I've had lots of responses. It is what it is. I don't think (believe...hope...) that it's anything personal.

In general, people who are old-timers on this board generally get a lot of responses. They've developed relationships here. People whose projects somehow capture people's imaginations will get lots of responses. I think more technical questions or more quirky questions will get fewer responses because people don't feel qualified to answer. For example, I rarely answer layout questions because I feel I don't have any expertise in that area. Well. I have no expertise in anything, but at least I feel like I can chime in if I like a color or not versus where's the best place to put a prep sink.

I hope you get the help that you need for your project. I know how nervewracking the planning process is!

I am definitely not a layout pro and have just a little bit of time left here on my lunch hour but I just wanted to say that I hope the little ones feel better soon and summer is coming this weekend to Washington...hang in there! This weekend is all sun and mid 70's.

Oh....one more thing...can I offer you a breath mint? (I kid...I kid!!)

I like working on layouts and just left you a message in your 3rd attempt. I hadn't seen your others, partly because I haven't had a lot of time to focus on these recently, and partly because they seem to have sunk down the list before I saw your particular ones. What others have said about the presentation is true, though. You've done exactly as we ask around here, providing scale floorplans, but I had to magnify a lot to see them, and then demagnify to see what I was writing, and then remagnify to look again, etc., and if I had seen your earlier posts when I had to run (though in this case I didn't), I wouldn't have answered.

I think you've done exactly the right thing with this thread! You've given us a kick and said, hey there, help me. It's not that we don't want to help! It's just that sometimes the time of day, time of year, or whatever, limits responses and you have to speak up and ask.

So good for you! I hope you get lots more responses.

In general, a post should begin with "I'm on the verge of TEARS!" in order to garner extensive responses. People like a bit of desperation.

I got distracted for a few minutes when this strange bright light shone through my windows. I think it's called the sun. I just found the forecase for this weekend Ponderous1. Yes! Sun!

Thanks for your feedback and encouragement. I don't know what I'm doing wrong with the photos. I took as good a photo as I could and resized them per Buehl before posting. I don't have any cool design software so this, unfortunately, is the best I can get with presentation unless anyone has suggestions as to how I can make photos better.

I'll reply on my layout thread next. Thanks, Wendy

Hi Breezygirl! I'm in west wash as well. Kingston to be exact. Where are you at?

I don't have any real layout advice other than to DISAGREE with what chris and allnew say about cooktops in the island! (sorry guys);o

We have our cooktop in our island so that we can cook and face the living room/tv and we LOVE it! We have seating on the other end of the island so it's also nice that we can chat with company while we cook.

The only downside I can see to having a cooktop in the island is that you either have to have one of those vent hoods hanging over the island (which i find to be a bit funky looking) or you have to have a downdraft cooktop which never seem so suck odors like they promise to! That being said... we are upgrading to granite countertops soon and we plan to put in a NEW downdraft cooktop and keep our layout the same. I just cannot imagine having a party and then having to turn my back on company to cook something.

GO WITH THE ISLAND COOKTOP!! :))

I'm in Olympia. I love your area. Used to go there a lot to visit Heronswood Nursery before it was closed by that awful George Ball character.

Try as I might, I can't seem to find another good spot for the cooktop. I'm hoping someone else may have an idea for another location that still fits my needs. (See my long post on my other thread.)

I don't like either venting option for the island cooktop, but we've decided on an island hood. We found a couple that still should suck enough and have good lines to them, but aren't the huge chimney-looking things.

Thanks for your support! It means a lot to me today.

Oh Breezygirl,

I am sorry. I rarely if ever post opinions on layouts.
I am the visual girl. If later you want a picture of a
color, a granite, a backsplash, a kind of floor tile,
wood floors, or maybe even crown molding... Just ask me
and I assure you I will post it. I don't check in as often
as I used to but I am happy to help.

Layouts are tooo complicated for me. I find when I do
comment I sound like a pathetic fool. I did see your
posts and you do not have bad breath. At least I happen to
like the garlic smell. : )

Thinking of you and knowing how truly hard it was when
my little ones were ill and I was stuck inside on a rainy
day.

~boxerpups

Thanks Boxerpups. I regard you as a very valuable resource on this forum. I love seeing all of the pictures you come up with. Whenever I see a color, granite, or tile question, I'm anxious to see what you pull out! Rest assured, I know I will be asking for your help in the future. At least the baby is sleeping now and I have a few minutes of quiet.

I rarely offer input to many layout threads. It's too much my day job---which I DO enjoy, it's just this is "recreation" to me, and I'm often limited on the time issue, especially if I'm at work. I do try to answer technical questions from a pro viewpoint to help people understand construction/installation requirements for a successful kitchen. If your post was titled, "Why does my KD show a filler in this version of my design?" I'd be more likely to respond. Or, if it contained construction, plumbing, or electrical issues, I'd probably read and respond. There are just so many requests for layout assistance, that I limit my response in that area.

And, I don't mean to be rude, but if you are having a really hard time coming up with a layout, why not seek professional help? Many times, a KD's fee is wrapped into the cabinet purchase, so there isn't an up front cost. My firm does require a design deposit for design work, but we offer a 1 hour free "brainstorming" session that can help clients see if we click and can bring new ideas to the table.

This forum is a valuable resource. But, as you've noticed, it's sometimes hit and miss timing. And, even though there are some extremly talented amateur designers here on board, you're still going to need the eyes of a pro to tweak any designs into the cabinet brand you choose. Not all brands have all options, so sometimes, your layout is more limited if you choose budget lines, etc.

breezygirl, taking photos of hand drawn layouts is hard to do. I have the best luck when I take the photos with the sun (yeah, I know, what is that? It's going to show in Portland, too) shining in. I put the paper on the floor in the brightest, non-glare spot, turn off the flash and shoot. I do it again with flash and compare the two. Then I tweak as needed in Paint Show Pro, a little more contrast, a little more brightness, whatever seems to help it show the best on my monitor. That's what I post. It's not as great as something I scan but our scanners broken at the moment. Have you tried to clean up your images? Do you have such a computer program beastie as Paint Shop Pro 7?

Nice to see other PNWers here. Tootiepugsmom, I've been to Kingston quite a few times. Had a number of delicious meals at Luna Bella near the ferry dock when I went up to visit Heronswood (I'm with you, breezygirl, boo hiss, George Ball) and attend the Bainbridge in Bloom tour.

How did I know about the forecast? I am in Olympia too! I will definitely be keeping an eye on your progress now. :-)

When we gutted our kitchen 25 years ago (!!!!), we called in a few "experts" who all told us we couldn't fit an island into the plan. Since the kitchen was our primary access to our backyard and deck, we knew we wanted two sliding glass doors and a wall of windows. So the island was absolutely necessary. We drew an angled island on our floor and walked around it for awhile, then decided it would work. Our cooktop (with downdraft) is in the island. We just gave our kitchen a facelift and switched to an induction cooktop (in part for safety reasons) and a new downdraft that rises to 14" when in use. It works well for us

I did see your earlier post but I had a hard time reading the layouts. A scan would be much better than a photo, and a mockup in one of the design tools like Google Sketch Up would be great. Everyone's different, but lots of people are very visual and are more likely to look closely at a detailed (e.g., with all the dimensions), easy-to-read layout graphic than to lots of explanatory text. (Plus you might enjoy laying it out in one of those tools!)

Just my 2 cents. I'm glad to see you're getting some feedback on your other post.

Live_wire_oak: I see where you are coming from. I'm glad you're a part of this forum. We hired a home designer to help with our remodel as we are doing a master bath addition and reworking main living space that contains kitchen. I thought I didn't need a KD because our designer could do the trick. Wrong. But then I found this site and thought I could design myself using everything I'm learning. I also thought you'd have to spend lots of $ on KD, which I didn't want to do. I live in a smaller town, but maybe I can find a good KD somewhere to provide some assistance at this point for a smaller cost. I thought I had come up with a good plan until the latest comments. I now feel like crying.

Lisa--I don't have Paint Shop Pro. I cleaned them up on Flickr, or so I thought, by adjusting the contrast/brightness. Thanks for the photo tips.

Chicagoans--I tried to post a scanned copy of my first plan but couldn't figure out how to post a pdf. How do you do it? I'm very visual also and like seeing people's computer sketches more than hand-drawn like mine. I hadn't heard of Google Sketch Up. I'll try to learn it if I have time in the near future, but I don't have time for a big learning curve right now. Please tell me how to post a scanned layout. Thanks!

Breezy... don't lose heart with multiple layouts. When I joined this forum about 4(?)... maybe 3 years ago I knew nothing about how to draw/post/design layouts. I would spend HOURS coming up with a layout I'd draw on Powerpoint. So proud was I... upload to Photobucket and copy paste.. couldn't wait to hear the responses expecting to hear it was brilliant and, trust me; the layouts weren't and people let me know that (thank goodness). I had apporx. 100 iterations. Just don't give up, open yourself to the advice and don't take it personally, and LISTEN to what people are saying. IT may take you multiple times; but you will get there. I can't draw layouts cause I don't have the software and have a MAC so I use Powerpoint. It's very limited but works well enough to give a basic idea.

Hi Breezy, please don't feel like crying. You are getting great feedback BEFORE doing your kitchen, which is so much better than finding out after the fact that your layout could have been better.

Do you have a way to change your PDF into a single graphic? For example, do you have a screen capture or snipping tool? (I use a PC -- don't know what it's called on a Mac.) My operating system came with a snipping tool and also Paint. So... open up your PDF and expand your view until your image is big enough to read (but not bigger than your screen.) Either use your snipping tool to capture the image (if you have one), OR you can hit the Print Screen button. This automagically takes a screen capture of your whole screen and copies it to the clipboard. Then open Paint, and click Paste (edit menu or shown at upper left.) You can then trim off the unnecessary edges. (I like to press Select All, then manuever the image to the upper left in Paint. Then I use the 'handles' at the right side and bottom to shrink the edges down and essentially crop the picture. Hope this makes sense. Or use Picassa to crop the image.) In Paint you can save it as a .jpg or .png, and upload it to your image hosting site.

Now I've gone through this long winded explanation... and I'm thinking instead when you do your scan, you can probably pick a different format to save it in. Look for .jpg, .png, or .gif. Those will be images that you can upload and link to. Hope this helps!

This is a little off the topic, but I noticed there are a few Washingtonites here. I am in the Tacoma area and wondering if anyone has experience with electrical rough-in inspection by the state. In particular, do they like to see wiring completely unconnected, or are they ok if the connections are made up (so long as everything is visible/inspectable)? Sorry for hijacking :(

Chicagoans--thanks for the technical info. I have a PC but don't have Paint. I'll try your format suggestion.

Remodelfla--your support helps. I now feel like my space is too small and/or awkward to make it work for my needs. I thought after drawing several dozen layouts at home that I had finally come up with the solution in the last one I posted. I'm trying to listen to the advice, but it doesn't seem to work in my space and other requirements.

Ecranny--check with your city or Pierce county (if you're not in a city) building departments for requirements. We haven't gotten a permit for the small electrical upgrades we've done ourselves. We're hiring a GC to do this project.

Breezygirl,

Most (I REALLY want to say all) PC's have paint. You'll probably find it under accessories. In other words,

START menu
ALL PROGRAMS
ACCESSORIES
PAINT

It's a free program that is sort of integrated into the works. I hope that helps.

You're right Morgne. I do have Paint. Gracias!

I avoid posting when I don't know what to suggest and I also am not a layout expert. Best to leave that to the professionals and those that have a good understanding of spacial awareness and best appliance locations in kitchens. I do look forward to seeing your cabinet, counter, etc. selections...so keep on bumping. Take care with your sick little ones...hang in there.

Thanks vampiressrn. Funny thing is that I have so many of the other smaller decisions already made! It'll be smoother sailing once I get past the layout. I can just envision my creamy cabs, the silgranit sinks, the Hansgrohe faucet, those stainless cab pulls, etc, etc. That's what's keeping me going!

You can lift an image out of acrobat using two ways.

Using the reader, in the top menu
Select Tools and then customize toolbars
You'll get this long scary list of stuff.
Use the slider on the side to go all the way to the end
Make sure the snapshot tool is checked.
{{!gwi}}
This will put a camera on the toolbar.
Open your target pdf. When you push the camera, you'll draw a box around the part of the image you want and it will copy it to the clipboard.

Being lazy, I run mspaint (Start-Run- type in the word mspaint, hit enter) and then choose edit in the menus, then paste. Save the result as a jpg.

There is a trick to this which is it needs to be done with the image blown up in acrobat to the point you can actually read it because the camera copies the image you see, not its actual size if printed.

The next way is to zoom the image up in acrobat, again until you can actually see it, but it fits on your screen. Press and hold alt then press (prtscrn or print screen) and release both keys. Run Mspaint and paste the result, then save as a jpg. Alt-prnscrn copies the current application window as a image to the clipboard. If you simply hit prntscrn, it copies everything on your monitor.

Thanks for that!! I appreciate you generously taking the time to type it all out. I know I can do it now.