Tung Oil - Correct me if I am wrong...

17 years ago

Oh Great Wise Ones:

Being a mostly newbie to woodwork, and having tried to glean as much info as I can on posts and other reading, I seem to have developed several perceptions of using tung oil, especially as it pertains to floors. It is almost as if one of the benefits of tung oil is that nothing is ever really "finished."

1) If you finished the floors, move into the room, and discover that there is a spot that you have not sanded well. Even later on, you can go back, sand that area smooth, reapply tung oil and voila, back to where you were earlier. This also applies to spot damage over time due to wear.

2) Controlling stain color. You are better off erring on the side of caution and staining maybe a shade lighter than what you thought you want. With tung oil, after that first application, if it is still too light, you can wipe down with mineral spirits, reapply more stain, and refinish with tung again. (This will not necessarily match the exact color in the can) Or will this process just give you a blotchy floor?

Thanks!

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Comments (4)

sharon_sd
17 years ago
1. might work, but you are asking for headaches. Do a good job first. Spot damage doesn't usually need sanding to refinish.
2. tung oil is not a stain. If you are talking about removing a layer of tung oil applied over a stain, it might work, if you are using oil based stain. It also might work to stain over a single coat of tung oil. But much better is to do test samples and determine the depth of colour you are wanting first. Some woods and some stains just will not get very dark without going muddy. It is better to know from the test how it will turn out.
dainaadele
Original Author
17 years ago
Thanks so much. I do plan on doing a good job, but I know that since it is 400 sq feet, I will screw up somewhere and not notice it until about a month later, and then it will bug me to death for the next 15 years. As for as the staining. I did do a test area, even tried to put it in the room, but I have too often seen with painting: The color looks great in a paint chip, but not on the wall, filling the whole room. I also have alot of color variation in the red oak and it is hard to tell how their interactions will change the appearance.
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We're using tung oil. I'd say you got two poor answers, both from the salesperson and from the "pro" who spells it "tongue" oil. Scary! You are probably correct in guessing that the customers wanted a plastic shine instead of a soft glow that's too subtle for their taste. Waterlox is not at all the same as 100% tung oil...read the contents! Look at both floors or create your own samples before deciding. It may take a little longer, but you will be living with your results for a lot longer.
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WmWalker's correct that the solvents in Millie"s and Waterlox are different but the statement about Waterlox not being a polymerized oil is misleading. Tung oil, when it dries, bonds to itself - it polymerizes. Polymerization of a drying oil like tung oil before application is basically speeding up the drying process so that more of the solids will sit on the top of the wood (instead of soaking in) to form a thicker protective surface and shorten drying time. Waterlox says that their product includes "resin" but synthetic resins can be made by polymerization - so both products contain oil that will penetrate and dry as well as thicker substances that won't soak in as well and will provide more of a surface finish, as well as hardening more quickly. There's no reason to believe that Millie's polymerized oil is any more durable than what's in Waterlox. It may be, but you'd only know that by testing it. The "toxic ingredients" in Waterlox is mineral spirits that evaporate out of the finish when it's dry. Citrus solvent also evaporates and is irritating to the eyes, lungs, and skin and should - like products containing mineral spirits - be applied with good ventilation until dry. Citrus solvent is in the same family of chemicals as turpentine, and mineral spirits were developed as a substitute for the more toxic turpentine. Millie's may be a great product but the text describing why they're better than other tung oil products is irritatingly misleading. I don't have any financial interest in any of them and I've used pure tung oil with citrus solvent for wood used in food prep and pure tung oil and then Waterlox for table tops. I prefer the smell of the citrus solvent but I don't get any of them near flames or use them without good ventilation.
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From your link describing using the tung oil, I'd go with that. I would stay away from polys at all cost as they are so difficult to repair without redoing the whole thing. I am hoping to do my kitchen floor--don't know what's under the vinyl tiles or the several layers underneath, but the rest of the downstairs is oak--white I presume? I think my trim is red oak--is that possible? My house was built in 1908. I would replace the registers also, but don't go to the expense of the linked site--they seem to only sell ones to fit modern ductwork; check out salvage shops/antique shops...there is one in my town where I've bought a couple registers from their large pile--all the good old cast iron black, some with louvers, some without, but all with varying designs of patterns for the grate. I put in an additional duct to my living room, and absolutely had to have the large register if I ever move furniture to match the one in the open near the dining room doors. Your idea of tung oil has given me another and easier option than sanding insanely and doing smelly chemicals. Thanks!
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I was actually reading an article the other day saying that no wood finish has actually been officially FDA approved as food safe. However they're all generally considered safe lacking evidence to the contrary. Anyway, here's what Flexner says about the food-safety of driers (and presumably this applies to mineral spirits as well). "Salad-bowl finish is simply a wiping varnish. The implication in the name is that it is safe for contact with food and for small children who might chew on the finished wood. It is safe of course, once it has cured, but so are all the other available varnishes and wiping varnishes. The safety concern is the metallic driers used to speed the drying of the finish. Lead was once used and it isnÂt safe. But lead isnÂt used anymore. It takes several driers to replace the lead, and there are only a few driers available. So all varnishes use essentially the same driers. There is no difference in the safety factor of any of these driers. All are safe. ItÂs amazing to me how the food-safe myth continues to be repeated in woodworking circles. (And more amazing still that salad-bowl finish is considered safe while the other wiping varnishes arenÂt!) Food safety is a non-issue. All finishes currently available to woodworkers are safe to eat off of or chew on once the finish has fully cured. Curing occurs faster the thinner the film and the warmer the surrounding air. Press your nose up against the hardened finish and take a whiff. If you can smell anything, the finish isnÂt cured. Give it some more time." Here is a link that might be useful: Flexner article on varnishes
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bob_am
17 years ago
You need to be careful what you are calling 'Tung Oil'.

There are a lot of products out there that use the name, but aren't really tung oil. Most of them are varnish that is thinned enough to wipe on. Some are mixtures of varnish and oil, and the ratios affect the characteristics. Not that the mfr will tell you on the label.

Real tung oil comes in two forms, pure and polymerized. Both are difficult to apply well, and either a poor finish (the first) or very expensive (the second). The label will usually say if it is pure tung oil, and it has a distinctive smell. Not so if it is polymerized, or a mixture.

Keep in mind, that if a finish is easy to fix, it is only because it is not particularly stong. You won't have to worry about one little spot bugging you for the next fifteen years if you use real tung oil, the whole floor will need touched up many times before that!

If you want someting easy to apply, and strong, choose one of the oil/varnish blends, but don't expect to just wipe it off with mineral spirits. Watco, Deftoil, Minwax Tung Oil finish, etc, are examples.
dainaadele
Original Author
17 years ago
Thanks ya'll. I'm in the middle of finishing, and so far it looks gorgeous, but I knew something would go wrong - nailholes. I filled tham with a sawdust/glue mixture, but I guess they soaked up alot more oil than the wood (maybe in contrast to the hardness of my oak?) Has this happened to anyone else before? I know I could someday sit down a dig out the fill and replace it. But for now, it isn't so bad.

Bob- I am usung the pure tung oil stuff. I know what you mean about the mfr not telling you about not having tung oil in the label. Why is it that everyone wants to have a the tung oil in their name, but not in the product? I know it is not a stomg finish, but I am one of those that likes the wood for what it is. The varying colors, grains, dings and scuffs all add to the beauty for me. If I wanted perfectly matched "wood" with a perfectly smooth finish that lasts for ever, I would have layed down pictures of wood covered in plastic (aka laminate-Grin)

Tung Oil - Correct me if I am wrong...

Comments (4)

sharon_sd

dainaadele
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Tung Oil - Correct me if I am wrong...

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sharon_sd

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dainaadele
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