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best topcoat on General Finishes Gel Stain

10 years ago

I just finished refinishing my guest bathroom cabinets (builder's oak) with the Java Gel Stain. I used the 'Satin' Arm-R-Seal as the topcoat, but it left a 'frosty' finish because of the flatteners (not streaky, but frosty) -- It's ok for the bathroom, but I want to do my kitchen cabinets in the GF Georgian Cherry....but I don't want the 'frosty' finish...should I use the 'gloss'?? (I heard it is easier, because it doesn't have the 'flatteners' to deal with)...but not sure I want a high 'gloss' finish....or should I use another brand? They looked great until I put the topcoat on, that took away how great they looked....HELP!!

This post was edited by alert on Wed, Apr 23, 14 at 23:58

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Comments (7)

bobismyuncle
10 years ago
You could use gloss, and even go through all the work of rubbing down to a satin (not easy because it's polyurethane).

However, streakiness is usually due to insufficient stirring to keep the flatteners in suspension. Because Arm-R-Seal is a wiping varnish* it's more thinned than a brushing varnish so the flatteners fall out of the less viscous liquid much quicker. Thorough stirring before and regular stirring during application is important. I'd stir about every 30 seconds. Another question is how did you apply? That may also contribute to the streaks. I'd stir, put in an open top container, then dip a brush in the container to apply. Throw away anything left in your distribution container once you're done brushing on.

* Despite the label saying, "Urethane and Oil Blend" (or at least it used to), it's simply a varnish. If you put a puddle on a piece of glass it will dry smooth and hard. An oil-varnish blend will dry with wrinkles in it. The more wrinkles, the higher proportion of oil to varnish. I've always said to people that this label is like putting "Flour and yeast blend" on a loaf of bread. The creation of varnish combines and cooks the ingredients (resins and oil) in a way to make a new substance, just like baking bread.
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alert
Original Author
10 years ago
@bobsmyuncle, do you have a better recommendation? I'm staining the cabinets with the GF Gel Stain....
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navi_jen, sorry for the late reply, as I just found this thread again. I'm sorry to say I didn't take a picture of the Brown Mahogany. When the second coat went bad (basically randomly lifted off portions of the first coat, exposing the original stain), I was too mad to take photos. I wish I had, because it would have been more useful trying to figure out what went wrong. The attached photo is one of my favorites in Houzz. My desk wasn't quarter-sawn oak, but the color from the Brown Mahogany was reminiscent of this wood. I regret applying the first coat with a sock, even though everyone raves about it. I think it went on too thick and there were definitely streaks from the sock's ribs. Maybe I didn't wipe it off well enough or wait long enough between coats. Anyway, by the time I came up for air, I had stripped and sanded the desk down to bare wood. I called General Finishes and a nice man told me that since I was at bare wood, he would stain it the conventional way. That's what he would do. So I did and I'm a happy camper. However, the color isn't as nice as the gel stain Brown Mahogany. It's a mid brown, but definitely not java. Here is a link that might be useful: [color similar to GF brown mahogany[(https://www.houzz.com/photos/master-suite-bath-traditional-bathroom-seattle-phvw-vp~302707)
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Comments (4)
Stirring wasn't the problem...I stirred it 100x one direction, then 100x the other direction, and then 15-20 times in between.... And the doors dried for a week before applying the stain.....I perhaps put it on too thick....but it's so tricky to get the "flatteners" to go on without streaks... Have you used the product with success?
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Comments (3)
So does Rockler. I haven't been in one in years, but it used to be that many of the "unfinished furniture" stores had a rack of General Finishes products. Here is a link that might be useful: General Finishes dealer locator
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Comments (9)
I would not use the minwax gel stain (sorry dbfirewife) to do this job. The General Finish brand works wonderfully. Have you seen Celticmoon's detailed instructions? You can find them over on Kitchen forum under Sticky or under New to Kitchens thread. I have also found that the Old Masters brand works great too. Not exactly sure what would happen with the filler, but will you be putting in new hardware? Would the old hole be covered by the new hardware (ie, a handle that spans across the place where the hole for the old knob was?) If so, I'm sure it will do a very good job so you don't even notice the old hole. My biggest piece of advice is--you must let it dry completely between coats. Absolutely no "almost dry" . And depending on the look you are going for, you can just use the gel stain as a paint, and you don't have to wipe it off, just let it dry. The first coat or two will not be what you are looking for, don't despair, keep going.
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alert
Original Author
10 years ago
I'm going to sand it down and try a different product...Minwax Clear Satin Poly....See if that makes a difference...
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alert
Original Author
10 years ago
I'm going to sand it down and try a different product...Minwax Clear Satin Poly....See if that makes a difference...
0
aidan_m
10 years ago
That is a terrible idea. General finishes are the best of wood coatings. Minwax are the worst.

Try another GF product in satin. Read: Stir the can thoroughly with a wooden stir stick. Be sure to scrape the bottom of the can as you stir. All the flatteners settle to the bottom very quickly, where they sort of congeal. You can see if the can is stirred properly by scraping the stirrer on the bottom and then examining what is stuck to the stick. When stirred properly, there will be no more accumulation on the bottom or the stick.

The same applies to pigment based stains. The pigment settles to the bottom, and the can must be stirred aggressively before and during application to ensure an even color pigment.
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sombreuil_mongrel
10 years ago
For my kitchen cabinets (which were new/previously-unfinished), I used several coats of shellac over the stain, then a wiped-on coat of polyurethane gel varnish for water-resistance and cleanability. Been 7 years now with no issues.

Casey
0
User
10 years ago
I used the General Finishes wipe-on poly top coat.
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