"Never have they come to visit the rest of their grandchildren here. " . . . "So, FIL cornered DH as SS's graduation dinner "

So FIL was at grad dinner but never visits grandchildren? Not certain how you define visit, but maybe he is doing same thing with SD?

They came for SS's graduation, yes. That was the first time in two years. And then they wonder why youngest DD (just turned 5) doesn't jump up in their lap and talk to them, etc. Well, it's because you're STRANGERS...duh. The last time she spent any length of time with them, she was two, when we drove to FL to visit them. We do talk about them, mention them, show her pictures from the beach from our last visit, but really, she doesn't know them.

And we tried to see them during family trip to FL in April. But they couldn't seem to fit us in, even though we were an hour away.

And even though they were here for several days for SS's graduation, we saw them for 30 minutes after the actual ceremony, and 2 hours at dinner. At the ceremony, they sat with ex-wife & her husband & parents. At the dinner, they did the same. Which was probably a blessing....but I digress. FIL and BM's dad did take SS to breakfast, but didn't visit youngest DD5 or oldest (here in college) at all. Not that I'm bitter...it's just shiddy of them.

But they have managed to visit ex-wifes home at least 4 times in the past 2 years, as well as meet them in FL (four hours from their place) for Thanksgiving dinners. Make of it what you will....at least SD is getting to visit with them....poor kid! Even she has started to pick up on MIL4's nasty attitude and bad-mouthing people...gotta love it when the kids start to see people's true colors...

my XMIL is a nice woman, not mean at all. and also very involved wiht both of her gandkids, but she could never accept anyone else in X's life. XMIL calls me very often more often than SM, and let me tell you we were divorced for close to 16 years and nothing changed. My X always jokes that XMIL still loves me and cannot accept anyone else. I do not know if it is normal but apparently it does happen...DD also told me that it is noticeable how XMIL loves me and does not like SM. My point is that it could be a common thing...I don't know

If only I could hope for one minute that MIL4's intentions were honorable. Fact is, before I really knew her well, she would say crappy things about BM to me. I'm sure she probably said similar things about me to BM. Again, I now realize that she's the kind who thrives on drama, and always has something shiddy to say about someone/something.

It only took me about 7 years to figure out the "real" her. I think her responses to our situation is based purely on her own feelings/emotions as a mother who would have been devastated had her children wanted to go live with Dad. This is her common bond with BM....it's all about the adults feelings, not the best interest of the kids. They are good at making the kids feel responsible for their (mom/step-gma) happiness/well-being.

In fact, I have an AMAZINGLY close relationship with DS20's grandmother. His father and I were never married, and sadly he died a few years ago after a long battle with cancer. But his mom and I have a great relationship, as do his siblings and I. DS is very close to that part of his family, even though they weren't involved in his life until he was about 10.

" I think her responses to our situation is based purely on her own feelings/emotions as a mother"

I think you nailed it --
And also (sorry to say this, but it is how I feel) -- I tend to suspect the judgement and/or personal character of anyone who's been through four wives. I just tread carefully around people whose track records are that lop-sided.

Your SD seems to have things figured out, and it sounds like you do too.

Don't be sorry to it, sweeby...you are "dead nuts on", as my DH would say. Often, when I've heard FIL rambling on about some political crap or really anything having to do with real life issues (other than sailing...he's a pro at that!), I have this thought going through my head..."WTF would you know about that? You will die NEVER really having a clue." Sorry to say that, but it is how I feel!!!

I think she has it all figured out. I just hope she has the chutzpah to go in there and talk to the referee, without peeing her pants, or without hearing that little voice in her head...the one of her mother chastising her for "leaving me here with no kids".

Thanks for the kind words...

Y'know, I just got to thinking...

If the change of custody is awarded, and SD is here, my in-laws will be able to see ALL of their grandkids in one visit here! They won't have to spend any time with DH's ex....

OH GOD NO!!!!!

My XMIL was really great to me while her son & I were married. We went shopping with DS every Friday night. She was the only person who actually knew of the abuse and the prior drug use. She was the only person who saw the bruises. Then when we got divorced, X told her the reason I left was because I cheated. Of course she believed everything he said. We don't keep in touch. I think she's scared of her son, too. We occasionally speak if it's an extenuating circumstance or something, but that's rare.

I guess my point is I think it's really split as to where XILs loyalty lies after divorce. I really think it's crossing the line for FIL and MIL to visit BM. They should meet somewhere if they want to see SD.

why is it crossing the line? I think adults can visit whoever they want and keep in touch with whoever they want. i see nothing wrong with XMIl visiting me. We live far away now, but when we used to live close by, they visited very often. What lines does it cross if adults want to visit each other? Should XMIL and XFIl ask new wife's permission? And if my brother would divorce my SIL, you bet my parents would go visit her any time they want as I would too.

Why is it anyone's business whom the in-laws visit? I was fond of my mother-in-law, and I would have kept in contact with her after the divorce, had she not been deceased by then.

I think the point is not as much that the in laws visit the ex, it's that they visit the ex and don't visit their son, his son, his wife, and their kids. IF they are going to visit the grandkids, shouldn't they visit all the grandkids? Remember, the son of the ex is living with OP and her DH . . . so if you want to make the point that they are only visiting their first set of kids that doesn't work, either.

It is their business in that they have to come up with a reason why grandma and grandpa don't come around. Trust me, I know this one.

Many, many ex wives don't respect that relationships and boundaries change after a divorce. They expect to continue a close relationship with the ex-in laws, without realising that this relationship is now different.

Yes, you can and should stay in touch with your in laws after a divorce - especially when there are grandchildren involved. After all, you didn't divorce your ex's parents so there is no need to cut off contact with them. You can be friendly, or even 'friends', but there is a new line that shouldn't be crossed, and too many ex wives refuse to see this.

When it interferes in the ex's new relationship, or there is an ulterior motive involved in trying to 'stay close to the family' at the expense of the family's relationship with the ex, then that is the time when the ex wife has to respect the new family dynamics and back off. Many ex wives refuse to acknowledge or accept this and this often causes problems in new relationships, which is of course often the intention in the first place.

They may be your childrens grandparents, and were once parent figures to you in a way, but after a divorce they are no longer your 'family'. The new wife is. Sure, that's tough, and maybe it doesn't even seem fair, but a good woman will recognise that the boundaries have changed and alter her relationship with her ex in laws accordingly, especially if her motives are pure and she doesn't want to interfere in their relationship with their son and family.

And of course, many in laws, often unhappily, maintain loyalty to the ex wife because she 'controls the children'. They may have true loyalty to their own family, but feel they need to stay on good terms with the ex to remain in the childrens lives. Put it this way - how many in laws would truly maintain a close relationship with the ex wife if the father had full custody of the children?

nicksmom, I am sure this must be hurtful for your husband, and for you as well. Unfortunately, some people are just toxic and their motives and actions simply can't be reasonably explained or understood.

You are not going to be able to change them, and I suspect confronting them over this will only cause a huge war, so the best, or probably the ONLY thing you can do here is just let it go.

Let them say what they want, do what they want, visit whomever they want - it's okay. They are not going to change, for whatever reason, not for you or your husband, so just let it go and celebrate your life without them.

Next time they make these kinds of comments, just smile nicely and say to them, "I appreciate what you're saying, thank you". And that's it. Don't try explain yourself, justify your decisions, or argue back. Smile and walk away. Have confidence in the wisdom of your own choices and decisions, and don't allow yourself to be upset by these manipulative, toxic people.

I don't think it is up to the ex-wife to maintain these kind of boundaries. If my XMIL wants to call and wants to visit, where is it my place to tell her not to visit because it is about some kind of boundaries or I am not a family anymore and new wife is? How is it up to me? Why would I want to offend her? And if I want to give her a call, what is it to do with X or new wife? It is not even their business. In fact when i don't talk to XMIl for some time my X tells me: mom said she could't reach you on your home phone, give her a call.

barefoot, I have been divorced for a very long time, I do not control any children, in fact never did. My DD is grown and lives on her own, in facts she spends more with dad because they live closer. But my XMIL still maintains relationship with me. We just have a realtionship. And my X has nothing against it neither has his wife? Why to feel insecure?

I mean if I would start sleeping with XFIL this would be major crossing boundaries but everything else?

And my X is remarrying now 3rd time. Should XMIl just erase me and 2nd wife (she was not close to 2nd wife though) just because he keeps remarrying?

well maybe they have bad relationship wiht their son and new wife and they don't like to visit. maybe they dislike new wife. it is not nice to not visit, but often people don't want to visit because they don't feel welcome and it upsets them to visit. and maybe they like ex-wife and maybe they feel welcome there, so they visit. I am just speculating that there are plenty of reasons why people visit one set of relatives and don't visit other.

finedreams is absolutely correct. The relationship between the exW and her former in-laws is entirely up to them, and there is no reason why it should have to change in any way just because their son is divorced and possibly remarried.

Hey everyone, look! It's the TOS and FD show, with more of their sage wisdom to offer....I think they are a team! Go away, you two!!

Now, to everyone else (because FD & TOS don't deserve responses)--
The interesting thing is that all this visiting to ex's home and meeting them on trips and holidays, didn't start until SD started really talking about a custody change. I think MIL4 is the one really "fueling the fire".

DH and his dad have had their own issues in the past, but spent a lot of time & energy mending those fences. Of course, this was before MIL4 was in the picture (it was between MIL3 and MIL4).

I wonder if FIL might be going along with his wife for fear of losing her if he doesn't...I don't know. But seeing as how he knew all about ex's old issues, including her infidelity, and never had anything good to say about her until MIL4 started in, I can't help but think it's more MIL4's motivation. And her motivation, as I mentioned before, is purely based on her own experiences/feelings about her own daughters and how she would have felt if they'd wanted to leave.

Before SD started talking more about moving here, I was MIL4's "greatest pal". We were frequently invited to come vistit, we went sailing, shopping, out to eat. They visited here, etc... now she has nothing nice to say. Let alone visit or invitations...for which I am currently grateful. She says crappy things about youngest "not talking to her" and at SS's graduation she was overheard saying, "I thought this was his FAVORITE restaurant...he just told me he's NEVER been here. Why would she (me) have it here?". To which I'd would have liked to reply, "Because you stupid cow, this is where he requested to have it! Not that it's any of your business." But I didn't...I just smiled, and went home to have a nice little (ok BIG) drink!

so i don't deserve responces because my opinion differs from yours? I am expressing my opinion and share my experience. Mine is not better or worth than yours, it is just different. In fact I was not even replying to your particular posts, i am not sure if I even read your last ones, I was commneting on what barefootdiva says.

I am not replying wiht anger when your opinion differs or say you don't deserve my replies. i am not sure why you need to be angry when we are just sharing our views on the issue. if we all have same opinions, why would we even ask here?

when i asked questions here people gave me completely opposing view points and that a nature of public forums. why get angry that I have different opinion? I don't understand this kind of rage.

Not rage, just disgust...you clearly need to be on a different forum. I don't think the stepfamily one serves you, or anyone else for that matter, well. Your responses/replies make it very clear that this is not the best place for you to "share your experiences", because, best I can tell, they are nothing like most of ours. I realize that you are divorced, but did you re-marry? Have step-kids? If not, you really aren't able to offer any insight into stepfamily issues.

FD, very astute point. Yes there is rage. Perhaps it is driven by a unfair situation -- perhaps by unreasonable expectations.

No rage, maybe not even disgust as I previously replied. More ANNOYANCE than anything. Replies that clearly lack any understanding of what is being discussed, or of the situation. It's annoying to have to sift through these replies to weed out the junk. I have no problem with differing opinions, I just prefer them to be germaine to the topic at hand. I'm definitely looking for the silver lining, but doubt that those who haven't BTDT can really help me find it.

no nicksmom I am not married, I joined this forum because of being involved with man with grown children and also my daughter is in a stepfamily, so there is a stepfamily in my life. I don't think I need your permission to be here though. I agree that my experience differs from yours for number of reasons but it does not mean i have no rights to express my opinion.

I get along with X, X's family, my family, he gets along with mine, my kid gets along with everyone, I get along with SM, she gets along with me, etc. I think because of that lack of drama in my family I do have a lot of insight to offer how to maintain peace and not cultivate conflict. So i think my insight is valuable but I understand that you do not want to listen to it. It is your rights to stick to your ways to do things.

Precisely. You lack drama (consider yourself lucky), so I think it makes it difficult for you to offer much to those of us that have difficult family situations to deal with. I didn't say you have no right to express your opinion, just that it would likely be more appreciated elsewhere. You have yet to offer anything helpful or useful on the two threads I have here. What you have posted only shows your lack of insight into these difficult situations.

And the ex wives that remain in close contact with their former in laws don't have any issue with being left out of special family occasions - Christmas, Thanksgiving, Birthdays, etc, where the 'new wife' is included?

Re: the original topic - It is one thing to maintain a 'friendship' outside of the former marriage, but another issue altogether when the former in laws openly favor the ex wife over the new family set-up. Wasn't that part of the issue of the original OP?

nicksomom but difficult situations are created by people. They did not happen by themselves. We did not manage to maintain OK relationships just because, we built it often by just letting go off control, just let it be. Don't you think i felt sometimes like saying to my X you are dumb$$. lol But I did not. My insight is: don't look for trouble.

Nicksmom, I think FD has offered insightful comments. You are of course free to think that your comments and your view are the only valid ones. Might I suggest this alients some people IRL.

diva,
Yes. It seems clear to me that, although my FIL had the audacity to approach my DH with his opinion of SD's desired move here, he clearly has NO IDEA what she really wants. So, although they've visited her at ex's home, and met up with them on vacation, he really remains clueless. I doubt he's ever even discussed it with her. His opinion, I'm sure, comes from MIL4's rant.

I just want to say to him, "where the hell do your loyalties lie?. With the woman who has put your grandchildren in this less-than-ideal situation, or with your son who has ALWAYS taken the moral high road and kept his children't best interest at the forefront?"

And now everyone can argue for another 20 pages on the meaning of the word 'alients' :D :D

barefoot, when in-laws openly dislike new wife and prefer the ex, it is hurtful for a new wife, of course. But is it possible just for a minute that a new family set-up has too much conflict and drama. Also in-laws could feel that they are disliked by a new wife, like she does not respect them enough and does not think of them highly. Even if she does not say that directly they could sense it. Like she looks at them and thinks: you have nothing valuable to say.

At the same time ex-wife might have a peaceful life that suits in-laws. also maybe she clearly shows respect for her former in-laws and they feel flattered. I am just saying that it is a two-way street. If people prefer one preson over the other there might be a reason. And maybe new family can adjust its ways as well and be warmer and more accepting.

nicksmom, I have a lot of (personal) experience of in laws like this and it can be disheartening. But guess what ... it's not your problem ;)

Sure, their loyalties are twisted and their behaviour is confusing, but so what. Let them do what they want. The kids grow up and see it all for themselves anyway. And you? Well, I guess if you are confident enough in your place in your family, and know your own worth and value, then their opinions are meaningless anyway. Anyway, if they were not in any way connected to you through your DH, would they really be the type of people whose opinions would matter to you?

The best thing you can do in your position is just focus on your family and not give a second thought to those outside that perimeter, and let them say and do what they want. It doesn't matter. Your family does.

diva,
You couldn't be more right. FIL is clueless, MIL4 is toxic. Their opinions don't matter. It's just that our relationship, before this custody change thing, was pretty good. I feel strongly that grandparents are so important for kids...but only if they are healthy, I suppose.

Absolutely, FD. And I have seen this. The in laws may have developed a close relationship with the ex wife over the years and it can even get to a point where they feel more loyalty towards her in a divorce, especially if their son (true or perceived) behaved badly during the separation/divorce, and if the children were affected by this. I think that's pretty understandable.

But as parents, sometimes you have to suck it up and play nice. This is your son's wife. End of story. You might not like her, you may LONG for him to have stayed with his ex, chosen someone else, whatever, but this is the choice your son has made, right or wrong. As parents, surely, we can put aside our own feelings for the sake of our children (and yes, they're still our children, even after they are presenting you with your grandchildren, lol) and make an effort to get along with the new wife. Even if this is only out of respect for the choices their son has made.

Trust me, my teenage son has brought home one or two girls that I really didn't like, but he was the one dating them, not me. My job wasn't to do anything other than be polite and friendly, not to question or judge his choices, but when they were gone they were gone. Of course, it's nowhere near the same as in a long term relationship or marriage, and when there are children involved - I'm not trying to compare the two equally - but on a lesser level this is a valid comparison.

And I'll let you in on something as well - if a new wife or partner is aware that there is a close relationship between the ex wife and the in laws, then she will be wary of the in laws and may present herself as aloof or unfriendly. Now, that's really unfortunate, because in that situation the new wife could do a lot to heal or build that relationship just by letting down her guard and giving the new in laws a chance. But often they feel nervous, threatened and/or wary, often that information about her life may be getting back to the ex wife through them.

And often it's a tough position for the in laws to be in, but everyone involved has to get over themselves and make the effort. And the ex wife has to respect that.

Wow the high road was very much on my mind this AM when I read all this .....Would love some practical advice on staying on the high road, or wildly careening off it....My Dhs parents are deceased, but SILs and X have destroyed Dh and 25 year old son relationship to the point they have not spoken in a year...They have trash talked DH and I with lies and rumors..Few examples, I called all SILs Fn Bs NEVER happened, Oh thats because I was DRUNK when I said it and didnt remember!!!!DH was in the same room next to me when this supposedly happened, when he called SIL on it , she said Oh yes she did!!!He knows it didnt happen, he was there!!!One SIL made a sexual comment to my DH(his brothers wife)I can... you anytime I want!! I was sickened and horrified...I supposedly have made him cut off all contact with his family again totally false, they have his cell and email, and he could visit anytime he wants to, no complaint from me..XMIL came up to me and said Dont you know who I AM!!! (My) DH will ALAWYS be MY SON IN LAW..Another SIL (who was DRUNK LOL)_attacked me and called DH foul names, something about a loan he made to a nephew(before I met him, something none of her business, as far I could tell WHY attack me????They are all crazy, BUT they have repeated all these crazy lies to DH s son, and more and apparently he believes all this junk....So, yes I have been staying out of the parameter, and taking high road, BUT wonder if any attempt should be made by DH to tell him that all these are lies, or keep quiet as we have been doing?

Ex was never DIL to MIL4. We aren't newlyweds, or a new family. That's what makes this so weird. We had a pretty solid relationship, prior to this change of custody issue.

And the kids ARE figuring it out, all on their own.

Stay away from these people. Clearly they just love the drama and have a deep negative energy. Why hasn't your DH addressed these issues with his son yet? He should. Your DH should take him out somewhere private, just the two of them, and NOT bash the people concerned, in fact not even mention them other than in the context of what was said to him, but certainly set the record straight. His son can make up his own mind about it afterwards, as he simply cannot make a set judgement call only knowing one side of a story.

dotz,

how awful. Stay away from them.

my bestfriend's husband's family is this way. when she met her future husband and was introduced to his family they said she slept around and is a known whore. My friend was a virgin, her husband was her first man, she never even dated and came from a strict family. She is a very good looking and at that age she did look like a model. His parents and siblings spread rumors that with looks like hers she sure is a whore, an exotic dancer, sleeps with older men for money, plays in porn movies, she has no other reason to marry their son but cover her nasty past (what past, she was 22 when she has met her husband)etc

So there was a lot said and done. They did not even show up at the wedding. Her husband said that they have to be nice to him and his wife to which they replied with complete estrangement. They chose to be gone rather than being nice. They never even saw their grandson who is 22 years old now.

BTW all these years she was the one to insist that he has to stay in touch just because they are a a family. He said if they are spreading dangerous lies he is not going to go around them(she is a high school assistant principal, does she need rumors that she was a porn star? which of course she was not).

he did went to one family event and brought his son trying to make him to know his grandparents, but they refused to speak to a boy! "he is HER son". lol But of course they were also alcoholics so maybe that's why the nastiness...

anyways dotz, it would be perfectly fine for you and DH to say FAARR away from these crazies. and I agree with diva he needs to speak to his son in private.

Diva and FD, Anxiety is building this week because it is one year Fathers Day to the date that they stopped speaking, and he cant sleep wondering if he ll call...The Sk did some pretty crappy things to DH a year ago, asked for half cost of his wedding(DH was off work sick for 7 months prior, told him no, that ticked kid off, so he treated both of us very poorly, we did pay for rehearsal and they sent invite to US making it look like her parents payed(the parents return address and RSVP to them..Day of wedding I and DH were grabbed at the door by some church people and put in the basement!! (Every one else was in the vestibule upstairs!!! Told the congregation of 340 that He was proud of himself for putting himself thru college..Dad was crushed!! Not only did he pay CHILD support til the kid was 23!!! He payed every penny of his college!!!!So, DH does want to straighten him out, he thinks SS should call first because of his behavior, and he did nothing wrong to deserve this treatment, and SS apparently feels we did wrong by not paying ...I did leave early alone, DH stayed a while longer, I m sure ss is ticked about that also, but geez, really didnt want to stick around for more shabby treatment ..I hate beening seen as drunk, liar ho, goldigger because of these lunatics,this I think is why he treats his dad so poorly... in reality my career was in law ENFORCEMENT, all these jokers have been ARRESTED right up to Ex Gramdma!!!I ve got great friends, SS has met them, I think you can judge someone by the company they keep..Funny, when Iwas going to marry DH I thought it was great he had a big family, holidays togehter and all..I just assumed they would be normal like him Sigh..I hope kid does call for long private talk with DH, but I dont know if he can convince him I am not the cause of all the problems in this crazy family..

DH just came back from visit with younger son(whom I get along fine with) Told Dad he and his brother and mom went yesterday to SIL grad party for her daughter....WHY does that infuriate me so much???This is the SIL who can ....my DH anytime....Purpose of inviting X....?????? God I despise these people and I m mad at myself for letting them under my skin..AND I can only imagine what was said about me in front of X s and SSs..The younger one likes me, now are they going to try to get him to hate me? Sigh

hmm dotz, wanting to be with a guy with a big family...my wise grandma used to say: the best deal is to marry a guy from orphanage, will never have to deal with in-laws. lol

SIL offered your DH sex? did I get it right? does her husband know? they sound like some very trashy people.

FD, we were out with my DH friends and also a BIG boss, somehow Dhs 2 sisters and SIL tracked us down, SIL busted thru the door and at the top of her lungs said TWICE not once, my DHs name and I can F... You anytime I want to....Motivation, I cant say....Disgusting, yes, embarrassing, indescribale....Trashy, oh yeah..I did tell her(this was the first time I had ever seen her)Did you really just say that about your HUSBANDS BROTHER.....What kind of person would SAY that??? Next time I saw her, she INTRODUCED herself, as if we had never met....2 SIL say this never happened... They were sitting right next to her....There were about 15 witnesses to this, but see, IT NEVER happened in their minds I guess...Geez, I ll pay for her lie detector test and mine too....

was she drunk?

bear with me dotz... after leaving a relationship with alcoholic I assume everybody does everything because they probably drink.lol My SO (exSO as of 2 days) is the most affectionate and polite person you can imagine-when sobber. On more than few ocassions while intoxicated he said inappropriate things. He although rembered main conversation, he often could not remember exact words. he always believed though when I said: that's what you said.

so it is a possibility. Not an excuse though. Too bad you cannot break up with your SIL. haha

FD, NEVER have I seen DH intoxicated in 7 years...Yes they do drink..I dont object to drinking, but I hate the sloppy obnoxious behavior they exhibit...DH isa s ports fanatic and goes to the Local to watch games with his school friends from grammar school,LOL, andthey know this and track him down, and rehash the last 20 years , call him names, I dont get it..You cant reason with them, I have tried, (Cant you come over tommorrow and discuss this) Its all nonsense, hes been so helpful and good to them ..They are almost like X wives trying to get in last words or digs ...Figure this out, I cant....The family dynamic is too complicated to me.....

And why is it OK to trash all Xwives/

"They are almost like X wives trying to get in last words or digs "

KK, I think she meant that they are acting like if they would be his jealous ex-wives not ex-wives in general.

LOL, nicksmom,
Your MIL4 sounds like the typical gossipy old woman who has nothign better to do than be what i call ' a SH*T disturber" I've delt with woman like this all my life.
I basically throw back everything in their face. And your FIL has balls to go up to his own son and stick his nose into this affair??? mmmmm...sounds like they do not like the idea of visiting all the grandkids eh? Well too bad! Its SD decision in the end to move down. She is old enough to decide to go stay with her dad. THeir is nothign wrong with that. Academically she would have the upper hand and family love to support her.
Personally, i would have told my FIL to DUCK OFF! But its your husband who should put him in his place and if MIL#4 opens her mouth just shovel it back in her face. And do it bluntly:) These type of woman get off on causing trouble. Smile and dish it calmly and laugh.
But they will probably have to visit now more often when granddaughter moves....mmm..maybe you should cook them something that will really give her gas! lol! I did that to one of my aunts. She spent most of her time in the bathroom. Cant say she visited too often after that. Apparently my cooking doesn't sit right with her:)

OM - that was the funniest thing I've heard in FOREVER! LMAO!

EXACTLY Fine...If I said like a child, would I be trashing all CHILDREN!!! I LOVE children......

maria,
OMG! You had me laughing out loud...and I shared your advice with DH, who said "she sounds like you...loaded for bear".

Thanks for the helpful hints! I might just try them.