I don't get your intense dislike for your SD. It seems like she has made a lot of genuine kind gestures to your family. Remeber it might be your son but it's also her little brother.

I think you need some intense therapy for your anger issues. I'm sorry if that offends you, and I think I've mentioned this to you before Thurman.

You would have a complete heart attack if you had my S-Kids. Have you sought any professional help in regards to your anger?

~Cat

I think he just posts this nonsense to aggravate mothers and stepmothers on this forum. So when my DD buys gifts for her little brothers, she is playing "little mommy"? How mean. Agree with cat, serious professional help is long overdue.

Yeah, and what's the problem? Is this the best you could find this week?

Kid is going off to school and I'm sure he will enjoy having several care packages. Be glad she likes him and means well in sending him off right.

Do do your 'take care of my own kid' thing and package son up a package too...trust me, he'll love them both and will likely call home to send more.

What a petty thing to be annoyed about...geesh, imagine that a stepsister actually caring about and being excited for her stepbrother and his venturing out on his own. How dare her be so thoughtful, caring and unselfish.

Light bulbs, care packages, do you ever really get things of importance to moan about or do you just like digging really deep into every word and action to see if you can possibly find the slightest thing to make a mountain out of?

Have a great day, Thurman, and I wish your son all the best in his new adventure.

I loathe my Xs SO,and if she sent DD a care package I wouldnt care.

isn't thurmans son about 13??? 9 when he started posting

Thanks folks for your great posts. It does help give me some perspective. My SD comes home in less than two weeks for the graduation stuff. I'm terrified that the anger I feel will boil over and lead to some altercation that upsets my wife and alienates my son.

Thurman, try to find the strength to put the past behind you. There will come a time when one or both of you and your wife are older, not in the best of health, or even not here anymore. Your son will likely to be happy to have older SS to help deal with these issues.

SD is not a stepsister, she actually is his sister (half sister to be technically accurate), young man is thurman's and his wife biological son.

i have the same thought as pseudo, he was much younger just recently, how is he 18 already?

his son is 18, he was about 15 when thurman started posting, time flies...

I wonder if the boy knows how his dad feels, as i recall SD and DS are pretty close

Good Lord, Thurman, when are you going to get some counselling for your completely unreasonable attitude towards your SD? Your attitude is not normal and it is poisoning you and your relationships. Let the anger go and be glad that SD wants anything to do with her brother, considering the hard time you always give her.
As to the care package, it is not anyone's exclusive right to give gifts of whatever sort and personally I think the more the merrier.

Thurman,

Just send your own package as well. If you really feel that strongly, upgrade the contents of your package. Really don't understand your anger on this, if SD is doing something nice for your son. Too territorial. And, what if you son gets a whiff of your bad feelings about this? Or your SD? Or your wife? It really is a nice gesture even though you are feeling she is usurping someting from you.

There must be more behind it but on this one, if you must compete, up the ante. Let her give the pens and pencils, you give him a gift card to Staples to replenish or a new phone or something. What's the big deal? She's doing something nice. Only in the land of stepparents and biological parents do people resent nice things being done for their children. Would you feel the same way if your neighbor showed up with a care package of school supplies? Or his kindergarten teacher? Or a favorite cousin?

Thurman.

I used to kind of see your side of things in some of your earlier posts, but you now sound ridiculous, petty and irrational.

*But, why about her? It's not a hate thing, even though I have to admit I don't like her. The reason is because I do believe she doesn't know her own role, and so I'm threatened by such things.*

I disagree with you - it is a hate thing.

As far as her not knowing her role... Maybe you don't know her role.

1) She is your son's half-sister and maybe your DS doesn't think in fractions and he considers her his whole sister.

2) She is your DW's eldest child.

3) She is your SD.

She isn't crossing any boundaries with you, especially when you say it would be alright for your other "blood" family members to treat your DS to a care package.

To give you the benefit of the doubt, it takes two make a mess of a relationship, but it sounds like the ball's been in your court far more than your SD's. As time goes on, your part of this disastrous relationship falls more and more on you. Where it may have been 50/50 at one time, it now seems to be about 90/10 with you being the one in the wrong.

thurman, I still remember a post by you about no counselor, clergy, friend etc could off you correct advise. They didn't understand step families. Well here they do and you have consistently received advice that you should let it go! Apparently you think these people are wrong too.
For some reason you dislike your SD and everything she does. What stress you have put on your wife, SD and bio son's life.

Actually, I think I sorta get it. (if I am correct)

She probably ignores or doesn't acknowledge Thurman...

**he drops the newspaper, she walks by as if it's not there...she isn't going to acknowledge him by picking it up.

If she does that, I can sorta understand how irritating it is because my SD kinda does the same thing when she puts her hand up to the side of her face when I am sitting at the dinner table, so she doesn't have to see me or allow me to see her. She is pretending that I am not there, that I do not exist. She whispers into her dad's ear to talk to him or waits until I leave the room or they are in her room. She rarely says a word when we are in the same room. I can totally see myself feeling as Thurman does if this never changes. I don't hate her either, but it is so very annoying that she treats me as if I don't exist, except when she wants something from me. In a way, I can also understand what he means when he says she doesn't know her place... there is a hierarchy in families.. parents are above children ~ regardless of age. When SD steps in to do things the parent is supposed to do, without acknowledging the parent (again, treating them as non-existent), that is also annoying. I can see how my husband might feel that way if my adult son took it upon himself to do something, like say, walking my daughter down the aisle for her wedding, without discussing it first and seeing if it was okay with everyone... just because he feels entitled... after all, he has been there her entire life. It may not be wrong for my son to walk his sister, but it should be discussed first.

However, I will agree with the others that it would be best to get some therapy to deal with your feelings Thurman. To me, the worse thing about the way you feel is that it places your wife in a position of being in the middle of two people she loves. It isn't right when two parents do that to their common child, but it's no better to do that to your wife.

What are the rules? Stepkids must pick up after themselves and others. Give me a break, she is not Cinderella.

Ima, leave your family out of it. This is Thurmans family. This kid is nice to her mom, and Thurman tries to shut her out.

"Ima, leave your family out of it."

kkny, I'm entitled to share my perspective/opinion & any reference to my family or situation is meant only to explain how I can understand how he might feel under certain circumstances.

If you don't like my opinion, skip over it and MOVE ON!

I don't think it's about rules or even roles or overstepping boundaries.

The anger has built up for so long, anything SD would have thought of as a gift to her brother would seem like an infraction to Thurman. Anything the girl does or does not do...period...is an infraction.

It bites Thurman's buns that his son has a relationship with this person (his SD) that he himself has a bad relationship with. It hurts and upsets him that DW and DS think SD is wonderful when he sees her as a spiteful little monster (I went and read some older post of Thurmans')

She comes 2-3 times a year for a few days and off she goes again. Why let someone he sees so little effect him so strongly? I think Thurman would be much happier and put much less stress on his health (stewing on anger for days/weeks can't be good)if he would seek ways to just let it roll off.

I mean really, what is Thurman waiting for? Is he hoping to someday during one of SD's visits to be able to jump up and shut 'See, see, she's the monsterous fake little brat I've always known her to be and boy did she have you fooled all these years'?

The day is not going to come, Thurman. In the meantime, you're the one being ate up by anger. You're the one everyone gets mad at each time a scene is made from your blowup or quiet pouting in a corner.

Who knows, maybe she enjoys pushing your buttons or maybe she has no clue she's doing so. In either case, it's you, Thurman paying the price, fuming in anger.

You don't have to play 'one big family', but for your ownsake you do need to learn how to handle your emotions during these visits. I think all you'd really deep down want is for daughter to love and respect you, all the time not just when she thinks someone is watching/hearing...and it hurts you very much to watch DW, DS and the SD have a relationship that you know you're not a part of. It hurts to see/know your son loves his sister no matter what.

You've gotta deal with these feelings, Thurman. As stated above, one day all that will be left living is SD and DS and they will be family and be there for each other. You're the only one suffering here, Thurman.

and yes, she may be nice to her mom & her brother. What does that have to do with Thurman? It's Thurman's feelings toward her that are being discussed here and I would assume her feelings toward him that play off each other & set the stage for why each time she is around, it is miserable for him... everything she does annoys him... and the first step in changing that is trying to figure out why it's that way.

Like it or not, relationships are a two way street. It's never all one side doing something wrong & the other side is the innocent victim. We all agree that Thurman's attitude seems quite unreasonable, but at the same time his SD may be doing things to contribute to the problem with him even though she loves & is able to be pleasant to her mom & brother. There is nothing wrong with exploring that possibility. If she is, he can't change it but he can change how he reacts to it. I'm not saying she has to be nice to Thurman or like him, I am only exploring the possibilities of reasons why Thurman feels the way he does.

Of course I could be wrong... in that case, sorry. It's just a theory.

Or maybe its because he wants his DW and his son and his family and no one else. He tries to isolote his wife from her DD, and resents when they have lunch. Some people make an issue out of little things because their agenda is that the person just doesnt belong.

I am hoping Thurman doesnt isolate his wife from her DD. Sounds like everyone has figured out how to work around him.

"When SD steps in to do things the parent is supposed to do, without acknowledging the parent (again, treating them as non-existent), that is also annoying. I can see how my husband might feel that way if my adult son took it upon himself to do something, like say, walking my daughter down the aisle for her wedding, without discussing it first and seeing if it was okay with everyone"

walking down the aisle is a major life event, sending pack of pencils to a college student is certainly not.

i also believe that your daughter will be walked down the aisle by whoever SHE chooses, no matter how your husband or your son feel.

it was said many times here that it is petty to want special place/seat/role at children/SKs weddings. weddings suppose to be for bride and groom and whatever they decide. If they decide to exclude people, they could do that too. that's a regular sentiment on this forum.

and why would your daughter discuss who will walk her down the aisle? Discuss with whom? isn't she the one to decide?

"I am hoping Thurman doesnt isolate his wife from her DD."
he tried to isolate his wife and son from SD, but it didn't work, everyone figured it out and they just live their lives happily while he is suffering in anger, therapy needed ASAP.

you are right kkny, one day parents will die and SD and DS will have each other. thurman is blinded by hate and can't even think ahead and be happy for his son.

Ima, you say you are exploring feelings, but you only see them from one side. Kinda makes exploration hard. Thurman sees every little slight, and wants to isolate his wife from her family. Thats wrong in my book. But go ahead, give him validation.

My Temple sent DD care package when she first started college, I guess they overstepped. LOL i have never heard that is is parents' job sending care packages.

I can see how my husband might feel that way if my adult son took it upon himself to do something, like say, walking my daughter down the aisle for her wedding, without discussing it first and seeing if it was okay with everyone... just because he feels entitled... after all, he has been there her entire life. It may not be wrong for my son to walk his sister, but it should be discussed first.

My brother walked me down the aisle, and I have both a bio-dad and a SD. The only person I discussed it with was my now husband; the only decision was which brother it should be! It was our wedding, our decision. Even worse, it ended up being my younger brother, so he hasn't even known me my whole life! Egads!

Thurman, you asked "Is this irrational?" Yes. You are upset because your SD bought pens for her brother? Seriously?!

"Ima, you say you are exploring feelings, but you only see them from one side."

No, I also see what everyone else sees. I only offered a different perspective.

"Kinda makes exploration hard."

Without looking at all sides, exploration is impossible. Nobody has looked at it from the perspective I shared. The perspective I shared is only ONE perspective. Others offered theirs. Who is to say which is right or wrong?

"Thurman sees every little slight,"

and this is the problem that should be addressed. Unless he digs deep to figure out WHY he does this, and he acknowledges that to everyone else, the things she does seem innocent enough & that he knows he feels threatened and is probably being irrational. Seems to me that he is looking for an explanation of why he feels this way when he knows it's not 'normal'.

"and wants to isolate his wife from her family."

Maybe I haven't read enough of Thurman's posts to understand how you come up with this conclusion. Seems to me that he is constantly wanting to figure out how to deal with his SD's visits because they make him miserable. He cannot stand to be around her. Everything she does annoys him. and he knows that it is just him, but doesn't seem to know how to deal with his feelings. It's easy to say "let it go" but when you don't know why you pathologically do things, it is not so easy to "let it go". That is like telling a person that uses food as comfort to "just deal with the crisis" or "only eat when you are hungry"... if that were the case, maybe there would be no obesity. We can just tell everyone to exercise & they would, and not eat junk food... we all have a pathological things we do & if they are unhealthy things, we need to acknowledge & learn ways to change.. and maintain an awareness to deal with it. For that, he definitely needs to get therapy... and have help.

"Thats wrong in my book."

I've said it before, you may care what 'your book' says, it may only matter to YOU. You have been on here for years with a one sided perspective on stepmoms.. have accused many of being TOW & have said mean & insensitive things time and time again. My book is different than yours. But, it's debatable who's book is right or wrong... that is subjective.

"But go ahead, give him validation."

You may call it validation, maybe it is. That isn't my intention and I am not justifying anything he has said or done... but there may be some validity to his feelings.

That doesn't mean the feelings are healthy and it's already been said that he should get help. I agree with those that say he is causing his own suffering & needs to get past this.

"Maybe I haven't read enough of Thurman's posts to understand how you come up with this conclusion."

He did in the past. Don't remember particular posts but he try to minimize his wife's contacts with SD. It didn't work, just caused more problems.

"Nobody has looked at it from the perspective I shared."

many people did in the past years, being understanding that if SD ignores him then maybe his feelings are somewhat justified, yet over time I think most people here started to see that it does not matter what SD does, it is not about SD, it is about thurman. It maybe was his reasoning years ago, but now it just does not make sense. Not wanting her to attend funeral or sending cards to his parents, now not wanting her have relationship with her brother. Com'n now.

I tend to agree with Ima. Thurman keeps coming back with what I feel are silly complaints, but that's not the issue. He knows they are petty but somehow can't get over them.

I understand. I have similar feelings about my SM. And there's just enough "truth" in the situation that I don't want to drop it.

The thing is, once someone irritates a spot it's kind of hard to ignore that spot, it's tender. Kind of like how FD keeps calling me naive. She's latched onto that perception and I doubt it will ever change.

"I tend to agree with Ima. Thurman keeps coming back with what I feel are silly complaints, but that's not the issue. He knows they are petty but somehow can't get over them."

And thats where it is his responsibility to take control over his feelings and reality. No one elses. It really doesn't matter at this point what SD does or doesn't do, past behavior etc. What kind of person would want to be around Thurman? He needs to own that his behaviors and thought patterns are destructive to those around him and he is trying to destruct relationships that have nothing to do with him.

At this point, none of all that really matters, he can complain, pick apart, he may have some valid complaint somewhere in there tucked far far away, but it still just doesn't matter. He doesn't get the right to monopolize and manipulate family relationships due to his feeeeeeeelings. He is not the gatekeeper and frankly, sounds downright creepy for how much he focuses on his SD.

No one in their right mind would establish a relationship with Thurman after the way he scrutinizes and analyzes her every move. This girl has every right to put guards up and keep him at bay. She also has every right to determine who she allows into her life. Even if he gets help, she still doesn't have to let him in. Abusive, creepy behavior still isn't a pass just because he married Mom.

I think he realizes that Nivea. And I think we all know how easy it is to misconstrue what's said here and only get one side of the picture. Thurman is easy to demonize. I agree he needs to own them. I personally think his complaints are silly. But everyone just attacks him and calls him creepy, destructive, etc... instead of offering him advice.

Sometimes "get over it" works.... and sometimes it doesn't.

People have offered advice, many times. It's not anyones responsible to give him advice and make him use it. Or even give him good advice, this is just a message board. I think it's a mistake to validate this kind of behavior, isolating a family member is never a good sign. And over stupid stuff like reaching for butter, or sending a care package, or talking to her Mom when she's changing. He asked for thoughts, he got them.

From reading more of Thurman's posts, it's not just here he has sought advice and he actually has (along with his wife) sought counseling...it's more he has not been able to find the help he seeks and/or can not follow through with the advice/suggestions he has received.

I get the feeling , for him, he all but goes into like a full mode anxiety attack at the mere mention his SD is coming, and then she gets there and his world just falls apart for him. It's not a desired or planned action. She triggers something in Thurman (for whatever reason to Thurman himself) that he is unable to control. Real or imagined slights or true defiant 'yank your chain' actions from the SD does not matter...it's the idea and presence of the SD that sets it off for him.

I don't think it would make a bit of difference if SD stayed at a hotel when she visited and Thurman only had to see a tiny bit of her. He'd still be obsessing, fretting over what was going on, what are they doing now ect.

It's all very 'real' for Thurman. And yeah, he knows it should not be this way, and he's said over and over that he can't stop it. There's nothing any of us can 'advise' to help him that is going to make any of it less petty, less annoying seeming.

He's tried normal family counseling and church counseling. He's not finding answers there, he's not being able to follow through with what is being suggested and what they are trying to do for him. He gets what they are saying, he knows what he is doing to himself and his relationships, but he can't make it stop.

I wish Thurman would make an appointment and have a complete medical work-up and be referred to a more degreed specialized professional than he has received before that might truly assist Thurman in working his way towards a more functional life.

Thanks to all of your excellent posts. There's a measure of truth, maybe more, to many of the posts.

(1) I didn't start out hating my SD. I married my wife when she was 8. The barrage of incivilities and meanness started when we were dating, but I thought she'd outgrow it. It kept pretty constant right through her high school years. It got better when she went to college, but I'd say she'd do 3-5 things that were disrespectful or uncaring every day she was home from college. As a young woman, she's a little better. but multiply all of those "incivilities" by hundreds and hundreds of days. Can you blame me for negatively interpreting stuff that seems innocent on its face?

(2) Now add this factor. It was a divisive force in our home and in my marriage. My wife is a great mother, but she is so defensive about her daughter and frankly, sees her as perfect. No chance to talk about issues, no opportunity for me to have a "voice" and say what the SD is doing that is bothering me. Imagine how frustrating that is.

(3) Add this as a factor. From the time my SD was small (7 or 8), she began to treat me as a sex offender. I'd come into the room, she would leave, unless her Mom was there. I thought this was something she'd outgrow, but she didn't. We're not on year 23 of it. Imagine being treated like that in your own home, and your wife not care when you mention that her daughter needs professional help. (I'd like to add that my SD is now almost 30 and still has no male relationship...I think she's gone out on one date...maybe she was molested or is simply afraid of men? Seems abnormal but Mommy gushes over her daughter's chastity rather than see that something could be wrong).

(4) Add that my SD doesn't respect me. I'm not talking about as a father figure, but even as a homeowner, and as my son's father. This is a person who can walk right by me in my own house and close the window curtains and not say anything while I'm sitting there. I can't imagine doing that in my parent's house...I've had so many battles with he not to correct my son when he was little when I was in the room. She really believes that she and I are on the same level and that Mom is the boss. That's her mindset. We've had battles over tv's, computers, etc. because she didn't or doesn't see me as someone that she has to answer to. Go to my wife-- she backed the SD-- confront my SD, she knew that she had my wife's backing. her attitude was largely "f-u". Imagine how humiliating that experience has been.

(5) Add those together, and that's the tip of the iceberg, and I'm carrying around a lot of hurt, anger, rage, etc. with no place to go with it. Pastors often have no understanding unless they have been in a stepfamily (they interpret with a biologically intact family in mind), and some of the counselors I've been to also seem woefully unread on stepfamily issues. This list has greatly helped me.

(6) Do I hate my SD? Sometimes. Do I wish it was just my wife and son and myself? Yes, every day.

I am sorry that it is so bad for you and I do understand from where you come. I have experienced and continue to experience many of the same sorts of incivilities as you. My SD is 26. I have never had anyone treat me with such levels of disrespect and contempt in my entire life.

My DH is like you DW and he comes to her defense too. It really used to tick me off because when I did bring up the incivility issues and the like, he would just tell me that it all was me - I was looking to find fault with her and she did nothing wrong. I do have to say that the more I bit mt tongue and said nothing, the more she irritated me. I actually don't care for her almost as much as you don't like your SD. I still cringe inside when I hear her voice. I bet she cringes whenever she hears mine. Unless it's a dinner or something, I just walk out of the room when she is at our house and find something else to do. It's the easiest and best way to handle it. I know that neither of us is ever going to like the other one and her dad shouldn't have to be hurt by being placed in the middle. I think you should try something similar because you will only hurt your DW and DS.

well almost 30, she clearly has been dating someone somewhere at some point, maybe not men maybe she is dating women, maybe she is not afraid just does not like men.

in any case just because she does not bring them home does not mean she is not dating. plus if she is in medical school she has no time for serious relationship.

i had somebody asked me why my DD22 is so pretty and has no boyfriend. somebody was not a family or a friend so i didn't have to say anything, all i said she has no time for it right now and maybe mentioned chastity. lol well not true of course

Kind of like how FD keeps calling me naive. She's latched onto that perception and I doubt it will ever change.

this is anonymous message board, hope it does not effect your real life, your posts express naive views at times, but it does not mean anything in real life. i don't think it is a good comparison.

I know all kind of people, some might be naive or crazy or strange, but i still get along with them. it is OK not to like something about the person, but it shouldn't effect the relationship. my SIL exhibits some strange behaviors, yet we have great relationship.

thurman on the contrary takes stuff too seriously and allows it to poison his life.

FD, you wouldn't.

Just because someone does not share your opinion does not mean their perspective is naive. And constantly harping "there goes Silver with her naive views again" would not be so irritating if you said it once. But running around the board saying it several times does get irritating and it does seem as if you are doing it to provoke me. I think it would be far more telling if you actually debated me.

I find it irritating, and once is one thing, more than once gets aggravating. I never said it has anything to do with real life. I'm sure you don't just up and tell people they are naive if they disagree with you IRL either :)

You don't seem to realize that others may have different opinions than you and they could be equally accurate. You don't think it's a big deal to call me naive repeatedly, you think Thurman takes stuff too seriously.

Ever entertain the notion that you may not be the end all authority on reality?

Thurman: I have not read all of the post. Your last one sounds like you really need someone with stepfamily experience. My husband and I attended a stepfamily conferance. We learned alot. The website is successfulstepfamilies.com This is a ministry founded by Ron Deal. He is very good at what he does. I think you would benifit from it a great deal. I hope you can find some help and peace for you and your family, I know we have.

"Ever entertain the notion that you may not be the end all authority on reality?"

And who says I am the authority on anything, it is just a forum where people post their opinions. Nobody has any authority, I can be just as wrong or just as right as anyone else. Take it or leave it.