WOW. I would tell them goodbye. How could you be obligated in any way to them? NO WAY they should get that kind of cash up front. RUN don't walk! If they have that attitude now, can you imagine what you will be dealing with when they have your money?

Run away.

You have no obligation. Mere layout ideas are not her "property"--only actual detailed drawings might be.

Where are you located? You should try Country Craftsmen in Uxbridge. $500 to come out and measure and do a plan--preliminary in-office plans from your measurements are free. Custom made so you can get anything you want and sometimes even cheaper than Lowes/HD.

$13k more? No question..... I understand mark up and more labor, but $13k more?

Did you sign anything? If not, I don't see how you have any obligation. I would also let the GC know also, since he is the one who recommended her.

I commend you for trying to do the right thing.

I think your obligation ends at the plan and the effort put into the plan. You are never obligated to employ someone unless your have created a contract with them. It appears you are still in a proposal stage so no contract obligation. In this situation I think I would pay a fee for the plan (if they will release it to you) and leave it at that. 30% would be way too much though.

Years ago, we went to several cabinet shops, got several plans and quotes but the one plan that we liked was from a shop whose cabinets we could not afford--way out of budget. There was one specific use of space with the plan that no one else had come up with so we really wanted to work from that specific plan. We explained the situation to the KD and asked to buy the plan. We then took the plan to a custom shop that was able to produce cabinets within our budget. The price of the plan was a small fraction of the price of the cabinets (maybe 5%--it's been a long time and several houses ago so I really don't remember).

So in your situation I would offer to pay a percentage of your budget for the plan if it is complete enough to work from (rather than asking them for their price). If the plan is just in conceptual stages I think at most, I would pay a nominal fee for her time and leave it at that. Regardless of whether they sell you the plan or not at that point you are clear to work with another shop to develop a plan to your liking.

Elements of a kitchen design can come from anywhere and are generally a joint effort. Unless they produced a plan that has elements that have never been done before the ideas are not really original just unique to your space. If there are truely unique aspects to the plan that you intend to use then you do have an obligation to compensate for that I think.

Wow. That's a lot. I can tell you that we consulted with nearly a dozen different KDs. Some of them only showed us the plans for our kitchen and would not release them to us without a fee (anywhere up to $500), others freely gave the plans to us. But none of them charged 30% of the kitchen estimate (basically ensuring you use her services). Morally, I felt no obligation to use any of these designers just because they provided (either visual or hard copies) of plans to us. In order to sell their services, this is something they need to provide in advance (even if its just a visual). And in my case, I had a very good idea of our plan before going to any of these KDs anyway (only minor modifications were made to the end design).

And we ended up using HD (Thomasville cabinets) rather than any of the locals we met with. They were just installed last Monday (with the exception of one damaged cabinet that we are waiting on a replacement for). So far, we are pleased with the customer service, delivery schedule, etc. and our decision to use them. I have heard of the HD/Lowes horror stories, but we've been pretty lucky.

I, would not work with this person any more. Ask her, if her, plans come in solid gold. Than run. She sounds like she, is trying to take advantage of you.

cobragirl, Have you priced out Ultracraft ? That is what we are getting for our house in their top line (Destiny), cherry, full overlay, raised panel, soft close hinges, full extension soft close dovetail drawers, 42" tall uppers, fully customizable sizes to 1/16" to height width and depth with no upcharge, crown molding, light rail. For our whole kitchen, cabinets are under 12k, plus 2k for installation. This includes 8 uppers (one with glass and wine cubbies), 2 cabs over the 2 fridges, 1 full height for oven/MW, 1 pullout broom closet 6" wide, 4 all drawer bases, 2 sink bases, 2 regular base cabinets, and other various pieces of end panel, filler, etc.

I agree with posters above ... 13k more than Home Depot is too much !! Also, we paid nothing until our KD actually placed the order.

Note: all cabinet orders are custom made at the time of order. Lead time for us was about 5 weeks. That has become an issue for us as we put the cabinet finalizations off too long in the build process. They came in a few days under their time quoted, yay !!

Read about Ultracraft advantages below ...

Here is a link that might be useful: http://www.ultracraft.com/

Have you looked at Shiloh cabinets? Very reasonable and there are two great dealers in eastern MA.

You must be dealing with a high end design shop rather than a "regular Joe" cabinet dealer. High end shops with a "name" don't operate on the same plane as folks do who are on a budget. Most individuals who seek their services do so in consultation with a designer and know a look that they want, let the shop do all of the work, and then write a check to their designer and wait for it to be done. That's a highly successfull and lucrative business model. It's just not one you are used to dealing with. That works well for most of their client pool. You are just not a match with this shop. Move on.

livewireoak, I think you hit it right as the other kitchen our GC is doing with them is an 80K kitchen. We told them up front that we were not in that kind of budget, but I think they still wanted as much money as they could get out of us. I do agree with offering to buy her plans, what she really did was take the plan that I had drawn and move the fridge to another wall to make the kitchen more functional, which I was very happy with and turn our peninsula into a second island. She also moved the range to the wall that overlooks my backyard which I was not happy with because it blocked my whole view of the yard! I am also glad to hear that this is a lot of money up front, when she asked for that kind of money, that was what really freaked me out. I am in CT, and I will definitely look into those other cabinet companies. The goal here is the most bang for the buck (and money for soapstone, and oil rubbed bronze, and whatever other beautiful pieces I can put in my kitchen!) without breaking the bank (literally, we are working on a reno loan!) Thanks for the help, I feel better now telling her that we will buy the plans but are going to get cabinets elsewhere.

While I agree with the other folks that this obviously is not the kitchen firm you want to deal with, I think maybe there is a bit of misunderstanding about the '30% of the cabinet cost to buy the plan' aspect.

My GC also did not provide a detailed plan until after I had contracted and paid the deposit for my cabinets. I don't think this is charging for the *plan*, it is more that the plan is considered part of the overall order and not a separate billable item. At least that's my interpretation.

My friend told me today that as far as she knows, there are different tier levels of Kraftmaid cabinets, & that HD sells the lower end & showrooms sell the higher end FWIW. Might explain some price difference, but probably not all of it.
Anyway, if you are in the Danbury area, Lisa at Kitchens by Design is really great - she sells the Omega/Dynasty line, which a number of folks on here seem to be happy with.