Would love feedback on our kitchen/office/pantry

15 years ago

Dh and I are getting ready to start a whole house remodel and addition. I feel like I'm in over my head with our kitchen. I would love feedback!

Here's a screen shot of the kitchen. It's a little messy because the plans include the demo of the existing kitchen.

Dh and I taped out the kitchen the other day. It was very clear that the frig is too far away from the sink and stove. It will need to be moved to wall with the sink. I'm not in love with the "view through" and will probably remove it. We live in the PNW and the designer added that to bring light from sunny side of the house to the front, which doesn't have as much light exposure.

As far as the "office" goes, this space is totally flexible. We can take out the wall and keep it open to the kitchen. I envision this space as having a large window seat. The window will be custom leaded glass (if budget permits). On the adjacent wall, we'll have a built in desk. Dh and I run our own business so do need a space for computer work, fax, and files. We are also open to the idea of moving the wall between the office and the pantry, and also moving the stove down and creating a separate entry into the pantry. Dh would prefer to do this, as he likes things to be symmetrical.

Here's a view of the first floor to help see the flow.

Thanks for any advice you can give.

Sort by:Oldest

Comments (8)

Buehl
15 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
Quick review....

Refrigerator & Sink...

If you put a prep sink in the island facing either the range or the refrigerator you will have solved the problem of the ref being too far from the sink. It's actually pretty close to the range.

Right now, your island is pretty much a "barrier island" b/w your sink and refrigerator...the prep sink also solves this problem.

Wait...is that square in the island w/a dot in the middle a prep sink? If so, you've already solved your problem! But, I would move the prep sink to the range end of the island so it's accessible from both the range & refrigerator/prep zone. It also frees up the rest of your island for those big projects like baking, crafts, homework, gift wrapping, etc. That's a great size for an island, btw.

BTW...a prep sink helps to separate the prep zone from the cleanup zone...always a plus, especially for multi-worker kitchens.

Pantry...

The pantry is too far away from the kitchen...plus I would not want to have to go through the office every time I needed to get something from the pantry. The pantry should either be in the kitchen (preferred) or just off it. In this case, the current office location would be a better location for the pantry.

I recommend one of two things:

(1) Switch the office & pantry and then open up the office from the room that's south of the current pantry. I don't know what that room is as the print on the second plan is illegible (at least to my older eyes!)

(2) As you suggested, move the range up (I think that's what you meant) to make room for a door into the pantry. But first, let's crunch some #s:

I think your kitchen is approx 18' wide. If so...

25.5" for sink cabinets + counters
38" for office doorway (30" door + 3.5" on each side of the door for trim + slight space b/w counter & trim)
36" for range
38" for pantry doorway
25.5" for refrigerator cabinets + counters
----------
163"

If the kitchen is 18' then...216" - 163" = 53" left for counter around the range. Leaving you 26.5" on each side...so 24" cabinet + 1.5" counter overhang + 1" b/w door trim & counters.

That actually isn't a bad idea...24" is the minimum I recommend on each side of a range or cooktop for working room, emergency landing space, and safety margin b/w the doorways and the range. Yes, you lose some counter space, but not that much plus you have a large island that is much more useful anyway. It also eliminates the corner & gives you a straight run of cabinets...preferable in many people's eyes (I like both; I don't really have a preference...at least not in a kitchen with so much room already.)

[Note: If your kitchen is less than 18' or maybe 17'8", then you might want to rethink either the second door idea or the size of the doorways...you could use 24" doors, but I prefer 30" doors whenever possible, especially for the office. You could put in a 24" door for the pantry & 30" for the office, but since symmetry is important to your DH you probably won't want to do that. Whatever you do, try to keep at least 24" b/w each doorway & the range.]

Island...

Do you plan for any seating at the island? I wouldn't advise it on the sink side...seaters would definitely be in the way! You could proabably have seating on the refrigerator side, but I would move the island north (toward the sink) at least 7" so the sink side aisle is 4'0" and the seat/refrigerator side aisle is 4'7". Seats on that side would also give your visitors a view out of what looks to be 8' of windows.

If you do put seating on the refrigerator side, moving the prep sink to the end is even more important to maximize your seating capacity. You could also put a couple of seats on the DR end.

Just remember these guidelines:

24" of space per person (so a 6' long island would accommodate 3 seats....2'/seat.)
15" of overhang/leg room for counter height seating.

Microwave...

Where do you plan to have the MW? I recommend on the refrigerator wall, especially as you don't want the pass/view through.

Dishwasher...

Think about moving the DW to the other side of the sink . When open, it could block the office doorway. I think I'd rather have the DW on the DR side.

Pass/View Through...

If you do keep the pass/view through, would you have seating on the non-kitchen side? Where is the extra light coming from there anyway? It actually doesn't look like it's a room...what I can see in the 1st pic says "Mech Rm" which, to me, means Mechanical Room...and I wouldn't want to look into that room! In the 2nd pic it looks like it looks out onto the stairs...???

Sorry, but that second pic is way too busy and pretty much impossible for me to read.

HTH!
rhome410
15 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
With the prep sink, I don't think your fridge to main sink orientation matters.

Will you have adequate counterspace left beside your stove if you added an entrance to the pantry? But I have to say, I wouldn't want all the pantry traffic going through the office, and it's a long trip during cooking or baking...and with armloads of things. It's also a long way when bringing groceries in. I would say that has to be fixed.

If that office is for your business is opening to the kitchen its best location?

Do you envision a specific purpose for the counter on the dining room side of the fridge? It'd be a great place for a baking center.
Related Discussions
Would love your valued feedback on kitchen layout please
Q
Comments (14)
lisa_a... I am flabbergast! The ideas originating from this forum never cease to amaze me. That folks are able to take layouts and turn it around in a matter of hours, or less, and churn out something completely different simply amazes and delights me. Alright, DH loves your layout. He likes having a dedicated area for our kids near us, and especially one that is directly across and in line of sight of kitchen. We will likely still make our guest bedroom upstairs our office so kids aren't mucking in our stuff (missed bills are not a good thing!). While we'll keep the main floor office for our kids. It just makes sense to give them a space for arts & crafting/reading/playing while we cook. It'll also be easier to help them with homework later on, and yes, definitely easier to keep an eye on them surfing the internet. Concerns... We do entertain and have BBQs often in our backyard during the summer months. The most used path to our backyard is via the kitchen. Will the 42" entryway be sufficient space for people to go in and out of? Also, I'm not sure about putting a down-to-counter dish hutch by that backdoor. Post-BBQ, it's often a steady stream of dishes back into the kitchen for clean up. Would maximizing counter space here be more practical for post-party clean up? Did you perhaps mean an upper cabinetry-only dish hutch? That would afford me both cabinets and counter space. I really like the fridge location in your layout. Makes for an easy path to unload and store groceries when we get home from shopping. Should prep sink be relocated to fridge end of island instead? The current layout has both sinks so close to each other that I wonder if it's worth the extra money to put in two sinks. Also, assuming my dishes are stored in cabinets/drawers near the sink. Is that too far from the dining area? If I store them in buffet counter area, then I'd be carrying them across the kitchen from dishwasher to dining area. No matter what, a trek seems unavoidable. Any tips on how to get around/minimize this? Note, one of my kids' task when they feel up to helping is to put away dishes in dishwasher. So I've spent the past few hours trying to rework the layout to see if I can keep the existing wall between dining room and kitchen. This would save us a good chunk of money since that is a load bearing wall, whose removal would require us to put in a recessed steel beam. I've tried making our current dining room into kids' office/play area with pocket doors (we're loving the pocket doors!) and our office the dining area with perimeter counter space, but just haven't been able to make it work. Sigh! So it looks like the money will have to be spent. One improvement though (I think). I loathe the narrow hallway we currently have. It just seems like dead space to me. So rather than keep it, I've modified your layout to put our coat closet and duct work in the existing hallway space instead. This allows for a wider entry to the dining/kitchen area. This new closet would also be deeper that what we currently have, so I'd be willing to forgo the closet nook as I can stuff things into the deeper closet and also in the main floor office. I'm also tempted to extend the powderoom to 72" so the sink can go across the toilet, thus making the powder room foot print narrower and opening up the entry to the dining room even more. If I do this, I can then reposition the door as debrak2008 suggested to prevent toilet views.
...See More
Would love some feedback on the schematic design of our home
Q
Comments (15)
I am a great fan of modern design. And we just finished building a modern house on a sloping lot, but our slope is uphill. Though we are almost empty-nesters, so we didn't have to plan for young kids in our house full-time. I understand how you will have to plan around your garage; we had the same issue - I felt at first like our entire house was planned around the driveway pitch and the garage! Obviously you will have railings on that stairway. Also consider one single flight with young kids, especially if the stairs are cement (or older people) - not a pretty sight if someone falls. In the stairway in our house, it's an L shape, so if someone falls, it's only half as far. Also, not to be too risk-adverse, those open stairs are gorgeous, but just waiting for someone to catch a heel or toes, or an entire foot for a kid. Our architect really wanted open stairs, but we just couldn't agree. We ended up with a zig-zag pattern. Our stairs are enclosed by glass on the lower side (to keep lower-level noise on the lower level), and I really like the way the zig-zag looks. I love the fireplace, but yes, with kids, also a problem when the fireplace is on. I also wanted cement floors, but husband didn't. So we have mahogany throughout, except for the entryway and bathrooms. I do notice that the 100% wood is harder on my feet than if we had some spaces carpeted; cement would be even harder on the feet. I like the lap pool - I assume that's what it is. Though again, you'll need to be creative re gating it off from the kids. The terrace area, I can also envision kids tipping off the end of that; adding a railing will detract from the view, but you may need to consider. We have a juliet balcony on the front of our house, and were originally going to have glass sides. Then I thought about how quickly that glass would get dirty, etc., so we have cable. I love it - barely noticeable from on the balcony or inside the house, but no need to clean. So that might be a thought if you decide to put in railings. The "hallway" between the living area and the island looks narrow. You know that the chairs will rarely be nicely pushed in, so consider that width. Also, consider little arms and hands reaching out to a hot stove, depending on how wide that island is. We have a very similar configuration, but our island is deeper, so don't have that issue. I love the view out our front when standing at the sink, and the view out back when standing at the stove - I'll bet that you will love it too!
...See More
Would love feedback on our kitchen plans/layout
Q
Comments (19)
Great ideas cpartist! Beachfamily, if at all possible, I think you should explore Matt E's idea of rearranging the traffic/storage, to have the entry nearer the 9' counter. That would direct traffic through the clean-up zone, but better there than cooking or baking. Then use cpartist's suggestions for the cooking appliances. With the fridge on the outside, the symmetry of the columns on each side of the entry isn't as important, so maybe the oven stack could be the center point. With this plan you've eliminated a corner, and provided a drop zone on each side of the entry. The MW could be a drawer or on a shelf next to the oven. If you don't need the oven as a center point it could be moved left, with the MW on the right (as we're looking at the plan), which would give you more counter space for baking. ETA, with this plan it would be easy to make range/cooktop the focal point by putting in the center of the wall, then moving the ovens beside the fridge. It's a few more steps from the garage, but no farther to the pantry or utility room.
...See More
Would love ideas on our kitchen plans for a new build!
Q
Comments (24)
In your latest, while the pantry access from the kitchen won't be quite as convenient, I think it will work. I think it's better than the one with only one entrance. Plus, it gives you a shortcut from the garage to the Garden room w/o having to go through the kitchen - which I can almost guarantee that people would do - and that they would cut through the main workspace instead of going around the island. I like it! I also like the idea of the appliance pass through - which makes me wonder if you could also use it as a staging area for things you want from the pantry to cut down on the amount of running around to the side door with your arms full - you might want to make it another foot or two wider to use it that way. Will the pass through have a door to hide the appliances from view when not in use (and to hide the interior of the pantry)? I do have two concerns about the pantry: #1 - You don't appear to have much real storage space. Do you really need that sink in there? I'd rather see that wall be all shelving for food storage. If you really want a sink, then put it on the opposite wall. Make the wall that's shared with the kitchen a row of cabs + counter with the sink. It would also make it easier for the pass through idea. #2 - The refrigerator & Freezer locations...First, the refrigerator may not open fully b/c it's against the wall and it might not quite fit b/c of the door frame/trim. You will need at least 6" b/w the wall and the refrigerator to allow it open fully - and then it will be opening into the doorway. Second, how wide is that aisle b/w the refrigerator and freezer handles and the opposite wall? You don't want to have a "pinch" point there since you will exiting with items in your hands/arms. I would try for at least 45". So, how much space do you really need in your office? I know that when I work from home, I rarely take up more space than that needed for a desk to hold my laptop + two large monitors + notebook space (yes, I still take hand-written notes!) You might want to take another foot or so of depth on the "bottom" to add to the pantry to give you a wider aisle. Inside the pantry, I would add another 6", at least, to the refrigerator/freezer wall so you can put a 6" pullout or similar b/w the refrigerator and wall. Idea! Why not take 13.5" and... From the wall, add 1.5" filler (to clear the door trim) Then, 12" pullout for brooms, etc. Then, refrigerator & freezer Then, shelving Finally, eliminate the "Broom" cabinet on the bottom and use that for more cab/counter space in the pantry.
...See More
becca06
Original Author
15 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
buehl--thank you so much for your time!!

We had definitely planned for a prep sink in the island.

I recommend one of two things:

(1) Switch the office & pantry and then open up the office from the room that's south of the current pantry. I don't know what that room is as the print on the second plan is illegible (at least to my older eyes!)

(2) As you suggested, move the range up (I think that's what you meant) to make room for a door into the pantry.

We can move the pantry to the office, but then would lose our window & light. We really are trying to maximize the natural light in the house. If we did switch the two spaces, we could access the office from the Master Bedroom. I think I'd rather have a separate entry into the pantry. Dh says it is 17' 11 1/2" across so we have enough space.

You could proabably have seating on the refrigerator side, but I would move the island north (toward the sink) at least 7" so the sink side aisle is 4'0" and the seat/refrigerator side aisle is 4'7".

I agree. Seating on the frig side with 4'7 of space. Prep sink moved to the stove end of the island.

Think about moving the DW to the other side of the sink

We're actually planning to have 2 dishwashers in the kitchen. I was either going to put one beside the sink and one in the island or both flanking the sink.

rhome410--thank you!!

The office probably isn't in the best location. Since it's a remodel, I'm a little stuck on where I can put it. I do have a rather large laundry room that could also house the office stuff. I've really been stuck over this office, as it does seem like an awkward space and I don't know how to make it not awkward. I could relocate the office and then put in a butler's pantry in it's space.

The frig side will definitely contain a baking center and also a pot/pan pantry.

The view thru would give a wonderful view of the stairs! It's only purpose would be to bring light to the front of the house. Dh nixed this idea a long time ago. I'm just unsure of myself and thought maybe the designer had better vision. I would rather have a solid wall in front of the stairs for artwork.
rhome410
15 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
It seems the office is messing up everything...what room would you prefer it was adjacent to?
rhome410
15 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
How about moving the laundry to the pantry, the pantry to the office, and the office to the laundry room and opening it with French doors to the great room?
bmorepanic
15 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
I confess to curiosity about the view through to the mech room or the stair landings - can't tell which it is.

It brought to mind the traditional reasons for a look up at a stair landing - which I'm sure isn't quite what you had in mind.

As contra-opinion, I don't mind where the office is shown and I don't mind the ref location - just add a sink in the end of the island towards the range...

I would not take the wall down between the kitchen and office, tho. There would be too much tendency for each one to subsume the other. And for sure a pocket door.
becca06
Original Author
15 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
Here's a better screen shot showing the kitchen with the stair landing. The mech space is under the stairs behind doors. The only mechanical item it will contain is the tankless water heater, so it's more of a storage space.

{{gwi:1826514}}
gizmonike
15 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
I too would move the pantry to the office, the laundry to the pantry (access from the master bedroom), & use the existing laundry for the office. As others have said, you want the pantry very accessible, and going thru another space is not practical.

You'd get a bigger office by using the laundry room & it should be a quieter location. We designed my office to be in a separate room near the kitchen, not in the kitchen, & it's great to be able to close the door.

Regardless of whether you leave the office as drawn or switch it to the pantry, consider using a pocket door if possible. We usually keep ours open for access but it's nice to close it off when entertaining; in your case you've got a sightline from your dining room straight in.

Consider putting your prep sink in the corner nearest your refrigerator & range; it's most handy there & you maximize counter space on both long sides of your island yet more than one person can still prep at the same time. We selected a five cornered prep sink (Kohler) and put a pullout faucet where the inside "corner" would be.

Would love feedback on our kitchen/office/pantry

Comments (8)

Buehl

rhome410

Related Discussions

becca06
Original Author

rhome410

rhome410

bmorepanic

becca06
Original Author

gizmonike

COMPANY

BUSINESS SERVICES

GET HELP

CONNECT WITH US

Would love feedback on our kitchen/office/pantry

Comments (8)

Buehl

rhome410

Related Discussions

becca06Original Author

rhome410

rhome410

bmorepanic

becca06Original Author

gizmonike

COMPANY

BUSINESS SERVICES

GET HELP

CONNECT WITH US

becca06
Original Author

becca06
Original Author