We will be selling our house soon for a job transfer. We recently made some upgrade reno's to make it more desirable.

We have a brand new roof that we got through insurance for damage during monsoon season last year, new tile throughout, paint, carpet in bedrooms, new light and plumbing fixtures.

When it comes to the HI, we will fix anything that is safety related. Nothing else. The people buying this home will walk into a turnkey house.

When we look for a home, we don't look at anything older than 20 years. We will not buy a home that needs fixing, updating, a new roof, etc.

I would not even consider a home with asbestos, radon, lead, etc. We don't want any problems and many people with homes like that overprice them and are unrealistic about what they can get vs. what the home is worth.

For smaller things like safety issues in terms of electrical or plumbing, it depends on how extensive the problem. I probably wouldn't consider a home that requires complete re-wiring or re-plumbing, but would think about one with a few issues like a few outlets that don't work. If it's the latter, I would ask for a credit at closing so we can fix it. I do not trust the seller to fix it in a satisfactory manner.

We follow a lot of the same philosophies that sparksals mentioned above

We did buy a house that tested above normal for radon, but we had the seller mitigate it to safe levels, so radon wouldn't be an issue for us.

Safety issues we always asked be repaired. If the price of the home correctly reflects the condition of the home then we don't ask for anything other than safety issues to be fixed. If an expensive repair such as a furnace or new roof were needed, and if it wasn't reflected in the price of the home we'd either try to negotiate after the inspection or we would walk. If the home is priced to reflect the fact that it needs some work, then we wouldn't ask for repair items unless they were safety related.

Because my husband and I have always enjoyed remodeling, we would not be adverse to "fixing" a lot of things. The problem we run into over and over again though, is that people price their homes way too high for all the updating/repairs the home needs. If we are looking at replacing kitchens and baths, our offer would certainily reflect that. I think most sellers have a really hard time being unbiased about their properties. They are unrealistic about what such repairs/updates cost and neglect to reflect that in their asking price. We find that pretty frustrating.
Major stuff like asbestos, lead, and radon are expensive repairs and we would definitely think twice before purchasing a home with those defects. Again, the price should reflect those negatives.

We only look at older homes in this area (50s-70s) and don't expect a lot. If major issues come up in the inspection that would be hard for the average joe to notice himself (and not noted in the listing/disclosure), such as a old/leaky roof, we'd ask for repair or credit. Despite the age, certain things over the years have to be updated on all homes such as copper plumbing and upgraded electrical. If it's not, we expect it to be reflected in the price/offer.

I go by what the contract says. Where I am, the contracts most everyone uses provide for a specific dollar limit (usually $500 to $1000)for repairs on home systems (plumbing, electrical, etc.), appliances, structural soundness, and watertightness and another dollar limit for rotted wood or pest damage (called WDO for wood destroying organisms and usually 1% of the purchase price). Home systems have to be in "working condition," which means they function like they were originally designed to function. This is all spelled out in the contract.

If repair costs for either home systems or WDO go over the contract's limits, then (1) the seller may perform repairs and the buyer must close or (2) the seller may reduce the price by the repair cost limits and the buyer has the choice of closing at the reduce priced or walking and getting his deposit back.

For me, if an inspection discloses an item that is not in working condition, not structurally sound, not watertight, rotted, or infested, then it goes on the repair list. There's no real downside for the buyer. The seller either repairs or reduces the sale price. If repairs exceed the contract's cost limits, the seller still has the option to close at the reduced price.

I feel like many realtors, buyers, and sellers don't pay much attention to what the contract says about inspection and repair and don't fully understand what each parties' rights and obligations are. A good contract should spell everything out and should tell the buyer what he should or should not put on the list.

We make our offer already taking into account the age of everything. We also make our offers "as-is" but the inspection clause is written so if there is something huge like a broken support beam, we have the right to renegotiate the price. The inspection is for us to know we are buying what we think we are buying and just not to have suprises. We don't ask for things to be fixed, nor will we fix things as a seller which should be obvious to anyone looking.

Gloria

I think it depends on the norm for the area. Here except for a few teardown replacements, most houses are old and in varying degrees of repair. I assume I will have to replace kitchens, prossibly windows, bathrooms. I do not want a leak or rotted wood. If the roof leaks unless it is not repairable I would expect them to repair it not replace it (many slate roofs). Our furnace was 50 years old and it worked just fine.

Actual asbestos is not a big deal. It is usually a 2k repair that the seller must make. My only stipulation is that it must be done before I take possession as I have young children and I would want the air tested. Asbestos tile is a bigger issue because you are essentially stuck with it. Radon I will not accept but that is not common in our area. Termites are the sellers problem both to eliminate and repair damage. I would not consider rewiring or replumbing but if an outlet is working that is enough. I do not expect GFI outlets everywhere. Lead paint is assumed

So with a normal older house I really do not expect much. Again if there is a hidden defect that is a different story. If the house has been updated and I am paying a premium for their decorating then I expect it to be turnkey and would deduct for anything that was not

My offer price would reflect adjustments for items which are out-of-date and not consistent with other homes in the same neighborhood and price range. But the price would assume all major systems (incl. roof, HVAC) are in working order with 5+ years of useful life left, and that there is no hidden dry-rot or termite damage. To the extent systems will need replacing very soon or for hidden damage, I would expect a significant price reduction.

On the house we're in now, our initial offer already reflected the 40-year old bathrooms, tiny kitchen and hole in the flat roof. From that point, we got an additional $35,000 price reduction from the initial contract price and our "as is" post-inspection sale price. The other prospective buyers over that house's 18-month listing period had all walked after the inspection. Well - we wanted a fixer-upper...

Sweeby,

How would you go about finding the "hidden" wood rot or termite damage"?

van356, I imagine the home and/or pest inspections would reveal the rot or termite damage that would not be apparent to the casual observer.

That's not the same as hidden. I think some people have different expectations.

sweeby wrote:
My offer price would reflect adjustments for items which are out-of-date and not consistent with other homes in the same neighborhood and price range. But the price would assume all major systems (incl. roof, HVAC) are in working order with 5+ years of useful life left, and that there is no hidden dry-rot or termite damage. To the extent systems will need replacing very soon or for hidden damage, I would expect a significant price reduction.

Funny you mention these factors because a house in our area has just been listed that is a direct comp for our house when we list. From the photos on the MLS, it looks very dated, pink carpet, pink walls, outdated light fixtures, etc.

I have an appt with our realtor tomorrow to look at it because I want to be able to see the differences so that we can arrive at a fair price for our house. We recently did alot of updates and we want to be able to justify a higher list price based on those updates. I don't want to be unrealistic, but at the same time, I think a house in AZ with brand new tile throughout and new carpet in the bedrooms justifies a higher price than a home with outdated pink carpet and pink walls.

Our realtor looked at the selling history and the people selling bought it five years ago. The photos were still online from that sale and the same pink carpet and pink walls are in those photos. So, we have a good reason to justify our listing price with all tile, updated light and plumbing fixtures and new paint. Whereas, the house listed has carpet that is at least older than how long these sellers have owned the house. Carpet is not desirable here, so our home would be more desirable solely for that reason.

artamnesia: van356, I imagine the home and/or pest inspections would reveal the rot or termite damage that would not be apparent to the casual observer.

ONLY if it is VISIBLE. Home inspectors, and/or wood destroying insect inspectors....contrary to a very odd but popular belief...can't see through walls....consequently, any "hidden damage or defects" will be just as invisible to the HI and/or WDI inspector as to anyone else.

It is therefore futile to expect otherwise.

Both my home inspector and WDO inspector use a mirror that allows them to see the sheathing under the siding, and they poke suspicious areas with a pick to look for rot. Using a combination of subtle exterior clues, a careful inspection with the mirror followed up by inspection with a pick, and a careful attic inspection, they can find some pretty serious decay that a casual observer would totally miss.

jebtb: "Both my home inspector and WDO inspector use a mirror that allows them to see the sheathing under the siding, and they poke suspicious areas with a pick to look for rot. Using a combination of subtle exterior clues, a careful inspection with the mirror followed up by inspection with a pick, and a careful attic inspection, they can find some pretty serious decay that a casual observer would totally miss."

However...only to an extent. The mirror used to see the sheathing under siding does not allow one to see ALL of the sheathing...and as such, unless the limitations are specifically explained to the buyer, can lead to a false sense of security. In addition, the attic must be unfinished, fully accesible and VISIBLE...which is often not the case due to lack of access, lack of flooring, and/or storage that obscures most of what would be the otherwise visible surface.

Exterior clues...subtle or otherwise are what is meant by VISIBLE. A good HI and/or WDI inspector will indeed be able to identify such visible clues, which is of course why a buyer should hire a professional. However, that is irrelevant when it comes to hidden damage or defects.

That said, VISIBLE clues are the only reason that an inspector will poke or prod...otherwise, he would have to poke and prod every square inch if the dwelling.....and keep in mind that poking and prodding can only identify damage in that specific area.

The point is that the operative word is VISIBLE.....once again meaning that one should not expect hidden or latent defects or damage to be identified.

logic--interestingly enough I recently dealt with a buyer that was very concerned about the words visible, latent, and hidden in a standard paragraph used by inspectors in the area to reduce their liablility from exactly what you are describing. I don't think they thought someone with "x-ray" vision was going to perform the inspection, but it was a real point of contention for them.

I've seen some really crazy requests lately from both the perspectives of a buyer's agent and a seller's agent. The market in my area never had a bubble to burst, but the national news sure has made people very nervous. It's been good for me to read that there are still people out in the world that understand no house will be perfect.

We make our initial offer based on what we feel we'd need to put into the property to make it function for us. We consider comps but don't really put much stock in them. It's not relevant for us but we do consider site value seriously & will spend quite a bit of time with due diligence. We visit the local court house & do title searches. We speak with the tax assessor's office. We speak with the zoning & building departments. We used to physically visit schools if they were new to us; but don't any longer because our kids are grown. The only dollar amount that matters, to us, is what's the total cost going to be for us to live in this house contentedly? If that number turns out to be too far off what the seller believes his property is "worth" then we move on & look for another. We're not emotional buyers.

As to the home inspection. We're not too fussy. We've already taken most everything into account when we made our offer. However, with the home we currently own...we'd anticipated the south-facing sunroom would require reroofing & had included that in our offer calculations. The HI revealed that the gutters had failed (due to lack of maintenance, probably) & ice had gotten up underneath the sheathing resulting in rot we'd not anticipated. So, we went back to the seller & negotiated a price reduction from our original offer for the price to completely reroof. We then contracted for the roof replacement ourselves because we wanted to upgrade the overall quality beyond what we'd requested from the seller.

Other than the roof, we didn't request the seller do anything except complete a fence he'd already started & had the materials ordered for. We didn't want to take over the project mid-stream. This wasn't part of the HI...we made our offer contingent on the fence being finished.

We wouldn't request radon, asbestos, or lead paint issues to be resolved by a seller. They don't scare us & we have a number of people we could tap to remediate anything serious.

Tricia