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metalmachinery

INTELLIFLO Programming Filtering Question

metalmachinery
16 years ago

My pool is a month old. Parameters set at startup in the intellitouch/intelliflo to run 14hours a day at 25gpm. Water is beautiful but seems like a long period of time to filter. I realize the pump is doing its job at low rpm low wattage & slow filtering is best (I can barely tell its on...very nice) Im curious what other intelliflo users are setup at? ie .. GPM's, number of turn overs, hours of filtering etc.

My chlorine is high and Im dailing down on the ecomatic which tells me perhaps the pump is on too long ???

pool is 14000 gallons, thanks in advance

Comments (49)

  • golfgeek
    16 years ago

    metalmachinery,
    If you're running at 25GPM all of the time, how, and what type of cleaner are you using?
    The draw back to the long, low gpm cycles is that the pool skimming action is usually marginal.
    The chlorine output is a function of the length of time the system is on. The salt generators are usually rated as producing so many lbs. of chlorine per day and this is normally based on a 24 hour cycle. Most salt generators lack performance(if the generator is pushing the max. pool gal that it is designed for) as the water temps increase and usage increases. Most people don't like to run their filter pump more than a few hours a day because of cost. You're pool is small enough at 14,000G and the run time long enough to mitigate the normal problems that I see during this time of year. You can lower the run time. You're getting 1.5 turns on your pool water which is more than enough.
    BTW, I run my 30,000G pool for about 18 hours at 15 gpm and my pool cleaner(Polaris 360) for about 3 hours during this cycle. Yes, the water is perfectly clear.

  • cohnhead
    16 years ago

    That seems like a long time to run your pump, but I'm new to this too. We have the Intelliflo, but we still have to run it at high speed to get the solar to work properly. The "low speed for 18+ hours" sounds great in theory, but as someone mentioned, your cleaner doesn't work well (my Navigator goes very slow at low speed) and that's not strong enough to get the water up to the solar, or at least that's what I've been told. Am I wrong? I live in San Diego and I run my pump for 5 hours a day (10-3pm)at high speed. Any suggestions?

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  • metalmachinery
    Original Author
    16 years ago

    I have lowered the filter run time to 8hours at low rpm and water is perfect. Setup parameters for the cleaner (barracuda g4) to run for 30 minutes 3x a day. also setup options for spillway, spa turnover etc. Pentair rep was a hugh help with programming and setting up the options, gpm, flows etc.

  • repair_guy
    16 years ago

    With 14k, I'd set a feature 3 to run 2 hours at 35gpm. That's 4200 gallons. Give the additional 9800 gallons another 6-7 hours to get a 25-30 gpm and about 200 watts/hr. The pool vac performs worst at low flow. Kreepy Krauly does real well at 25gpm.

  • btreinders
    16 years ago

    Remember that running the pump at the lowest flow rate for the longest amount of time to get the desired turnover gets you the most savings on electricity for the most part.

    I have the 3.2 Variable and if I run it for 24 hrs at 15 gpm I get 21,600 gallons of water moved. That would cost me .150 kW x 24 x $.15 per kilowatt = $.54 since my pump uses 150 W at 15 gpm.

    If I move that same amount of water in 8 hours the calc would be:
    .550 kW/hr x 8 hr x $.15 per kW = $.66 since my pump uses 550 W at 45 gpm

    In 6 hours it costs me:

    .940 kW/hr x 6 hr x $.15 per kW = $.85 since my pump uses 940 W at 60 gpm

    I bump my gpm up for two hours a day at 1/2 hr increments to run the cleaner and skimmers and take that increase in water movement out the total calc for the pool turnover.

  • golfgeek
    16 years ago

    cohnhead,
    Solar does not fit well into the energy efficiency equation. First, solar forces the pool equipment to run during peak useage hours. These are the most expensive hours of the day. Second, it requires a little more HP to flow it up to the roof.
    If you have an intelliflo and are only running it on high speed then you are not getting any benefit of the intelliflo pump. Find the optimum flow rate for the solar you have. Ask the solar company to give you these flow rates. Adjust your pump accordingly. It should not be "high speed". The beauty of the pump is the ability to adjust the flow rates/ RPM's to the optimum of your needs. Good luck.

  • repair_guy
    16 years ago

    golfgeek. Where are you located that your meter has a watch on it? Granted my SCE is going to implement smart meters soon, but the last I saw, meters went in circles without knowing the time of day and are not connected to any central station for monitoring.

    Many people buy into this propaganda from the utilites that it costs more to run during peak hours. It's bogus. Yes, in the long run, if everybody uses in the peak hours, the grid has to buy additiona power on the spot market which, in theory does cost more and will be passed down at some point, but it does not cost more to run at different hours on a given day with a standard meter.

    We should all do our part to conserve which is why we are hogh on these pumps. But, to say it cost more to run in the middle of the day is false as all areas of the country do not work that way.

    I still disagree with the solar idea you stated. The 3.2 will pump up two stories and consume maybe three times the energy of it's normal low watt run. But, that 3x is about 500 watts and still way less than any standard pump which is about 2500+ watts.

  • golfgeek
    16 years ago

    repair guy,
    Forgive me for a poor choice of language. You are correct regarding SCE. I could have been more specific in stating their teired system. Peak hours are those with high useage and ultimately most expensive for the utility company.

    My point to cohnhead, as I understood his post, was that he was running his Intelliflo(don't know which one, 3.2? or 4x160?) at "high speed" (3450RPM) for 5 hours/day. This makes no sense and provides little $ savings based on the capability of the pump. Solar applications generally don't require that much HP (3) or that much flow to operate efficiently.

  • longhorn_tom
    16 years ago

    don't get hung up on the time factors, at worst the intelliflo is 30% more efficient than a standard induction motor. the more you slow down the intelliflo the more you save. it's that simple. I set up these pumps all of the time, and there are however considerations, skimming action and cleaners and such. even if you don't have an automation system, you can set up the feature modes directly on the pump to accomodate these things. ie., higher flow for a cleaning cycle, or solar panels. if you have an intellitouch, it gets even better. you can set up a custom flow whenever there is a call for heat, either through solar or a standard heater.

  • cohnhead
    16 years ago

    golfgeek,

    and everyone who has commented, thank you for the info. I spoke to my husband, who handles the pool details, but doesn't have have the time to research the pump. He says that we aren't running it at the highest, (although the cleaner sure moves through the pool pretty fast) and that he does understand the "variable" part of the pump.

    However, since I was worried that 5 hours running at pretty high speed wasn't enough to turn the pool over at least once, he has added 3 hours of just having the spa-overspill on (same pump) at a very low speed. So now we are running it a total of 8 hours. (BTW, it's a pretty small pool: 32x13.)

    Our problem is with the salt chlorinater. It's a brand new pool and we initially had salt added on 8/19 (4 bags from the pool company), then another bag 8/23, and four more bags on 9/1. After the last four bags were added the salt unit "light" still read Red "low, add salt". So we ran the pump on low all night because of a party we were having the next day, and the next morning the salt "light" was green. (Hence my conclusion that pump time = good chlorine levels)

    However, in the past two weeks since then it has become "red" (meaning add salt)again and the "cell" light has been completely off (not red or green). My husband assures me that this is not related to the pump time, but how much salt is in the pool. Of course I've left a couple messages for the pool company with no reply. Anyone have any input on this? Sigh...

    Thanks!

  • stevenbr
    16 years ago

    Salt doesn't disappear.

    Unless you've unusual amounts of rain to dilute your water, I'd be looking for a leak.

    Do you have an autofill? If so, turn it off and monitor the water level.

    Good luck...

  • cohnhead
    16 years ago

    Stevenbr, no rain. I live in San Diego, we don't get any rain here :-). Well, I take that back. After 138 days without rain it did rain a few weeks ago for a couple hours. But that was before we got the green light (good salt level) on 9/2.

    Hmm, a leak. I never thought about that. Where could it be leaking from? I just spoke to the supervisor at the pool company and he said they'd get someone out to look at it.

    We do have autofill, but we haven't lost any water that I know of.
    thanks for the help.

  • bryanclearvalley
    16 years ago

    Cohnhead,

    SD here too. Love the no rain. The amount of salt is in direct relation as to how big your pool is. Aquasalt, on its bag, indicates a 40lb bag will raise the salt ppm 440ppm on 10K/Gals. The ideal range for salt is 2800ppm-3500ppm.

    ALso, if you have used the pool, backwashed it (or have a leak), or have other splashout, then the salt will leave the pool. It DOES NOT evaprotate as most people think. Only pure water evaproates.

  • stevenbr
    16 years ago

    I'm not saying it is, but your pool could be leaking through a suction or return pipe, or around a fitting in pool structure.

    If you have your autofill on, you won't realize the water is leaving, bc it's always refilling it for you... which MIGHT be an explanation for losing salt (if indeed you are losing it)

    good luck...

  • jennifer_in_clyde
    16 years ago

    Your salt cell also may not be very accurate at reading salt levels...I know mine is not!It constantly tells me salt is low, or there is no salt - but my clorine output is fine and seperate salt tests tell me salt is right about 3000 ppm. Pentair told me the salt readings are often miscalibrated from the factory. You may want to get your salt tested seperately.

  • cohnhead
    16 years ago

    stevenbr,
    you were totally right. I finally got a pool guy out here and (thanks to you) suggested to him that we might have a leak (otherwise, where would all the salt be going) So, we marked the water level in the skimmer and turned the auto-fill off. Guess what? By the next day the water level in the skimmer was down almost 2 inches! Duh! (I guess the water just got absorbed into the ground since we didn't see any anywhere.)

    So, he had the plaster company come out and they said there was a leak where the skimmer throat met the flagstone, and they sealed it with grout. So, we'll see if that fixes the problem.

    Oh, and the pool company is going to replace my SWG because even with more salt, the reading wasn't matching the actual tested levels in the pool.

    What would I do without you guys?! Thanks so much!

  • stevenbr
    16 years ago

    cohnhead,

    glad you found your problem...

    i'm not sure how much i'd trust the reading on your swg in the future... even with a new one.

    if i were you, i'd get myself a real good water testing kit, and you'd be surprised at how well you can understand what's going on in your pool... and save a lot of money by not listening to the "pro's" at the pool store (i mean, it is their job to sell chemicals, right?)

    you'll quickly learn that some chemicals disappear (like chlorine and acid), and some don't (like salt and cya).

    best of luck...

    and keep that autofill off a while to make sure they found all the leaks!!

  • jammer
    16 years ago

    I am a new pool owner. Everyone associated with my pool installation claims that I need at least one turn of the water every day. Why? The Department of Energy says that a few hours a day is sufficient and that you don't need to turn over all of the water every day. If the water is clear, is that enough? Is that the goal, clear water? So if 3 hours a day on a low speed (20GPM) setting plus an hour for skimming and cleaning at higher speeds gets it done is that OK?

    Also, is 150W at 15 GPM for real (btrienders)? I have the InteliFlow 3HP. At 15 GPM, my pump is taking 1,895RPM and 394 Watts. Why the disparity? I have the 3" suction plumbing and the larger filter. My equipment is 20 feet from the pool. Is there something wrong with my pump?

    Thanks!

    Here is a link that might be useful: Running Swimming Pool Pumps Efficiently

  • socalhockeymom
    16 years ago

    We are building a new pool, approx 26000 gal., with one water feature (spa separate). We are inclined to go with the intelliflo 4x160 because of the immediate $400 rebate from SCE through the end of this year combined with the energy/cost savings over the life of the product. Our PB, however, is saying its overkill and is pushing the whisperflo. Any advice is appreciated.

  • smogtek
    16 years ago

    Not meaning to hijack, but I'm in the market for an Intelliflo as well.

    I'm another SCE hostage and between running our 2hp Whisperflow from 10-4 for the solar gain during the summer and keeping a 2600 sq ft house at 78 degrees, you DON'T want to know what my SCE bill is!!!!

    I would like to know if the 3.2 will work for us as we have a 2-story home and solar panel s on the upper and lower roof.

    It seems to me that once you get the water flowing through the solar panels, suction will take over and pump speed could be reduced. Am I wrong?

    Another option I've considered is installing a 3/4hp pump for pool turnover, but using the 2hp on initial start to get the solar going. I figure that programming the Intellitouch to 1st turn on the 2hp, then switch to the 3/4 hp would work.

    The 3/4hp (wired for 220) amp draw is almost half that of the 2hp, so it should show some savings.

    Any input would be appreciated.

    Matt

  • repair_guy
    16 years ago

    jammer,

    At those low flow rates, suction line, filter size don't mean a thing. Pumping at 15gpm draws about 120 watts at 890rpm. That is what mine draws. You should be in the filter mode and press the down arrow to review actual numbers. Wait until priming passes and then wait for the ramp down to complete. If you're drawing what you say you are, you have an issues somewhere. Plugged impeller, dirty basket, really dirty filter, etc.

    One turn per day is optimal. Prior to IntelliFlo, most pools turned 2-3 times per day and actually filtered less as the pass through is too fast. With the slower turn, filtration is far greater so one turn is what is used. Even if your pool apprears clear with less than one turn, it will show up somewhere. Algae growth, bacteria, etc.. It is far more than clear water. If you stagnate your pool and do not get suffucient sanitizer contact with all areas, you will have issues.

    The Dept. of energy may be well intentioned, but consider the source. They have an agenda. The pool industry is going to respond by sticking up for what we need to make our industry a safe one. We embrace technology and say a pump like this one will work even with the high learning curve. Now we're there, and we get comments like "if the water is clear, isn't that enough". Regulation will soon say you can keep cool in your shower, why do you need a pool?

    In California, we lead the way on pool standards. We have low emission heater when the nation does not, we will soon outlaw one speed pumps when the nation does not. We have the strictest barrier and main drain entrapment laws.

    If the industry is on common ground on an issue, I'd say go with it.

  • landa_mac
    16 years ago

    Just thought I would share some real world IntelliFlo cost savings. My father replaced his 1.5HP pump with an IntelliFlo a little over a year ago in West Central Florida. Here are the results:

    8/29/05 to 7/29/06 - KWH = 24,583; total cost = $2,753.71

    8/27/06 to 7/31/07 - KWH = 17,334; total cost = $2,021.25

    KWH savings = 7,249; cost savings = $732.46

    Imagine the cost savings in a state where electricity costs more (like California)!

  • jammer
    16 years ago

    Repair Guy, I'm drawing over 3x the power you are at the same flow rate. I'm viewing the power on my IntelliTouch control panel:
    From Memory: Menu>Settings>Equipment>IntelliFlo>IntelliFlo1>IntelliFlow Status.

    I do wait for it to ramp down. It only ramps down to 394 Watts at 15GPM and 1,895 RPM. All of this information is all listed on the panel on one screen.

    Should I be looking somewhere else to view the power consumption? If not, any ideas how can I approach my problem?

  • repair_guy
    16 years ago

    As the actual gpm on this pump is calibrated through temperature, I'm guessing you do not have the pump programmed correctly on actual water temp. The 15 gpm you are seeing is not true. The only way gpm can be wrong is if the temp is off.

    Do a check of the actual water temp and compare to the water sensor reading on your panel. Also, do a check on the actual pump without the IntelliTouch. The info is in pool data. After that, set to manual, arrow down to set flow, press select, set to 15gpm, press enter, press start/stop. Once the pump clears prime and settles in, you should see the actual pump performance and there is no way it is 1800+ and 390w at 15 gpm. If it is, you need to start looking for the usual suspects of a hard working pump. Suction leaks, valve issues, dirty impeller and baskets, dirty filter. On that note, is your pump in a dirty filter error? What is the % number. It may b managing rpm and not flow due to an ignored service system soon alarm.

  • jammer
    16 years ago

    Repair Guy: Thanks for the information. I checked all of the information at the pump. In manual mode after priming at 15GPM it was pulling 390 watts running at 1800+ RPM. The filter is brand new and at 0%. There is no alarm on the pump. I need to purchase a thermometer to verify the water temp, but it seems to be right, it certainly is not off significantly.

    I turned off my auto-fill water supply to see if I have a leak anywhere. My baskets are clean. How can I check for suction leaks, valve issues, or a dirty impeller?

    I'm also going to call Pentair and see if they have any suggestions.

  • tmoss
    16 years ago

    Jammer,
    What's your filter psi reading? I know when I run my legend cleaner on a clean filter at 15 gpm I run approx 650 watts. The cleaner works as designed with a filter pressure of 18 psi. the The pump has no flowmeter, rates are based off tables derived from pump curves based on power used. Readings can be quite inaccurate at low and high rates.

  • sweetspot
    16 years ago

    Here's the instructions concerning temperature. At 20 GPM I'm at 1,025 RPM and 137 Watts.

    Temp" is only for the accuracy of the flow sensor. Temperature accuracy is not
    critical, just enter an approximate temperature. When the IntelliFlo is connected to an
    IntelliTouch system, water and air temperature information is provided by the system
    sensors. The flow reading on the IntelliFlo is Â0 / +2 GPM. The closer the
    temperature to the actual temperature, the more accurate the flow reading on the
    IntelliFlo control panel LCD will be while itÂs running.

  • tmoss
    16 years ago

    Keep in mind the intelliflo and intellitouch do not display actual gpm, only the current setpoint. Thus, a setting of 15 gpm may result in much higher "actual" flow rates due to plumbing deficiencies, plugged filters, etc. In my case 15 gpm setpoint running a dedicated legend cleaner is actually flowing 25 gpm to an open bucket. Attaching it to the cleaner creates even more backpressure, causing the pump to speed up to pump what it "thinks" is 15 gpm. The result is the cleaner flies around the pool and I have to open the wall relief to get it to run properly. I was convinced all was well once it was explained to me how this pump actually "calculates" flow rates. It doesn't measure it. Not understanding this difference can create much confusion. I was informed that the midrange of the pump's performance results in the greatest accuracy in setpoint vs actual gpm. However, the low and high ends of the pump's range result in greater inaccuracies. This appears to be true on my pump.

  • productmanager
    16 years ago

    Repair Guy,

    I invented the IntelliFlo and have to say that you are getting it... I am impressed and hope we will meet some day somewhere and compare notes. You can imagine that bringing this pump to market has been long and difficult to say the least. The discussions your having match the dream I had for this product and I greatly appreciate you all taking the time to understand it and gain the benefit.

  • repair_guy
    16 years ago

    All right, what's your name and what's your job offer from the other thread. Keep in mind, there are people at Pentair I've known for 20 years so you can't snow me.

  • deeker
    16 years ago

    Productmanager and repair guy,
    He did invent the IntelliFlo.

    I was there and challenged him the whole time. At first I had no idea what he was talking about (there are many times I still do not know what he talking about) - Actually thought he was plant from one of our competitors and send to us to ruin our business when he began talking about the IntelliFlo!! I was from the old school: big is good; bigger is better and if it is noisy that why god made valves.

    Anyway the rest is history and I have never, never seen a product that has had nearly the impact on the equipment pad that this product has had.

    Also I heard he has been back to tinkering in the bowels of the plant. He and his elfs have some pump stuff that cannot be discussed but will completely change forever the pump market. By the time our competitors figure what we are doing now (and it has been 2.5 years since the product introduction) we will be on a completely different path.

    Repair guy - I also have been very impressed by your knowledge and professional way you address questions and advise the folks on the board. You have really helped many people.

    Now if only we could get our customers to understand as fast as the homeowners..............
    Deek

  • cliff_s
    16 years ago

    You shouldn't run your filter pump any longer than it takes to keep your water clean. This can be as little as 2 hours a day depending on where you live. The procedure is to keep reducing your pump run time until you feel it is just keeping your pool clean. You can always turn the pump on during a storm or other event if it is necessary. It makes no difference if you use a pump on low speed for a longer time or the higher speed for a shorter time it is the quantity of water that passes thorough the filter which is important.

    If you have a S.W.G.(Salt Water chlorine generator), then you have another problem. The S.W.G. usually takes many hours of pump running to generate enough chlorine for your pool. This far exceeds the time necessary to keep your pool clean. Using the slower speed on your pump, in this case, will save on the electric bill because the amount of chlorine that is generated is not dependent on the amount water flow.

    Cliff s

  • calihom
    16 years ago

    Jammer,

    I just checked my settings and at 15GPM I too am at 1800RPM and 356watts. I would be interested in what you find out!

    I checked all items identified in the thread as potential issues and everything looks fine. Only thing is water temp which I need to check as well.
    Thanks

  • ron_2007
    16 years ago

    I checked my settings and at 16GPM, I am at 1830RPm and about 370 watts. It seems like our readings are very similar. Maybe there were some sort of firmware change that changed the parameters. I never got readings as low as some people has mentioned.

  • repair_guy
    16 years ago

    That gpm can't be right. You need to check the programmed temp. I just did one today that came in at 35gpm, 409W and 1750rpm. This is the typical setting.

  • ron_2007
    16 years ago

    I checked the temperature against another thermometer and the water temperature is correct. I don't know why their is such a big difference but at least three of us on this board has similar readings. My system is only about 6 months old and even after back flushing my filter the readings is still the same. I never saw readings that low.

  • repair_guy
    16 years ago

    I think if you re-read these posts, you'll see the discussion centered on the inefficiency of the plumbing system in general. I'm doubting the pump is an issue. You could put 50 pool owners in a room and ask them their readings a t a specific programmed setting and they will be different. As the pump is the only thing on those 50 pools that is pretty close to constant the only thing you can do is chalk it up to system inadecuacies.

    All 50 pools are not plumbed alike. One extra fitting can be equal to 10' of pipe in terms of head loss. So a setting to 30gpm will reflect, on some pools, a pump that works very efficiently and in others a hard working pump.

    For your case, you need to check the obvious for a hard working pump. Yes, the basket may be clear, the filter clean, the temp set is right on, but there are others. The impeller could be obstructed with stuff too. Most owners are not able to clear this obstruction but you can try that.

  • repair_guy
    16 years ago

    I put one in today with a gpm of 24, an rpm of 1070 and a wattage of 147. All on a 40 year old pool with 1.5" plumbing. Go figure. The h/o is thrilled to now be consuming less than 1800 watts per day from his previous 10,800 watts per day. And, to boot, the pool runs 12 hours a day as opposed to the previous 4 hours. This is the model pool for Pentair's 90% claim. No spa, no heater, no sweep, no salt system. Pump 10' from the skimmer.

  • calihom
    16 years ago

    Repair guy

    So I rechecked everything and recalibrated water and air temp. Water was about 5 deg off. Now at 15GPM readings are 1555 rpm and 263watts.
    Next I tried to optimized the best flow possible- switching to spa mode (15' from equipment and 2 1/2", 3" lines)the results were 1435 RPM and 225 watts.
    I have rechecked everything and still 300-400rpms out from your standard. Ony thing I can think of is checking for a dirty impeller - whats the best way to check that?

    Also have another question for you. I am trying to identify my itelliflo's "true" top end speed. I have noticed that at 110-130 GPM the max RPM is 3450. Should I be setting my top speed to a setting where the 3450 drops? I think the sweet spot is at 103GPM and 3410RPM. Does this make sense? I don't want to program my SPA to 130GPM when 103GPM would give me the same results.

  • repair_guy
    16 years ago

    I'm not so much concerned with rpm #'s. I only use them to determine where I am in set up mode when I do the manual trial.

    When I look to set the max gpm (for a spa jet trial), I ramp it to an estimated gpm based on the most efficient velocity for a given pipe size. It is then that i look at the rpm to see where we are. If it's at 3450, I'll ramp down until I see a change in that rpm number. At that point, we know anything above that gpm setting is just waste.

    Still, max rpm is not always the effieicent speed. You now look to the filter psi. Where is it and how is it responding to the pump flow change? If I'm at 20+psi and I can ramp down the flow without changing the jet action, I'll keep going down as far as I can. I don't bottom out as I know my filter getting dirty will cut flow. It just establishes my range and I find a good spot in that range.

    Your previous numbers did not make sense. what you are reporting now is more realistic. Again, you're really looking a wattage. What is the consumption and is it where you want to be? Under 300 is awesome as long as you are seeing results in the pool and who cares what the rpm or gpm is. Those are all subjective to the installation.

    15gpm is a real slow turn and most are not programmed for that. But, if you're getting good skimming go for it. I try not to program under 20.

    As far as the impeller goes, we use a service set of tweezers. They're long and with the proper, educated feel of what it is supposed to be, you'll know if it's blocked. As times, it will feel clean but palm pods, toy gun pellets, etc can jam the inside of the impeller and you'll never know unless you pull the motor.

    Where are you located?

  • calihom
    16 years ago

    I am in the Dallas TX area. Thanks very much for your feedback.

    Here is my filtering setup. Filter time 12hrs. 30,000 gallon, one turn over.
    Readings are 2355rpm, 815watts at 41gpm. I use just my skimmers only and have a D.Dolphin to clean the pool bottom and sides. Seems to keep it very clean.

    Maybe I will try to get down to the 30gpm range for filtering and see what the results look like.

    Your right- at 15gpm skimmer action in VERY minimal.

    One other question - my last- is the 4x160 any more efficient than the intelliflo. I am using my 4x160 for deck jets and bubblers and it seems to me in looking at the rpm/watts they are lower numbers than the intelliflo for pool/spa. I thought they were the same pump overall with different programming feature - please confirm.

  • repair_guy
    16 years ago

    I posted a response to another efficiency question on Fri, Dec. 2 on this thread. Check that one out when comparing the two pumps. There is a difference in efficiency.

    RE: Intelliflo 4x160 vs. Intelliflo3.2kw

    Our pump installations here in California are subject to inspection from Pentair and the utility and 41gpm is not what they're looking for. You can reduce that to about 30gpm by adding 4.5 hours to your time. Your costs will go down exponentially. If your sweep is not running at that flow, set a feature with the appropriate flow and account for the added gpm and reduce your total time to keep it at 30gpm.

  • elec57diesel
    15 years ago

    I have the intelliflo VF and when I set up the filer schedule all it says is running schedule and will not start. Howver if I go to any of the other items like Vacuun, Manual, backwash it will start and run. I have set all the setting back to the defaults so it will run 24 hrs. and all the display will say is Filter, time of day, GPM shows 0 and it says Running Schedule, power light is ON and Start/Stop light is on. Has anyone else run into this problem? I have tried all setting and can not get it to run in filter mode.

  • repair_guy
    15 years ago

    If it says running schedules, it has a program and it is not in that window at the moment. Have you recently changed the start time? If you did, it defaults to stopping the next minute. If you had a start time of say, 9am and an stop time of 8pm and you decided that was wrong and changed the start time to 8am, the stop time will default to 8:01am. You need to reenter the stop time. The pump may be running schedule for one minute a day. The vac and backwash modes would work as those are set in a different parameter. From the filter mode, you cannot initiate a start unless you hit F1, F2, vac or backwash. All of those need to be done with the filter mode lit and the start/stop lit or it will turn off and default to stopped. but, it does not sound like you are there.

    Check the programming and also make sure the program is enabled. you may have the program in there but it could be disabled.

  • maxdel
    15 years ago

    For me the problem was that I did not press Start/Stop. I had put it into Filter mode but did not realize I also had to Start/Stop it. Previously I had used Start/Stop for manual mode and to stop the pump while it was running. Like a lot of the Intelliflo interface it is not intuitive and needs someone with no understanding of pools to help make it more user friendly.

  • repair_guy
    15 years ago

    If installed by someone who knows what they are doing, they will tell you to never walk away from the pump without making sure the filter and start/stop buttons are lit.

    That is as simple as we have found to make it easy. It solves about 90% of all problems found.

    After about 35 installs, we found that people were turning the pump off and then prior to using the feature 1 or 2 and then the pump would turn of to the stopped position. The same rule applies. Features need initiated from a running position.

  • azpoolman
    14 years ago

    Repair-guy,reading some the posts and thinking maybe you can help. I am a pool guy who has installed several 4x160 with Intellicom mating up to Compools etc. Installed my first VF the other day. Stand alone install 10K with in floor cleaning system & SWG that needs 30 gpm @ flow switch. Called tech and the advised not using the standard filtering mode but instead to use the features 3-9.
    Normal filter cycle 1 set to start 4:00 AM stop 4:05 AM.
    Feature 3 set 8:00 AM-4:00 PM at 30 GPM to trigger SWG flow switch. Feature 5 set 4:01 PM-5:30PM @85GPM for in floor cleaning. Can't set Feature 4 properly. I try to set it for 7:00AM-7:59AM @85 GPM for another in floor cycle, but display will only allow set to 7:40AM. It will not allow me to go any further than 7:40AM. It gives me strange responses when attempting to set beyond that. Tech not so helpful. Any ideas?

  • repair_guy
    14 years ago

    This bug was supposed to be worked out in later software revisions. In the first ones, and they did not tell you this in class, we found that you cannot set lower features without first changing the higher ones. The default settings along with the logic that says you cannot overlap settings, do not allow you to set features 3-7ish as 8-9 are already defaulted to those time settings.

    So, if you have no desire to run at midnight, enter feature 9 and set it to come on at 11:55pm and go off at 11:56pm. Do the same for feature 8 at 11:50pm and 11:51pm and so on.....on down to feature 4. Then set feature 3 to where you want it. This will open up all time settings on 3-9 up to about 11:35pm or so depending on where you ended in the first exercise.

    Remember, if you enter any time setting to adjust a start time in a mode that was previously set, the stop time will default to one minute later so you need to re set the stop time. Many people will enter a mode that was say, 8 hours for the purpose of cutting an hour off. They leave and then the stop time reverts to a minute later than what they just set. You must do both.

    I'm not sure why you would be told to avoid the filter mode. Is your in floor actually running at that gpm without triggering a system head block alarm?

  • azpoolman
    14 years ago

    Thanks for your response. First off, the class I took was in '08 at the Western Show and it was useless. It focused almost exclusivley on how to process the SCE & DWP rebates and spent almost no time on the programming of the pump. I moved to AZ last year and the power companies here don't even give rebates on them. I was gonna contact Art G but since I don't live in LA anymore I decided to hold off and see if I could get some help elsewhere. Anyways, the Pentair "tech" guys told me the best way to get 30 gpm for the SWG is not even use the normal filter cyles. Just to use the features. Do you think it is better to just use the normal filter cycle and do the math in my head to come up with a cycle time based on pool volume that will assure SWG activation? As far as the features go, #'s 6-9 are DISABLED. Are you tellimg me that even if they are disabled the default times still in them will affect the others? It seems to me they would'nt if they are disabled.
    Like I said, I was hooking up 4x160's with Intellicoms to Compools and Aqualinks and I do orp/ph control systems so
    my skill level is pretty high but this thing is kind of driving me nuts.