Too many people are allowed to have "guns" that is the problem.

There are just TOO MANY damn guns in the world. I wish there was a big magnet that would suck all of the guns into outer space. Dottie

"the gunman feared "the Obama gun ban that's on the way" and "didn't like our rights being infringed upon."

And this solves this 'problem' how?????? That's what I'd like to ask the gunman.

I once read that if a person commits suicide, they hate themselves,,,,but if they kill others first, they hate the world.

Shirley

So very sad - been on the TV all day today here. Our local TV stations are all in Pittsburgh.

...and a man just shot and killed his 5 kids in Washington and then killed himself...and a man shot and killed his family and inlaws in Santa Clara a couple of days ago...and it goes on

Here is a link that might be useful: Washington killings

They are in my thoughts and prayers.

For those of you who wish guns were gone, think about what has happened in Austrailia with their gun ban. Now the problem is swords and knives. I'll keep my gun. Guns don't kill, people kill. Ok, off my soap box.

Tami

I agree Tami. In Finland, where there has been a gun ban for decades, a kid shot up a bunch of kids in a school.

I personally believe it's simplistic thinking to assume that banning guns would solve the issue. The problem I see with that thinking is that it never addresses the anger within the society that keeps producing the people who act in a killing fashion with such casually angry disregard for the rights and interests of those other than themselves.

Nothing in life is solved as easily as removing a piece of hardware. We have a problem in this society which we seem to be unwilling to address - the real issue is why people here are so willing to hurt other's. I don't pretend to know what the answer is, but our society seems to be a very angry, violent society. That is (to me) where the real problem lies and where the only solution can be found. But, this will be incredibly difficult (and painful) to address and will have no easy or fast fix.

Just my take on this issue, of course.

Did you hear they have suspended the dispatcher because she didn't tell the cops that the person had a gun (or something like that)? They weren't supposed to forget somehting that important, but with all that is going now, I hope the focus is not on that. Yes, more needs to be done to refresh the MH system. If these folks can be intercepted - be they depressed, stressed, psychotic, etc., maybe that would help some. Folks also need to SLOW DOWN and develop some patience and tolerance.

With the major recent increase in unemployment in this part of the world ...

... and many of the former jobs gone for good ...

... and the huge and increasing difference between the annual income levels of the richest and the poorest ...

... (how fair is it that one man becomes the richest man in the world in half of a generation?) ...

... and our increasing emphasis in recent years, encouraged by the advertisers, to consider that our worth is judged by what we have, rather than who we are, our integrity ...

... and with our major and increasing emphasis on the "every man for himself" doctrine (did you note - "every MAN for himself") ...

... (and the devil take the hindmost) ...

... can we expect anything else but more of the same (as many of the increasing number of poor lose hope)?

Plus, if we judge fairly, though Christians (and followers of other religions) talk about loving others ... and seeking peace ... fairness would lead us to conclude that we really have been guilty of starting wars, misusing others (think "slavery") and a number of other injustices.

If were God to let us know, in not disputable fashion, that S/He is fed up with us and our depradations, allowing millions of kids to die short of, or with only dirty water, hungry and sick - some in agony ... would you be surprised??

People - not hardware.

Love - not alienation.

Our world is really ill, these days.

It needs every one of us to commit ourselves to active healing.

Think the Palestinian doctor who was respected due to hard work in an Israeli hospital who, when losing three daughters in the recent turmoil in Gaza when his house was bombed, couldn't bring himself to hate, even right after the loss.

He puts my commitment to shame.

ole joyful

Just sign my name to Mylab's post.

And after this tragedy, I heard some statistic reporting there are over 250 million guns in use in America. Why? Is this all we're about? Makes no sense to me.

You all have only seen the beginning. As the depression deepens, violent crime will escalate. Eventually when no jobs are left in this country, society will return to a Darwinian system of hunting and gathering. Your money, if you have any left, will become useless as food and shelter become scarce. Edible products will become the new currency, being traded for anything you can imagine (and some things you can't).
Finances, education, family lineage and all the other standard bargaining chips of the past will be replaced as a measure of success by the might of one's weapon arsenal, and shear brute strength. Only the fittest will survive.

Gosh Chad, if I wasn't depressed before reading your reply, I am now.

Sounds like you're depressed, too. :(

Greetings Chad,

Do you really think that it may get as bad as that?

We may be about to go sliding down the wage level and asset base to quite a lot lower than we've enjoyed for several generations.

And one questions whether people may be as tough as our forebears were in dealing with difficult economic times, as it's a lot easier to learn to live richer than to learn to cope with being a great deal poorer. We're more brittle, these days, I think ... and rather impatient.

Growing up on a fairly prosperous farm, I never remember being without electricity ... but didn't have a flush toilet ... or hot water on tap ... till, at age 18, I went away to Univ. ... and I remember us getting our first small radio ... about 1938? Just 70 years ago, that.

And we've forgotten a great deal about providing for ourselves ...

... for example - do you have space available nearby where you could have a garden? Would you be willing to operate one? Do you know how? Do you know how to cook the produce and store it heated in bottles (not being prone to spoilage if the power operating the freezer goes out for half a week or more)?

I'm more inclined to do that, as a more practical way to cope, even if not so spectacular ...

... as going out to buy a gun.

Add to that, I think ... that many of us Canadians find it a bit difficult to comprehend you U.S. folks' seeming obsession with guns.

They're mainly killing machines, aren't they?

My boss left me marching orders, a couple of thousand years ago, that I should love my neighbour as myself.

Which includes shooting him? her? their kids?

Ease up a bit, guy, please - things may get tough ... but not that bad, I trust/hope.

North Americans are a smart, innovative, flexible bunch ... and when things get tough, a good deal of the time (in the past, anyway) we helped one another to cope - it built our communitioes, not destroyed them.

If it gets as bad as you suggest ... I'll be rather glad that, at 80, I'm nearing my date of departure (and don't have grandkids).

When I get to take my final exam at the Great Gate to the Beyond ... what do you think the probability may be that the Examining Committe may ask me how come we North Americans, many of whom claim to be Christian, were so heedlessly greedy as to live so high on the hog ... while many in other parts of the world had rotten water, not enough and poor food, minimal education and health care, such that something like 20,000 kids die daily, we're told.

What kind of answer do you suggest that I give?

And if they say, "Seems to us that your present lack of jobs, poverty and trouble look good on ya', mate: show us how it's not good for you to get a taste of how millions of others have lived for years", ...

What answer do you figure that I could give to that ... that I wouldn't feel embarrassed to give?

Good wishes for increasingly skillful use of your income, assets and the various other skills and areas of your life that you may need greatly, in future, Chad.

ole joyful

P.S. I read a book years ago, "Ideas have Legs", that said that one can only prevail over a dynamic idea with a better idea, well presented (and I'd add, "compassionately presented") ... not with a club ... or a gun.

That makes a lot of sense, to me.

o j

The same old song...guns don't kill people, people do. If there were no more guns people would use knives a swords..la, la, la. At least with knives and swords, they can't stand far away and just crook a finger to mow down people, they would have to get more, up close and personal to do their evil deeds. Dottie

Something like 800,000 - 1,000,000 slaughtered in Rwanda 15 years ago ... using clubs and machetes, mostly ... some forced by repressive groups to kill neighbours, even family.

General in charge of U.N. peacekeeping group said that he could have stopped it with 5,000 extra troops - but the major countries blocked their being sent.

After we became aware of the magnitude of it, we said, `Never again!`.

But it`s going on in Darfur now and has been for years - current inhabitants being killed or kicked out, women raped wholesale, their vilages burned.

There`s oil there.

So much for our resolutions to support human rights.

I rejoice in the freedom that I enjoy here - but I must respect the rights of others to enjoy similar freedom, as well - without my interference.

But - `Live and let live`, doesn`t seem to be enough consideration, it seems to me.

I like, `Live and help live`, better.

ole joyful

Another tragedy to me, today it was announced since the Pittsburgh murders, 9 million more guns have been issued.

Wonder how much bullet proof clothes cost? :(

Greetings, joyfulguy

Maybe it will get that bad, or maybe it won't. I don't pretend to know the future, as so many self proclaimed experts (the media, for example) do. Perhaps what I wrote was a critical thinking exercise designed to stimulate unconventional thought within the reader.

I think another depression may be the best thing that could happen to this country. The excesses of the past 20 years have produced a generation of spoiled instant gratification addicts. People have no work ethic, and they don't need one when living in a land where anything one could want is available instantly, for a price.
We need a return to old concepts like earning what you need, and waiting until you can afford something instead of living on credit. Many people would be well served by a strong dose of humility, too. They need to reevaluate the importance of their lives in the grand scheme.
Like the Darwin example, depression would leave those who can perform actual work, repair things and do without their every want to continue, and weed out the soft, incapable ones who seem to be the majority today. The ones who have no real skills and rely on paying others to do everything for them would be in for a rude awakening.

I commend you for your reply. It's rather refreshing to read an intelligent debate on here, rather than the usual "play nice" retorts that a dissenting opinion tends to generate.

It's been quite interesting reading the different posts...I'm still working on my own anger with these senseless shootings....
Chad, I agree, maybe a depression would help...You're right about the work ethics and certainly about waiting until you can afford before you buy....You see all these new homes going up, people buying, can't afford to furnish them and then you see a for sale posted.....
But, the problem I have is not banning guns...I have hunters in the family but why in the world do you need those "machine" guns and those guns that shoot so many rounds? You don't use those for hunting or even target practice....Of course even if those guns would be outlawed, the "nuts" of the world would have them....I don't know the answer but I'd love to hear any of those that have those type of gun, try to explain their reasons to the families of the fallen officers....Just in Pgh., so many heartaches!

I don't have a problem with responsible gun ownership, but I do have a problem with the fact that it's easier to get a gun than it is to get a driver's license or a day-care license. I think there should not only be a background check, of course, but also mandatory classes and tests, and maybe even a mental health evaluation. It should be made much more difficult to get a gun.

Not-so-DH and I received a small handgun as a wedding gift 20+ years ago. We never used it, never wanted it, but somehow never got rid of it either. A couple weeks after we split up I took the gun to the sheriff station, where they logged it in to be destroyed. I felt very good about doing that.

One problem is how the pendulum swings so far either way. The gun-toting cowboys who'll give up their guns when they pry them from their cold dead fingers and the other extreme believing that take away the guns and crime will go out the window. Neither is a practical or rational position IMO.

Responsible gun ownership is but one part. Responsible parenting is another part. Responsible media is another part. Responsible credit is another part. Responsible government leaders is another. And so on. There's so many parts to the problem that there is no ONE solution. But the lack of ration and reason in dealing with problems only compounds the problem.

If any of the "magic wand" solutions truly worked, don't you truly believe it would have been done? If "guns" kill so many people that it warrants their ban, then how on earth do you rationalize NOT banning cars? Far more deaths and far more injuries. And far easier to get a hold of a car than a gun. Simply taking it away doesn't solve the problem.

I don't know if it's the same today, but when I lived in England years ago the average person could not buy a handgun. The policemen carried nightsticks, not guns. Even so, people were hurt and killed with knives, poison, etc. And many criminals managed to get guns.

I don't know the answer to the problem.

One of our major problems is the long addiction that we've had ...

...

...

...

...

... to money.

As you've often heard me (and others) say ... "Money makes a wonderful servant ...

...and a terrible master!!".

Should we ask ourselves whether the main difference between the actions of those scoundrels who've carried out their hurtful depradations on Wall Street ...

...(that may yet take your country down - and if yours goes, ours goes along with it!) ...

... and if not, weaken it tremendously ...

... and ourselves, with our recent viewpoints of the essentials of life ...

... is a difference of degree, rather than of kind?

I've said here a few times, recently, that I've been feeling rather sad, lately, as I've long been advising my clients (and folks considering becoming such) that it would be wise to have several months' income available readily to hand ...

... in case (for whatever reason) the paycheque stopped ...

... yet I've been distressed that so many continue to live hand-to-mouth: take away one paycheque (maybe two) and they're screaming bloody murder!!

Having lived for a while where there wasn't much ... I've learned to value my political freedom ... and my social freedom ... and I value financial freedom, as well ...

... and have encouraged others to build a plan where they had more of it for themselves - to at least have some wiggling room in case of crisis.

When you yell into the teeth of a gale ... your voice doesn't carry very far!

Good wishes for increasing skill at managing not only your income and assets ... but your life as a whole. And encouraging them that you deal with from day to day to rethink their ways, looking to doing similarly.

ole joyful