Thanks,Lukkiirish. I did look at the MaP report based on a link in an older thread. If I'm understanding it correctly, it tells me mostly what I know from the specs: in the Kohler line Class 6 and Class 5 toilets move more waste than the older Ingenium models or the dual flush models. What I can't judge from the specs is whether the differences in waste volume are noticeable or meaningful in real-world use. Not to get too scatalogical, but I certainly can't look in my toilet and judge what might be 600 grams or 1,000 grams of solid waste! (I also checked the MaP report for some Toto models which I liked stylistically, like the Pacifica, Vespin and Nexus, but for some reason none of them are listed. I don't know what that means.) I realize no one can tell me for certain what we'd be happy with, but I am interested in hearing people's satisfaction with these various toilets. If someone has a Cimarron Class 6 and also a Persuade or San Raphael, it would be interesting to know if you can't tell the difference in the flush, or conversely, if you feel the newer Class 5 or 6 models make all the difference in the world. Or, if anyone has experience with the any of the Class 5 models and also a Cimarron Class 6, is the newer Class 6 do a significantly better job washing down the bowl, or is it an indistinguishable difference? -- Eric P.S. Is there anything to read into the fact that Kohler introduced the Class 6 Cimarron a year (or more?) ago, but haven't yet moved any of their other Class 5 models to Class 6? If the changes in the Class 6 were driven by customer complaints about the bowl not being cleaned well enough in the Class 5 toilets, I would have thought they would have been moving quickly to transition more models to Class 6. Does this indicate the market is telling them that they still didn't get it "right" with the Class 6 Cimarron, and they're developing something else?

I have indeed been considering Toto and, in fact, have been planning to get the Toto Ultramax for the master bath, and Toto Drakes in some other bathrooms. (Unfortunately, I have way too many toilets to buy pretty much all at once; if I screw this decicion up, I will have screwed it up eight-fold!) My decorator keeps pushing Kohler, so I thought I'd go with that(Cimarron and Santa Rosa -- yikes, eleena!) in a few other bathrooms. I have been so confused. Actually, I was planning to get one of each of those first to see how we liked them for a couple of weeks (Cimarron is Class 5, and Santa Rosa is Ingenium). I have indeed looked at Terry Love's site (that's why we're getting Toto in places), but not sure whether I should use those everywhere, considering I have not ever seen one in person before. Back to the point... this is why I thought these Class 6 ones would be the perfect combination. Help!

I have 4 very recent (last 3 years) toilet purchases, from a Jaccuzzi- not worth discussing, to a Kohler (Ingenium, I think), AS and Toto. I think one must distinguish old from new, 5 gal flush from 1.6 from even less... The latter 3 are all excellent. Differences are notable from water spot size, to noise, to clean bowl. BUT I would still buy any of those 3 again, the AS cadet and Toto Promenade are the most similar in function, but the Toto is much more quiet, for certain. I find that MaP thing a little cumbersome to read... antss- yes, studies must show their data: study size, confounders, statistical significance of results, etc., ;-). Where is the p value?!?! And to note, in allll the yeeaars of using CR, which has been very helpful, one does need to understand that the rating is definitely cost related- best value for the dollar. I have purchased things that were top of the list, but definitely not the top product. I have learned. They don't always prioritize the same as I would, and it can be difficult to pick apart that subtlety.

We've had our Totos (Dartmouth, Plymouth) for several years now and, while they were a huge improvement on the builder-grade Crane models they replaced, they're not perfect. But what is? We've had to unclog them several times but that doesn't begin to compare with the almost daily problems we had with our previous toilets. We've also had to replace the flappers - once on each toilet. No big deal - we just keep an extra flapper ($10) on hand now. The impression I have from reading CR and others over the years is that other companies have improved their products and, as a result, you can probably find any number of good toilets out there now. Personally though, if I had to buy another toilet today I'd stick with Toto because they always seem to be on the cutting edge of toilet technology and everyone else has to work to keep up.