Wow Rhome, I went to Beagles' open house (WHAT a kitchen and WHAT a house) today in PA and just got home to this wonderful posting of yours. THANK YOU! I am going to print it out and study it very carefully. My schedule is very crowded these next few days and I may not get back right away but I will study it carefully. I really appreciate it! Angela, the single oven is 27" tall, the micro is 19 inches tall (Including the face plate), and the steam oven is boxed- the box is 20" height. They are all made to go into 24" deep cabinets. I suppose the steam oven could go over the single oven, and I could just have a small micro anywhere (instead of an advantium), but the steam oven has to be plumbed so it would not work in Rhome's layout above. The canisters are about 7" diameter and 5" diameter- my stirrers, spatulas, tongs, large spoons, my prep and cooking utensils are all crammed into them right now. The rice cooker creates a fair amount of steam and I would like to keep it out next to the cooktop so that I can place it under the hood when cooking. Similarly the thermomix can produce steam when it is cooking and stirring, depending on what I am making.I don't think they would do as well in a cabinet or appliance garage.

If you're willing to move the kitchen entry a few feet (6'?) toward the top wall, you'd still have traffic coming through, but it wouldn't pass by the ovens and fridge. In this plan you still have a snack center on the periphery, with the ovens close to the cooktop. You still have a view while you prep, and a second prep area by the clean-up sink. There's room for a small appliance in the corner between the cooktop and ovens. (Forgot that the fridge is drawn too small--the pantry on the right of the fridge might need to be a pull-out, or make each pantry smaller.) In the laundry area there's room by the W/D for a short counter over a pull-out for storage. This close to the kitchen sink, I'd skip the sink in the mudroom/laundry. I wanted to post this plan, but also want to say (and I'll take the hits) that I don't think the ovens in the original plan are much of a problem. You won't be carrying hot dishes--with the oven door open and racks extended, you'll be pivoting in a 3' arc, to set them on the end of the counter by the cooktop. Turn the other direction, and you can use the island as landing space, if you have more than one hot dish. Ditto for anything you want to set down long enough to open the oven for loading. Just yell, "Oven's open!" before you use it. If you have small kids running in and out through that entry, you can always put a latch on the sliding door, and get in the habit of latching it when you open the oven. :)

Aisle Space - All measurements are counter to counter, so we are 2” below recommended 42” aisle space. We have lived with that spacing in existing kitchen between stove/ island and sink / island, so think we are OK there. Just because you lived with spaces that are too small doesn't mean you need to continue to live with spaces that are too small. If you're spending the money to redo the kitchen, do it right. Realize that 42" is minimum aisle size. Also while your counter space might be 40", what is the space between fridge handle and island counter or dishwasher handle and island counter, or stove handle and island counter? See? When I made it 42" between counters, it was the bare minimum. And having only 3'2" with cabinets behind the seating is too little space. Countertop Overhang - Regarding 12” vs 15” island countertop overhang for seating, I’d like to hear other opinions on that. I think 12” should be fine. Thought I saw 12” recommended somewhere as a min. Our basement bar has 10” overhang and that seems ok. Cabinets behind island seating won’t be used for everyday storage, so not too worried about difficult access if someone is sitting at island. 12" is minimum if you have a bar height counter. If you're using counter height, then 15" is minimum for comfortable seating. The problem with anything less is your knees don't have a place to go, so when you go to eat at the counter, you're having to lean over uncomfortably. I have that now in our rental and even though I'm only 5'3" it's uncomfortable sitting there for dining or doing anything else. Add to having too little overhang, you now have cabinets behind, and no one will be able to walk by when someone is sitting at the counter. So someone comes in from the garage and now the person sitting has to stand up to let the person pass? Dishwasher location - We went back and forth about this one. Our KD also recommended we keep the DW next to the sink. We wanted to keep the sink centered in the window, but guess that is not a big deal. No it's not a big deal. How often do you stand directly centered looking at your sink in relation to your window? Our thinking was that there would be no more spills on the floor than we have with present setup, as we presently load from the left side dirty sink, over the floor, to the DW. With DW in the island, with DW door open, there is only a 12” gap between end edge of door and sink cab. So it’s a wash. But it’s a lot less work to keep it next to the sink, and with the strong anti-island feelings from many, there must be more to it than I think, so will reconsider that one. The new layout now shows the DW next to the sink. As I mentioned, it's also having to turn 180 degrees every time you want to put something in the dishwasher. Another thing? If you ever decide to sell, having the dishwasher behind you would be a HUGE negative selling feature.

Love the idea with blocking the space! It is helpful! Sorry no experience with the refrigeration. In my ideal kitchen I am not sure which maker but I would do one stand up refrigerator and then another stand up freeze like I experienced as a volunteer in a small community kitchen/ restaurant. When it comes to depth you can always have the contractor pull the upper and lower cabinets farther from the wall and have a deeper counter. (and Yes I lived in a house for 9 years that had had this and it was fine.. it was not a lot more maybe 4"). Are you going to have a separate icemaker? Our last house had two of them in a huge french samsung. It was overkill. We hardly use any ice. Our present house with ice in the french freeze - we did not have the plumber connect it with the remodel as that is like number one issue with any frige. We have the good old fashioned trays and if party just go get a bag or two. As for the question: do you think it’s okay to have a kitchen eating space in view of the formal dining space? I think it is fine and it happens a lot in newer homes. I am not a fan of multiple eating spaces personally and encourage others to think of their dining room as a flex space (and say hey put in some built in bookshelves just in case it goes den or the kids need a workspace for projects with the table pad underneath). I suspect you have an older home? If I had your home I would put a divided light french door in-between maybe with water glass if you want to obscure.