Clarification: CKC - Continental Kennel Club - LA 70785
AKC - American Kennel Club - NC 27617

Mine are AKC but wouldn't have made any difference we are not using them for breeding anyway.

The Canadian KC is real, as is the AKC. The CKC that you reference was created for people who have been stripped of AKC or CanadaKC privileges because of breaking the rules. Rules like allowing inspectors on the property and keeping accurate records. These are the people who have been kicked out of the real registries.

Thanks for letting people know that any pet store puppy is the product of BYB or even worse, puppy mills.

Disclaimer: we are dog-show people, and we breed, rarely but carefully. The scams that well-meaning people fall for when they want to buy a puppy are horrid. All I ask is that people educate themselves before buying a puppy of any breed.

Sushipup, Although it is bad news, thank you for confirming what we suspected. I had never heard of this so called registration until recently....sounds like something we should avoid!

My dog is AKC registered, though she was born in Ireland and flown to the US with her siblings. I have her "papers" and her father was a champion. Good to know but I really love her, she's very friendly and attached to me, I wouldn't trade her for a million dollars! But I felt the same way about a stray dog years ago.

It's the same for the AKC. It's just a registration service - it does NOT certify your pup as breed quality. It just registers the puppy as offspring of two other dogs.

Back yard breeders think AKC registration means pure bred and therefore they can breed away and sell for high bucks. Nope. Responsible breeders check for genetic issues and independant confirmation before they breed a new generation. Unfortunately AKC registration papers are just as prone to backyard breeding as any other registration service.

From the AKC website:

"Breed Responsibly

Breed To Improve
Breeding should only be done for the advancement of the breed. If you are thinking about breeding your dog, consult your breeder for advice. Consider all the consequences-and expenses-of breeding a litter before you do so. Consult AKC publications for more information as well.

Perform Genetic Screening
If you plan to breed your dog, it is very important to test for health and disease. Perform all available tests to rule out the possibility of passing on a genetic defect.

Should I Breed My Dog?

At some point, every dog owner is faced with the question: To breed or not to breed? If you are considering becoming a breeder, please keep the following in mind.
Responsible breeders embrace the belief that each new litter should represent an improvement over the last.

Responsible breeders are aware that each breed has an official standard or written desrcription of how the ideal dog looks, moves and behaves. They are careful to only breed dogs that meet this standard.

Responsible breeders give careful consideration to health issues, genetic concerns, temperament, soundness and appearance.

Responsible breeders know that every dog - however wonderful as a companion - has certain flaws or weaknesses and that it is important to find a mate that can complement strengths and help eliminate the weaknesses.

Responsible breeders plan ahead to be sure that each puppy they produce will be placed in a safe, loving home suited to its needs.

Responsible breeders accept responsibility for the puppies they produce throughout each puppy's lifetime and are always available to answer questions and provide information to the puppy's new owners. "

Here is a link that might be useful: American Kennel Club

If the AKC would stop issuing papers willy-nilly to puppy mills we could all rest easier. I guess those bazillions of registration fees are just too good to pass up! (AKC might have a clue that these are not responsible breeders by the sheer volume of registrations requested from a single address?)

Just because puppy mill #6000 sends in to the AKC that six pups were born to 'Ch. BudLite' and 'Ch. Bred-Till-She-Dies', providing 'proof' that the parents are 'AKC registered' means zip! AKC doesn't inspect or monitor. (Anyone know different?) Mills know the 'papers' add value to their product. Cut off the profits and some mills would close up.

AKC does do inspections, and maintains the integrity of the registry, IOW, if they catch a breeder lying about who the parents are, the breeder gets suspended. But I agree, that the AKC paper does not mean anything more than a pedigree of purebred dogs, and not quality.

And no puppy mill that I know of breeds champion dogs or uses Ch dogs in their breeding program. ALtho we all know some breeders that we do not think very highly of, a real puppy mill is just churning out the livestock product.

Puppy mills will still prosper as long as bogus groups like CKC offer to help them bamboozle the buying public. Don't pin that all on the AKC, please.

Yes, I'd like to see the public better educated.

In my breed, I steer clear of certain lines. I have a champion female, and I've bred her twice so far to dogs from all the way across country using frozen semen, because I wanted the best healthiest genetics in my puppies. I love the looks of some other dogs that I might consider for sires, but the coefficient of inbreeding is way too high on certain dogs with known tendencies to early onset cancers (a potential problem in my breed) or other problems.

But I digress. My goal is that puppy buyers use due diligence in learning about the breed, learning about potential problems in the breed and interviewing breeders.

I'd outlaw all stores that sell puppies in my perfect world. But as far as BYB, some of them do a very good job of choosing their breeding stock, doing the genetic testing and socializing their puppies before selling them. Without responsible small breeders, many of us would never own a dog.

sushipup,

you deserve another "poochie" thank you for the good information...I appreciate your input,,,as I'm sure other dog lovers do.

"Registration" with a formal club means nothing if the dog is the product of forced in-breeding from malnourished, caged "breeders."

I'd much rather have a mixed dog with good health, an active mind, and good genetics, that came from and properly cared for sires and dams of any breed, with no "papers" at all, than an in-breed creature prone to all sorts of genetic problems.

Harry and Sam are "registered" with a German hunting organization; their breed is not recognized by the AKC or any other American organization. Harry and Sam have no inbreeding going back 10 generations. The "pedigree" is nothing more than a list of the parents and ancestors to show who is related to who, and that is very helping in determining if there is any in-breeding and all the problems it can cause. And don't let people feed you the "line breeding" bull puckey, either. Line breeding is in-breeding.

In order for a Deutsch Drahthaar to be "registered," it has to born from "registered" DDs that have successfully passed four very involved and strick hunting tests. These are real world, real conditions hunting covering tracking, pointing, retrieving, blind retrieving and blood kills. They cover birds, small game, and large game. There are no planted/disabled/caged prey in enclosed fields; these are real hunts covering hundreds of acres of land, lakes, etc.

Before breeding, the parents have to be certified free of hip dysplasia and a blood disorder. They have to produce certain scores in each of the field tests, and be between certain age ranges...I believe it's age 3-9. They have to be in top condition and perfect health. They can have only three litters in their lifetime and there must be two years between each litter. The pups, tattooed at birth to ascertain each puppy matches its papers, can only be sold to active, licensed hunters with the proper time and facilities to keep, train, and test these dogs. These are not kennel dogs. These are intelligent pets that hunt.

We were interviewed and screened before we were considered for "adopting" Harry. We got Sam from the same breeder. The few DD breeders there are lose money on each liter; there is no breeding for profit.

As I said, if I was getting a dog, it would be a wonderful pound puppy. DH wanted a versatile hunting dog, and was willing to meet the conditions and criteria for having, training, and working one.

We have two, and they are the joys of our life. They are pampered pets first, and DDs second. I wish all breed organizations were as tough and dedicated with their breeders as the DD is.

For the life of me I can't remember where my dog is registered but I'm pretty sure both his parents had to be registered there too.

Our Doxie is not registered. She did come from purebred parents. In a home bred. Miss is worth more than her weight in gold to us. The people that had her in the first 2 homes didn't want her, so DD took her (she didn't breed her)because she knew we'd thought of getting another pup.I had to try and convince DH that we needed her. He was bound and determined she was too "old" for us and wanted a pup at 8 weeks.....I fell in love with her at first sight. She was untrained and pee'd on the carpet on her first visit. DH was adamant NO way would we get her. DD finally after 2 weeks gave him the choice, give in and let Mom have the pup or I will give her to Mom for Mothers Day! LOL She has been an absolute TREASURE! Best dog we've ever had! I trained her quickly, got up every 2 to 3 hours round the clock and took her potty. She never has accidents. I often think how stupid her first 2 owners were to pass up on a jewel like her!
Mac the Chihuahua is registered with AKC. My DGD's Mom wanted to be like Paris Hilton I think, DS got her the puppy, she didnt have him long at all and discarded him. She probably threw his papers away long ago who knows. DS took him back, he moved in with us one winter and when he moved out, I told him Mac was staying! LOL Now Mac you can tell was never trained properly....by the time he'd stayed with her parents a few months and then her grandparents a few months he was over a year old before he got him back. He's trained when he wants to be, but you can tell he was never taught from the begining. The ex GF had grand plans for him to be bred and she could get a puppy! Grrrr that irritated me to know end. He wasn't neutered til late, by then he'd started to mark and it had become a "learned" behavior IMO. We still love him dearly, but watch him like a hawk!
The papers or not dont mean a thing to us in either case.

sushipup -- Could you provide information about where and when AKC has performed inspections? Do you know how to find out how many animals the AKC registers every year and what documents they require to issue registrations?

From what I have observed, an owner sends in a puppy's certs from sire and b*tch (with payment) and back comes an AKC registration, no questions asked. Has this changed?

AKC stats:

http://www.akc.org/press_center/facts_stats.cfm

Registrations:
http://www.akc.org/reg/dogreg_stats.cfm

one month's reports of inspections, etc:

http://www.akc.org/pdfs/about/secretary_page/0309.pdf

Page 2

This comes out every month.

Offspring of an AKC registered sire and dam are eligible for registration, if sire or dam are not on Limited Registration.

And the AKC rules regarding registration and disclipline

Here is a link that might be useful: AKC rules