My opinion? You're not going to change him to be what you want and he's not going to change you to be what he wants. Of course you know you never should've gotten married in the first place and shouldn't have brought a child into it in the 2nd place.

I don't know what kind of feedback you're looking for, though. The way you've written it it seems hopeless. Whatever you you will be at the detriment of your child. If you divorce, he/she will be a child of divorce. If you stay together, he/she will grow up in an unhealthy environment.

Might as well bring on the 2nd part now....if that makes any difference. Good luck to you all.

Was this an arranged marriage ?

Sounds like you have two children, your hubbie being one of them.

You sound sensible, explore your options of opting out of the union. If you can support yourself that is wonderful.

Do you really see a happy future with this person ?

Best to try marriage counselling before you pull the plug, maybe he can change his ways.

Good luck with it all.

If there was never any chenistry between you ,then after seven years i doubt there ever will be.he is probably feeling as unhappy as you are.Life is too short to be unhappy,i think you should go your seperate ways so you can one day find true love.

um...you didn't notice these issues in the three years before becoming pregnant?

Don't like the bit about his yelling at "the kid" but I didn't pick up on any warm/fuzzies about the joys of motherhood from you either so don't know where parenting fits into the mix.

On behalf of the child, I would recommend a second look at everything by both of you. However, seven years is a lot of time to think. If you're not settled in by now, I'm not sure where confidence about the future is going to come from.

Thanks all of you, for your replies. My idea behind posting this question is release my feelings & to find out if I'm leaving in a negative zone & viewing everything negatively or is it really that bad. I've always been an optimistic person & hopeful & I have never given up on any relationship. But this particular is very important & I cannot make any more compromises. To answer asolo's question, please don't question my motherhood feelings. I'm very career-oriented person & I've worked hard all my life towards it. When I found out that I was pregnant, I gave up my job & spent 2 1/2 years of my life caring for my baby, bcoz I did not want to miss that part of his life. I can take care of myself, my worries are more for my son. My husband has not mentally matured yet & that's partly bcoz of his upbringing. But he could have learned from others which did not do & is not even trying inspite of all my efforts. I am not trying to change him but there are some basic qualities which both men & women possess & it makes life easier when they play their respective roles. For example, you go to a new place & cannot find out which way to turn, I've generally noticed that men would go ahead & find out from someone. My husband would just stand there & whine that we're lost. I would finally do it. I'm not saying that certain things should be done only by men or only by women. But it just feels good, feels like someone is taking care of you, when they do such small things. I always cook his favorite things, keep the house tidy, plan things for my son (everything from weekend trips to registering him at pre-school). My husband does not have to worry about these things. I just expect something similar in return.

Is that too much to ask?

No, not too much to ask.

Have you asked him to do things ? Just start by asking for something simple, like can you buy some milk. Get him into the habit of thinking of what he can do to help.

I think the major concern here is you son. Do you want him to grow up with his dad teaching him how to be a man ?

Try not to dwell on your preconceived ideas about what men and women "should" do. I suppose we all have an idea on how our marriage should be, and what roles we each should play. But these days can we still expect to think like that ? In western countries, that has all been turned on its head.

There is one question that you need to think about..is your home a place where you want your son to grow up in ? He is the priority.

popi said:

"Do you want him to grow up with his dad teaching him how to be a man ? ", and

"There is one question that you need to think about..is your home a place where you want your son to grow up in ?"

While the OP's hubby may certainly have his flaws and not be the ideal role model, he is the child's father and you are wrong to suggest that if SHE decides to leave the marriage, she can in ANY WAY take the child out of the man's life...that is so wrong in many ways.

Being cheap, indecisive and somewhat immature, while maybe not what she wants in a husband, would not be justification in any way for the courts to award her sole custody. Besides, a bad father (and I am not saying this guy is bad, maybe just not ideal) is better than no father in a child's life, or one that he sees only occasionally.

The "one question" she should be asking herself is her marital happiness worth the child living in a split marriage, with most likely some joint custody arrangement. It may very well be, that's her decision...but she should not take the approach that leaving him will also make it so the father is not the one raising him to be a man.

This isn't the 50's anymore....mom's don't automatically "get the kids". Unless there are other issues at hand (substance abuse, dangerous behaviors, etc), the OP has more right to parent the child than the father does. Many men opt to let the mother's so most of the parenting, if that's the case then fine, but if he wants equal access and time with the child, he will get them.

Yes I had this battle with my ex...she wanted out of the marriage, that was her call, but she also started with the "kids belong with their moms" bullsh*t....I told her no way, I was just as involved and attached to the kids as she was, and being that we both worked full time, there was no way I would ever let her "get the kids" with me being an "every other weekend" dad....no f#%$ing way. Initially she resisted, then finally came around, realizing it was the best thing for the kids for both of us to be equally involved with them.

My intention was to get the OP to question her living arrangements and how that affects the child. My intention was not to suggest the the child should grow up without his father.

Lonely, I would say leave, mostly because of what you said about how your husband treats your son. "He keeps yelling at our kid for small little things..." Your son should not be exposed to such treatment. Plus, he knows that you and your husband are not happy, so he is not seeing a good role model for marriage.

See a lawyer if you can do it without your husband knowing. Then make your decision. I feel for you; it sounds like you are living in a mine field. Live is too short for that kind of stress.

Your son will be in school full time in three years. Meanwhile, can you support yourself and your son, including day care until then? From your description of your husband, it seems that he will fight paying child support.

I would worry less about the finances than about the emotional scars caused by the father yelling at the son for every little thing. If that is a truly accurate description of their interaction, it can be traumatizing for a child.

>> There's a second part but I'll wait till I get some feedback on this issue first.
Are you ready to post the 2nd part yet?

At this point, it doesn't sound to me like a good situation at all. And I'm wondering where "the kid" feels like he fits in all of this.

You said "I'm very career-oriented person & I've worked hard all my life towards it", how about take a career decision making approach to resolve this issue?

Say, you are hiring a "husband for you" and a "father for your son". What is the job description for this position? What type of personality, character traits, competency, capability, attitude, experience, life outlook and potential..Etc. this person should possess to be best qualified for the job? If a person is already on the job, does he meet performance requirements? If he does not, how will you deal with this low performer, the damages this person has caused to your organization (family) and other employees (you and your son)? If you have to let this person go, what kind of precaution you need to take in order to ensure stability, safety and future success of your organization?

I have a friend who is a brilliant, very successful career woman. About 15 years ago she was tangled in a messy marriage. Tired of listening her same old, perpetual running circles problems, I made this "career decision making" suggestion.

It seems it was a paradigm shift for her. In two months she decided to "fire" her husband and got a divorce. Her divorce unleashed incredible amount of energy from her. Soon she was promoted to run an international organization. Later, she also met a wonderful, successful man. They have been happily married for several years.

Hi all

thanks once again for the feedback. popi/mkroopy, as far as the child is concerned, i've no intention of separating him from his dad. i come from a well-knit family & he comes from a family where his mom is a control freak & she never let the father have much effect on the kids. i believe she wanted her kids to be clingy to her & that way she will be the important person. but this has robbed my husband of his fathering skills bcoz all he has experienced is his mom yelling at him for everything. my husband's not a bad dad, i'm just upset about his anger issues & i don't think its good for my son. his anger stems from the fact that he has no idea how to handle any situation & since by nature he's a stubborn guy & his mom has been this controlling person, he just does n't take any advice. he's a rebel without a cause. he generally takes good care of our son, i've left them alone several times & my hubby wud feed him, put him to sleep & play with him. and my son loves his dad & the first thing he wud ask when he wakes up is where's daddy. so i wud never think of separating them. even if i decide to quit, i wud ensure we divide the days equally. i don't want my son to grow up without a father & end up with all the inadequacies that his father has.

that said, i'm not a therapist. i'm by nature a very patient person & have been hopeful that things will change for the better. but after all these years i'm still stuck at the same place. it makes me think that its probably not going to benefit my son to have 2 unhappy parents. if i quit & follow my dreams, its going to keep me happy & at least i can make up for my husband's deficiencies. but if i continue to live this unhappy life, i won't be able to give by best to him.

azmom, ur idea is very interesting & to some extent i've explored things that way. but i always fear that viewing this particular issue this way should not be detrimental to my son because this is not a business decision & that's why i'm on this forum. the sad part is that i've something in front of me(a husband) but i cannot fully enjoy(due to his deficiencies). if he was a completely terrible person, it wud have been an easy decision. i feel like i'm taking care of a teenager. we both are just a year apart. this is too much responsibility for me.

suzieque-i'll reveal the second part. but i'm sure people wud start judging me from then on. that's why i want to wait to find a solution to the first one.

thanks everyone. please keep giving ur inputs.

Lonely, my mother treated me very badly and it scarred me for way too long. I do NOT think you should leave your son alone with his father. At the least, I think you should ask your husband to take parenting classes. If he refuses, then you can make it a condition of his being able to see his son after you leave.

To continue to expose your son to behaviour that you know is harmful means that you are contributing to the abuse, and I don't think you really intend for that to happen, or you would not have written. Aside from the abuse, what if your son was with his father and got seriously hurt? Would your decision-adverse husband respond properly and get help (first aid) for your son in time?

Frankly, your first postings paint a scary picture.

I don't see "scary" in it.

Do see a ton of dissatisfaction and disappointment presently and in considering the future. From OP's follow-up posts, it seems crunch-time coming right up. She appears to be pretty level-headed, though.

The over-arching question, as always: "Is this how I want to spend the rest of my life?" Or, in this case, perhaps: "Is this how I want my child to grow up?"

That is an excellent suggestion, taking parenting classes.

You would both have to go, as I am sure your DH would not go on his own, thinking that he was the only parent who needed help.

You could say that you both need some tips and make it a fun thing to do together. Lots of issues will be brought up and it may get your husband really thinking about his actions.

Anyone can be a parent, but clever parents always listen to advise, are always wanting better ways of dealing with issues.

lonely....I am glad to hear you are not thinking of "removing" your child from you husband's life in any substantial way....good for you.

But...I am thinking that the 'second part of the story' probably has to do with you either having an affair, or at least an interest in someone....if that's the case, as I suspect it is...all accolades are rescinded.

".....i'll reveal the second part. but i'm sure people wud start judging me from then on."

Every opinion expressed is a "judgement". Anonymity covers a lot of ground...one of the reasons people spill their guts on forums like this where nobody knows who they are or where they are. It's a way to find out what others think without having to live it out with them. Some call that "judging" but I don't think the word really fits. I wouldn't worry about it.

This is an update of my situation. I spoke to my hubby few days back & poured out my feelings again. As usual he maintained his silence. Then after prodding him enough, he said I am not really the kind of person that talks a lot. So I told him that's not a good excuse. If we've to live together, we have to be able to express to each other our feelings. You can be angry, disagree with me or like something about me. Anything's fine but share your feelings with me. I told him I have reached the saturation point & this is the last time I'm going to talk about this. He agreed to try & be more expressive. So I am going to be hopeful that things will change for the better.

Well here's the second part & you all can judge me but think before you talk & don't just say something bcoz that's supposed to be the perfect thing to be done. Life is full of imperfections & that's why most of us are unhappy. Mkroopy, u guessed right but I am not sure why that should change your opinion about me. Don't forget, its my husband who has driven me to this situation. Well anyway, for the last few months I have been extremely attracted to someone. He's a nice & friendly guy. We've never flirted or anything & there's nothing between us to define any kind of relationship. I might just be infatuated to him bcoz he represents everything I've been looking for in my husband & emotionally I'm pretty weak right now. I've never had such feelings for anyone in my life. I don't even know if he likes me but I want to believe that its so bcoz I'm looking for an escape route. I'm going crazy thinking about this person. My defense for this infatuation is I've tried really hard to feel this way for my husband but on the one hand, he's never ever done anything for me to feel crazy about him & on the other hand, after all the begging that I've done he has not changed a bit. I hold him responsible for my heart straying away like this. This might just be an innocent fantasy & that's how it might end. But its keeping me happy right now & I am able to carry on with my life. All this is going on only in my mind.

Gee, how'd I guess that one?

"...Don't forget, its my husband who has driven me to this situation"

Oh please...spare me. Heard it before from my lying-cheating ex. Yes, I drove her to it, I wasn't around enough, didn't pay enough attention to her. Sorry, I was out there working 12 hrs a day to help get a company off the ground so she could be a stay at home, which is what we both wanted. I was faithful, a good dad and worked my ass off fixing up the old farmhouse we bought....and for this I get to deal her her having two affairs, lies on top of lies on top of lies...that ended up in us finally divorcing. Now my kids have to slit time living with us...wonderful. No one (man or woman) should have to deal with the sh*t she put me though. I'm not religious, but I do hope that someday she has to answer to someone for what she did...

If you want out...do the right thing and get out first. You are right, you are emotionally weak right now...put your schoolgirl concepts of 'romance' aside and take care of your family stuff first, like an adult. Once you are emotionally and legally on your own...then go chase the romance....

Fantasies don't count. Otherwise most of us would be prosecuted for "thought crimes".

Your husband didn't drive you to anything. You admitted in your first post that there never was any chemistry between you and him. But you voluntarily made the choice to marry him, knowing what he was like. And you made the choice to have a child with him. And you made the choice to stay with him so far. Now you have a choice of acting on your fantasy or not. Take responsibility and stop blaming your husband.

I'll admit that your husband certainly doesn't sound like my kind of man, but for you to blame him is irresponsible. He's been the way he is forever; you're the one that hoped you could change him.

We always hear men saying that it's their wife's fault that they have an affair. Bull. We are all given free will and make our choices. Nobody that I know of, myself included, always makes the right choices. But there are some choices that are so obviously bad right from the start that there's no excuse.

Mkroopy, i'm sorry for what happened to you. But u are viewing everyone the same way. i do not know what led your wife into those affairs but i'm not in an affair. You are bitter & not reading my posts correctly. If I wanted to have an affair, I wud not be on this forum. I wud not jump from one man to another based on fantasy. I'm not sticking with my husband for money or other material things, I'm in this bcoz I'm hopeful things will change & for my kid. The first thing I wud do if I reach the breaking point wud be to end my marriage & then pursue this other person. Being attracted to someone is a natural thing just like u feel hunger. Prosecuting someone, who is deprived of affection, for being attracted to another person is like telling a person bcoz we're poor u cannot feel hungry.

Suzieque, I agree with ur point that i married him & have spent all this time. But he married me too. I did not know that he was this way, I wud have never married him if I knew & having the child was a joint decision. We're in this relationship together. I'm not saying I'm perfect. But i'm doing more than my share to make this relationship work. He on the other hand is not even communicating his feelings. I wud change certain things about me if he were to tell me what bothers him. That's all I'm asking for. The reason I blame him is that he does not seem to have any seriousness about this relationship. Right from day one, I've been telling him that I'm missing the emotional support & the conversational aspect in our relationship. I've also told him several times that if I do not get it from him that I'm going to leave him as its very frustrating for me. But he has not budged an inch. I see my situation as similar to an ignored child who does not get the required affection from his immediate family. If he gets that love from a friend's family or a neighbor, he might spend more time with them & start accepting them as his family. That is what's happening to me. I'm not happy about me feeling attracted to another person but I've been longing for that feeling of being someone of value & I'm experiencing this feeling from that person. I've always given my husband this attention that I'm asking for in return. Every evening my husband comes back from work, I would spend time with him, ask him about his day, cook his favorite things, try to help resolve his issues by suggesting some ideas,etc and that's all I ask in return. I think this is a pretty normal contract between husband & wife-give & take.

Taking OP at her word -- which I am doing -- I can see this.

This, for example, is what I regard as one of the better descriptions I've ever read about the attraction....the "fantasy" attraction....

"Being attracted to someone is a natural thing just like u feel hunger. Prosecuting someone, who is deprived of affection, for being attracted to another person is like telling a person bcoz we're poor u cannot feel hungry."

I was fishing for an analogy to illustrate my own point about how "fantasy doesn't count" but I think OP's version serves as well as anything I would have thought up. She has described thought, not action. And she's fully aware, it seems to me, that her fantasy may or may not have anything to do with what reality may come. That's why I said before she seems "level headed" to me.

Are there any among you who haven't had such fantasies....unspoken...unacted upon? (Maybe if you're dead) Difference here is OP's consideration of the whole of her present life. Her fantasy is her "muse", so to speak. She isn't jumping into anything, or so she says, but the thing intensifies her thinking. She's not looking to her fantasy to solve her problems. She using it as an example to illustrate her dissatisfaction.

Not saying "go girl" or any such thing so hoping I'm not going to get beat up over it. However, I do think I'm seeing her point better than I did in the beginning.

OK, so this husband earns good money, helps around the house, and takes care of your son sometimes.

On the negative side, he does not share his feelings or show any affection, he is not social, does not have friends, sees the worst in situations, has anger issues, is stubborn, hates to spend money, can't make decisions (or avoids making decisions), kicks up a fuss if anything gets broken but doesn't know how to fix anything (and refuses to learn, apparently). Plus he can be critical of his son.

I am trying to use your words. I think this fantasy is the only thing keeping you going. In your situation, I would be totally depressed. I've always used the "list" method for weighing big decisions. List the positives in one column and the negatives in another.

Since you have an education and a good job, what is keeping you there? I think that is the question to answer.

Hahaha...didn't read everything but I think I got the jist.

Bottom line, you are not in love with your husband and you are developing feelings for someone else. Everything your husband does is going to seem bad. Seriously, did you complain that your husband didn't ask for directions, really? No man asks for directions. And, that he was mad you bought a $15 Kohls shirt? Really, no one should buy those da+n cheap Kohl's shirts. That's certainly a waste of good money. And, he gets upset when furniture gets scratch... oh my, send him to jail already. You are nitpicking! Of course his upbringing was horrific--something has to account for his behavioir. Inlaws are always controlling and crazy when you are fantasizing about being with men other than your husband.

Your husband sounds cynical..which is often linked to higher intelligence. He still sounds decent no matter how you try to portray his imperfections.

Sorry, but your husband didn't "drive you" to think about other men. That's your free will and your decision. You don't love him and probably never have and you married him knowing that. You need to address that as the issue because that's what the issue is. You don't love him. You are probably just as much, if not more, to blame... Quit trying to make him out to be a bad guy to give yourself an excuse to look elsewhere.

Seriously, I would have had a lot more respect for you if you would have presented your "part 2" as the problem and not try to have us all go off on your husband first and then drop the bomb. People that do that, tend to be manipulative. Possibly your manipulate personality is a reason for the lack of emotional intimacy in your marriage.

"I would have had a lot more respect for you if you would have presented your "part 2" as the problem and not try to have us all go off on your husband first and then drop the bomb"

Well said! Although it was pretty easy to guess what the mysterious "part 2" was gonna be.

I agree she is in the 'nit-picking' stage. My ex went that route too. During some of the arguments/discussions we had while breaking up, she had the nerve to call how I treated her "abuse"... I was floored. Sure, we were not perfect for each other, and yes I admit I made mistakes and didn't pay enough attention to her....but I did love her, I was faithful, treated her with respect, came home every night...rarely out late with the boys or anything, was an involved father, worked real hard so she could stay at home, provided a nice house, vacations and even a country club membership for us. This was the "abuse" she was subjected to....I would think many women would have signed up to be treated like that.

But when she realized that she did not love me....anything I did became a problem....I think this is where the OP is.

"...she is in the 'nit-picking' stage..."

I don't know. Sometimes people make decisions kind of in reverse this way. Unhappiness/dissatisfaction leads to nebulous un-acted upon "decision" and we begin imagining life without. As time goes by we start accumulating lists of justifications for what we're thinking about doing even if only to explain it to ourselves. Has to make some kind of sense before we can act so we don't seem impulsive or unreasonable....even to ourselves. We start keeping track of our annoyances where, before, we pretty much let everything go. We have to get enough weight on our psychological/emotional scale so that it clearly tips in our favor. Otherwise acting would seem wrong to us and we don't see ourselves wanting to do a "wrong" thing. The other guy has to be "wrong". And it starts taking up our mental space. Bit-by-bit, it's starts pushing the good stuff aside and changing our perspective.

Kids do this a lot but aren't very good at it so they can usually get straightened out. Adults, especially smart ones, are much better at it. Have no idea whether or not that's going on in OP's case but I've seen it other places so can't help but consider.

First of all, I wud like to thank you all for your valuable inputs. I feel much better having spoken my heart out. Nothing has changed in my life yet but atleast I can think more clearly now. Some of you have been very supportive, by that I don't mean agreeing with me but saying things the right way. Some of u are just being nasty & don't seem to have a broader view of life.

I don't want to waste my energy answering carla35/mkroopy, but I wud like to reply to asolo. I see my future in the post titled "loveless/sexless marriage". Your reply to this post was interesting. You are advising this person that its ok to leave & be hopeful that she will find someone. I am not nit-picking & I had to give some example for the folks here to understand my husband's personality. Its all these small little things that makes a complete person. And the folks who are picking on me are completely ignoring the positive things that I have mentioned about my husband.

Anyway, I came to this forum within days of me developing feeling for the other guy & the reason being I did not feel right about it. I was also worried like the OP of "loveless/sexless marriage" that my life would end up in a similar fashion which is not imagination, as u can see, someone is experiencing it. I do not want to spend all my life waiting for something to happen that may never happen. Another reason I came to this forum was I wanted to ensure I was not blowing things out of proportion.

I got enough inputs & I am again thankful to everyone. I think I am going to quit at this stage as like I said earlier people start getting judgemental the moment u say u are attracted to someone. So I may not find any more useful suggestions. You don't have to agree with me but I wud like to hear from someone who has been through a similar situation & how they handled it, but not people who just use this forum to vent out their pent up anger.

"...Asolo...Your reply to this post was interesting. You are advising this person that its ok to leave & be hopeful that she will find someone."

Glad you thought my responses interesting. However, I said no such thing.

Don't let the feelings for that third person in! It will only complicate things.
This comes down to the communication between you and your husband. The reason why your feelings for that person is growing is because HE TALKS!!
The goal--even though the process hurts like heck (lol), is to get that kind of talking between you and your husband.
I'm sure that if the relationship progressed with this other person, you'd find things about them you didn't like (but by then, your present relationship with your husband would be in a shambles). Don't let it go there.
It's very understandable that your heart would open to someone who listens to you. It is intimacy. And it creeps up and starts becoming something else before you know it (I know from experience). Then it turns into what's called an "emotional affair". I'm not one for all those pat words, but really that is what it becomes. Avoid it at all costs.
I like the idea about the parenting classes. You and your husband taking them together would be a way of creating intimacy between the two of you as well as learning how to raise your son together. The beauty of that is it involves the entire family as a result. They'll probably ask you to talk about each of your own families of origins, and other things that will open up the channels of communication for both of you.
Just my two cents.

@lblack61- You are on the money tonight. Sage advice.

Ooooo...feeling like el jerko supremo! And a month old, now.

My previous post responding to OP said "....I said no such thing."

I misread OP's post and missed the part where she was referring to entirely different thread.....where I did, indeed, say what she said I did. I was still lasered onto this thread and blanked.

I'm the guy that says people have to own their stuff. This one's mine.

Sorry, lonelydame.

Lonelydame,if you are still around,you and I could be married to the same guy.
I don't know how old your husband is,but mine just turned 40 and acts the same way.He seems miserable all the time,doesn't have any friends,never wants to go anywhere,and is always complaining about money.When we go grocery shopping he complains so loudly about the prices that people turn to look us funny.
Sometimes I get embarrassed by his outspoken negativity...

I strongly feel my husband is depressed and/or going through his midlife crisis.He is adamant that he is NOT depressed though and refuses to go to a doctor.

Anyhow,I just wanted to say that I don't think you are a nitpicker.It is hard to be happy with someone who is negative all the time.
I keep telling my husband that life is so short.Here today,gone tomorrow.One needs to find some shred of happiness while they can.
People are so quick to jump on someone when they become attracted to another outside of their relationship,but if relationships were solid to begin with,(most) people wouldn't feel tempted in the slightest.
Don't let people here make you doubt yourself.You haven't cheated.You are just human,and women do have needs too.