Gas furnaces?

It just makes good sense to me that when you have a furnace which uses a 2 inch PVC pipe for the exhaust (and all the moisture in the pipe condenses and runs out) that you're probably getting lots more of what you paid for (heat) into the house as opposed to up the chimney

I installed a 96% efficient gas furnace (SEARS) in my last house and had no problems with it for the next 18 or 20 years that we lived there and I just finished installing a 60K/90K Goodman 94% furnace in our current house summer before last and it works perfectly too

Just wish it was as cheap to cool the house in the summer as it is to heat it in the winter

Don

If you are talking about gas furnaces, not heat pumps, then "yes". With prices of natural gas most probably continuing to increase in the future, I would think that a high efficiency gas furnace is the only way to go. Remember, an 80% efficient gas furnace wastes 20% which is a lot.

Best to you.

Yes, gas furnace -- I forgot to mention that!
Thanks very much for your advice. I'm planning on going for the high-efficiency furnace but had reservations after reading postings about high efficiency furnaces being more prone to breakdowns and costly repairs. I feel better about it now.
Thanks again!

The high efficiency furnace will be a good investment,
I think with 95+ you would get a small ($300 ??) tax credit.
And the loss of efficiency would be 5% or less depending on which unit you purchase.

The unit will only perform if your old home (tara? style)
is well sealed & insulated.

For this kind of heating season investing in making your home tighter & better insulated would be a comfort plus,
and would allow your high efficiency unit to perform as
designed.

Can you have some one do a blower door test on your home.
this shows where the house needs to be sealed..cause you cant heat or cool a leaky house.
Also duct testing can be done..so you can seal (or upgrade)
your duct system. If you go this route insist on mastic seals on duct work..duct tape is not a lasting seal.

Best of luck to you.
A duct

Great advice energy rater la! Thank you very much.

I just had a higher efficiency boiler installed in our home. The old unit was original to the house, was woefully inefficient, stayed at 180°F all the time and was more than double the size required according to the heat loss calculation.

Like you, I found that the high efficiency boilers and furnaces can be laced with issues. And when it's -20°F outside, you don't have much time to get an issue fixed.

I received an estimate from a reputable local company. They explained all the available models that they sell and had me choose three of them. They outlined them in a Good, Better, Best document. I researched them all. I either found nothing good about the modulating boilers, or nothing at all. Using this forum, I found someone local that had a high efficiency boiler that is a 15+ year old design. (The Weil-McLain GV-3). The heating company installed this older model, which was still light years ahead of what had been here. The research I did on it showed it to be a very reliable model.

As I found, you might find a high efficiency boiler that's not bleeding edge technology. The only problem I had with my boiler install was not with the boiler. It was with the little condensate pump that's supposed to lift the water from the flue drain up to the washing machine drain on the wall.

I also lucked out and used a company that quoted single prices for installs. One price. No "This is the price of the boiler, the labor is this rate and any additional parts are charged on top of that." It's no surprise, then, that they did a number of things for no additional charge, such as covering my boiler platform in sheet metal (code), vented through the roof instead of the wall and even plumbed, wired and programmed the boiler to run a future indirect water heater.

Don't be afraid of the new technology, just be cautious. When you find a model, Google search it to death. Dig for problems. Do the same toward your installer.

Putting aside the marketing hype, can anyone really justify the cost of these units. Shelling out 7-10k in a HE furnace had better have a life span of 25 years and need few repairs. Unfortunately the truth is the cost of ownership is very high,(ECM, boards, igniters, etc), and you all know they fail frequently. You never recoupe your inital cash outlay during the life of that equipment. You might save energy but far from recouping your cost! In some respects, since you need to replace them every 10-15 years, sometimes a cheaper less efficient model, although more costly to operate, and less to break, will save you much more money in the long run.

You will find repairs very cost prohibitive, so you will need a service contract which adds more to your yearly operating costs. I had a 40+ year old pilot light gas furnace that ran all the time, never one repair in 20 years I have lived at my house. Because my AC unit went bad, I thought, it made sense to replace, I went with a high efficiency for the past 2 years, and every year, the repair man is at my house. They contain very expensive circuit boards and are tempermental.

Don't pay attention to the hype that HE furnaces are more expensive to repair or have a higher frequency of repair. ECM blowers will save you about $100.00/ year in electric. If you have to replace the whole motor assembly it can be expensive $600.00. Most of the time ECM problems are located in the control attached to the back of the motor, a lot less expensive. That is where a good service tech is valuable. The major difference between an 80% furnace and 90% unit is, the 90% has 2-heat exchangers and a drain to dispose of condensate and an extra pressure switch to insure the vent system is not blocked.

Dn't forget the rebate programs in NJ for HE furnaces and A/C systems.

"Don't pay attention to the hype that HE furnaces are more expensive to repair or have a higher frequency of repair."

It's not hype but fact! HE furnaces are costly to repair and do have a higher incidence of premature failure, and a shorter life span compared to there conventional sister units of years ago. Not really much a consumer can do about that these days. But don't be misinformed in thinking these things don't break down with some more frequent than others. Why do you think so many purchase an extended service agreement? My guess its not because of great realibilty thats for sure.

My LENNOX installations carry a 10 year parts warranty from the factory, for their G61MPV furnace 94% AFUE. I have not submitted a warranty claim on one of those in over a year. I install more G61MPV's than any other furnace.

Now if you want to talk Goodman....

Goodman furnaces are much improved over a few short years ago. Since they purchased Amana and now use their technology Goodman furnaces are quite reliable.

What ever you decide, 95% efficient furnaces ARE worth installing. NJ has a rebate program that will send you $400.00 for a furnace that has an ECM blower & $300.00 for any furnace over 90% AFUE. If your gas supplier is South Jersey Gas Co. You will receive an additional $300.00. The South Jersey Gas offer expires at the end of this month.

There is a federal tax credit of $200.00 if the furnace is 95% AFUE with an ECM Blower. $50.00 for any furnace with an ECM blower.

I'm not a fan of Goodman or Amana products due to Quality issues. They are cheep to buy. "You pays your money and takes your chances."

Good luck