Just a couple of thoughts The location of your range isn't ideal if you cook, since there is very little prep space adjacent to the range. Also, the pantry is very large and really eats up a lot of kitchen space, maybe it would work as incorporated in the cabinetry.

Good luck

I agree about the island range. There is just not enough space on each side for function. (and to some degree, safety). Were you planning on an island hood?

you'd have a better island,enhancing the space if it were free of sink or cooktop-you have long walls that can handle cooktop or range/fridge and sink except for the odd space-eating pantry.

Really quick...I didn't make any major changes, but I did:

(1) Enlarge the pantry a bit (5' across the top, interior dimension)

(2) Moved appliances around to give you better work flow

(3) Added the Kitchen/DR table (42"W x 72"L)

The refrigerator, as you had it in your design, would bring people into your primary cooking/prepping area and get in they way of someone trying to prep and/or cook. By moving it to the alcove and making the alcove narrower to fit the refrigerator to give it more of a "built-in" look using walls, it allowed me to expand the interior of the corner pantry a bit to make it more useful. I suspect, though, that a rectangular pantry would work better, but I haven't worked one up yet (and it's well after midnight, so I won't have time tonight.)

I suggest a single-door refrigerator with hinges on the left so there is no issue with opening the door close to the pantry. I think you'll be OK, but it never hurts to be sure!

As others pointed out, the island was just too small for the range...so I moved the range off the island. Now, you have plenty of work room for large projects (crafts, baking, cooking, wrapping gifts, etc.) - that's one of the best things about islands and peninsulas! But it's not just work space and landing space, there's also not enough of a safety buffer on the sides and behind the range (especially with seating).

If you were putting the range in the island b/c you want to visit while cooking, then keep in mind these statistics: 70% (or more) of the time spent working in the kitchen is spent prepping
20% is spent cleaning up
10% is spent cooking (actually standing in front of the range/cooktop and working)

Plus, when cooking, you really should be watching what you're doing, not looking around :-)

With the island now clear for prepping when water isn't needed, you can use it for the task the most time is spent on - food prep!

Other things to think about...

• I would not want to sit at an island with seating so close to the range/cooktop while food is cooking (and sending out grease, smoke, steam, odors, etc.)

Adequate venting on an island is more problematical.

• Most people don't like a hood hanging down in the middle of the kitchen (and at a proper height of 30" to 36" above the cooking surface - depending on the specs), but that's really the only effective/adequate choice there is. Downdrafts, even telescoping, don't work very well.

• It's much easier to vent from a wall

• Wall range hoods are generally less expensive than island range hoods

• You need a stronger (fan cfms) and larger rangehood when over an island or peninsula (at least 6" wider, 27" deep, and 900 or so cfms)

...

To get even better help, could you please give us more information (e.g., where the doorways lead, what your family composition is, how you use the...

Thanks for the feedback, everyone. I realized that the layout that I posted had a couple missing / incorrect items - there is a window above the sink and the sliding door is closer to the kitchen area. There is also a bulkhead that brings the ceiling height down to 7' in the kitchen area. I've attached a drawing of the current kitchen design.

My wife and I were focused on trying to keep the range on the island, but you raise a few good points. The island will be very close to its current size, just rotated 90 degrees.

Buehl, you make some good points about the island and range.

There were a few things that lead us to the design I initially posted:

1. We were trying to improve the work triangle. With the original layout, the refrigerator and sink were pretty far apart and on opposite sides of the island.

Side Note: I did notice a recommendation to plan based on work zones instead of the work triangle on the page that Buehl linked to. My mother in law was a home-ec teacher and has passed on the work triangle way of looking at a kitchen to my wife and I. It's probably worth looking at it again from the work zone perspective as well.

2. We wanted to rotate the island. There really wasn't enough room to do it unless we moved the refrigerator. My wife wants to be able to face the dining area and living room while cooking. Buehl's point about prep and cleanup vs. cook time is interesting. We do cook a fair number of frozen meals - the kind that you just heat up in a skillet, though.

3. We really struggled to make the pantry corner work, and building the pantry seems like it would make better use of that space. We currently tend to "store" a lot of items on the counter. The pantry also reduces the number of cabinets we will need, which reduces the total cost of the cabinets. Once we started sketching in the pantry, we liked the idea of a bar / liquor cabinet in the alcove where the refrigerator was originally. I would be interested to see where your idea of a rectangular pantry leads.

I'll try to provide some of the information that is mentioned in the "Layout Help" topic.

Currently, it is just my wife and I living in the house, but we do have a baby on the way. My wife and I cook a reasonable amount, but we are typically time limited. So, it is a lot of simple meals. We do host 1 or 2 family meals each year with a total of 15-18 people.

Our main goals with the kitchen are to get an updated look and to make the kitchen more functional / efficient.

With a child on the way, there's no way in hell that I would intentionally put in an island cooktop as small and unsafe as that one is. You need to do whatever it takes to move it to a wall. In your last layout, there is zero reason it couldn't go on the back wall as a focal point.

Ditto what hollyspring just posted.

Why do you want an island cooktop?

I agree that the range in the island is very unsafe, especially for children. I current have an island with a cooktop on it (was like that when we bought the house) and 2 young children. I am constantly policing the island (they LOVE to run around it) when I am cooking and telling them to stay away when I am cooking.

I think you said your wife wants to face the eating area while cooking? Well I THINK that statistics show that you spend more time prepping a meal (you could do that on the island) than cooking it, so it would make more sense to leave the island empty as a prep space since she will get more time facing the table while prepping than cooking. I could be wrong...

I agree with the above advice about the range.

We have 4 kids still at home, including 2 yr old twins. Our house has a cooktop at the end of a penninsula and it is extremely unsafe. I never, ever leave anything on the cooktop, even for a moment, unattended. The cooktop actually causes quite a bit of stress for me with the twins and when our older son has friends over who are not used to a cooktop. They all seem inclined to want to lean near it, run near it or set things near it. Our past houses have all had ranges against a wall and I have not had the same issues with kids.

I have the "frustrating layout" thread and you can see the poor layout I currently have. The cooktop is part of the driving force of changing the layout.

The cooking within the penninsula or in an island also severely limits space for prep and space for kids to help safely if anything is cooking. Maybe it would work for you but really consider the safety issues and think about an active toddler who reaches, grabs, climbs and wants to help.

Regarding "work triangles"...I posted this almost three years ago on a thread that was discussing whether the "work triangle" was dead. (I've also linked to the thread below.)

++++++

As I was eating a late dinner after my first post, I got to thinking...it's not that the triangle is dead and zones have replaced it, it's that zones are a natural development beyond the triangle.

The work triangle was the beginning of a concept of kitchen design...the zone concept merely extends it.

You still want decent minimum/maximum distances b/w major appliances/fixtures, but those appliances/fixtures are in zones... The refrigerator & pantry are in the storage zone(s),
The main (or only) sink & DW are in the Cleanup Zone,
A prep sink (or very close proximity to the only sink) and the refrigerator (close proximity to it) are in the Prep Zone, and
The range/cooktop is in the Cooking Zone
Lastly, the Prep Zone & Cooking Zone should be either next to each other or very close to each other...preferably w/o the Cleanup or other Zone between them.

The zone concept also encompasses the workflow...that Zones should follow the natural workflow in a kitchen (as Lisa shows & Plllog also described) Storage --> Prep --> Cooking --> Serving --> Cleanup & Storage (for leftovers & ingredients left out during prep)

These are also the main work zones. These zones are the ones that are the primary components of the work triangle. The others zones/centers are almost always secondary and it often makes sense to have them outside the work triangle somewhat so they don't get in the way of the primary work zones where most of the work in the kitchen is usually done (yes, there are exceptions). Of course, you don't want those secondary zones/centers so far away that they're impossible to use...

If for some reason one of those secondary zones/centers has to be located elsewhere, then adding appliances/fixtures will make the zone/center more useful. For example if the Baking Center is far from the sink(s) and refrigerator and pantry, then locating the oven(s), adding a small sink, a small refrigerator or drawer, and appropriate storage in that center will make it more usable for its function - baking.

Sometimes even the major zones have issues with appliance/fixture location that the addition of a small refrigerator or drawer or prep sink can solve...but great effort should be made to not have these issues with the major work zones.

Complimenting or maybe even extensions of the zone concept are ideas such as...

• Adequate work aisles,

Adequate workspace in each zone and amount of workspace tailored to the activities done in that zone,
Adequate landing space around & located for each appliance/fixture (including safety margins and emergency landing space around ranges/cooktops/ovens),
The Refrigerator & MW both being on the periphery when possible to allow both the kitchen insiders (i.e., those working inside the...

Kitchen work zones, what are they?

"Zones" are areas in your kitchen where the work occurs. Work in the kitchen is broken down into three primary work zones. Everyone has these three zones, everyone!

Prep Zone...This is the zone where food prep takes place. Food prep can be anything from making a sandwich to preparing a multi-course meal. It includes cleaning/rinsing food, cutting, mixing, processing, etc. For many people, especially those with small kitchens, their Prep Zone is also their Baking Center for rolling out dough, etc. 70% of the work and time spent in the kitchen is spent prepping. It's the most often used and longest used zone in your kitchen!

Cooking Zone...This is the zone where you take the food you've already prepped and apply heat...cooktop, oven, MW. Only 10% of the work and time spent in the kitchen is spent actually cooking. This is the least used Zone, relatively speaking. Think about it, you usually don't spend the entire time standing in front of your oven or cooktop watching it cook. Sure, there are some things that do have to be stirred constantly, but most things do not. And even then, you usually still spend more time prepping before you begin cooking.

Cleanup Zone...This is the zone where the dirty dishes are handled! Dishes, pots, pans, etc. 20% of the work and time spent in the kitchen is spent cleaning up.

++++++++++++++

OK, now we know what the primary zones are. So, how do we design a kitchen keeping them in mind?

Prep Zone...works best when it contains a water source and is next to or across an aisle no more than 48" wide or so from the Cooking Zone. Trash & recycle bins should also be in the Prep Zone.

Cooking Zone...works best when next to/across from the Prep Zone (see Prep Zone). It's also nice to have a water source nearby as well as trash & recycling nearby.

Cleanup Zone...works best when separated from the Prep & Cooking Zones. This can be on the opposite side of the sink in a one-sink kitchen from the Prep Zone or it could be in a completely separate location (the latter usually only works well if you have two sinks). Obviously, it also needs a water source and the DW.

What else do we need to keep in mind regarding planning a kitchen and zones?

Dish Storage...works best when it's near the DW and near the serving/eating locations (island, DR, Nook, etc.)

Food Storage...works best when it's near the "action". It's nice to be able to store staples, etc. at their point-of-use, so food storage can be spread throughout the kitchen. E.g., flour, sugar, etc. in a "Baking Center", spices in the Prep or Cooking Zone, Cereal close to where breakfast is eaten, etc. If you have a dedicated pantry, it's nice to have the pantry near the point where the groceries enter the house as well.

Refrigerator...works best on the periphery of the kitchen so it's easily accessed by people working in the kitchen as well as "outsiders" looking for a snack...

So, taking into account the new information provided, here are some designs. The first one (1a) is a rework of the first one I posted that incorporates the structural changes per 4x400m (window and movement of slider).

Layout 1a - still my favorite of the three (with the MW drawer):

I have a MW drawer and like it so much that I would never go back to a countertop NW or even one mounted on a shelf under an upper cabinet. It is very convenient and easy to use - even for tall people (we're a relatively tall family and we all really like it!)

Layout 1a zone map

Layout 2:

Layout 2 zone map

Layout 3 (I don't particularly like this one, but to give you different ideas):

Layout 3 zone map

As you can see by the zone map, all three primary work zones are crammed into one space. In addition, there really isn't much in the way of contiguous counterspace. The only place with at least 36" of counterspace is to the right of the range - but in front of the DW and where the Dish Hutch is. Note: It doesn't have to be a hutch; it could just be a base + upper cabinet.