Well Matt I'm sorry you feel that way. I'm trying to figure out why though. After reading this post I went back to look for some of your other posts. I couldn't find very many. Only about nine since last year Other than today when you bumped heads with Annie, I couldn't find anything negative. If you hang around longer you will find that occasionally some of us rub someone else the wrong way but in general we are very friendly. It's a cooking forum and we are bound to disagree. Wait until you see what happens the next time cornbread gets discussed.

Ann

Ann T mentioned cornbread, but people here disagree about everything. Bain marie or no bain marie. Sift flour or don't. Expensive knives or cheap. How to season cast iron. No-boil lasagna versus regular. Peeler or parer. The list goes on.

If there was one right way to make something then there would be no recipes, there would just be "the way". I don't post recipes all that often, but when I do I certainly don't expect everyone to drop what they've been doing all their lives and adopt my method. And I certainly don't mind a critique.

Intentional or not, some people have a tendency to become a little arrogant or condescending when one person's preferences don't align with theirs. If you can't let it go and feel the need to get into it, I guess you gotta do what you gotta do. I've been there. But these tiffs don't need to spill into multiple threads.

Peace, everybody!

I probably shouldn't even say anything, but my experience might help.

I first came here years ago. I found it very "clicky". I contributed many a post but I might as well have been invisible. No one even responded half the time. And then I ran into a poster who took umbrage at something I posted. This poster went so far as to start with me at other forums within GardenWeb (that's where I found this place) on other subjects like movies and things, and I finally ended up just leaving. I'm too old for that school yard bully crap and I just don't have the patience for it.

I recently got back into vegetable gardening pretty heavily and was around Gardenweb again so out of curiosity I checked back in here - I didn't even know if I could post any longer as it's been years since I was here. Anyway, I find it to be a MUCH friendlier place now than it was then. Maybe I just didn't give it enough of a chance before - I hate to paint the place as having been unfriendly, but that was MY particular experience at that time. And most of the negativity was from just a couple of posters. But I just love to cook so much, I enjoy reading what others are doing, talking about cooking, etc. And first hand experience from other people is invaluable. I don't post that many recipes because I'm really not a recipe person - I'm a throw in some of this and some of that type cook. I only ever follow a recipe exactly the first time, then I leave out what I don't like and add in what I do. Baking is another story, of course, but then again I don't bake all that much, altho I am starting to do more now, which is another reason I'm here again - to take advantage of some of the expertise exhibited here!

Anyway, I would give this forum an A+ now if I had to recommend it to anyone. The things I've learned about yogurt and bread alone are worth their weight in gold. Also, from spending time on different forums on different subjects over the years, I find you have to take a breath and cool down when someone gives you grief. Sometimes the written word comes across as rude when the person posting it never meant it that way. It's impossible to hear that "laugh" the person is making the comment with and it comes across as an insult when it's not meant that way. It gets annoying to have to type "lol" type things on the internet, but I use them to make doubly sure the person knows I'm joking and I also try to use smiley's :) to get across that my comment is meant as friendly.

Also - I personally have a hard time remembering what I posted in what thread and who I promised a recipe to - I try my best to keep up with things, but sometimes it gets away from you. I'm HORRIBLE with names and keeping straight who's who is tough for me - especially when they sign with a different name than they use as their ID name. I just noticed that there's an annie1992 and an annie1973 - perfect example; I just pulled those numbers out of my butt - I know there are two with two different numbers, and I think I know which one raises her own animals and things, but I mix people up all the time!! Eventually I'll learn who is who, but I don't know anyone here well enough yet that their "personality" jumps out at me, and that helps avoid problems as well.

That's my two cents, anyway. You butt heads now and then, but that happens. Everyone has their own way of doing things and would "never" do it that way!! No pun intended, but take things with a grain of salt and move on. And join a political forum if you REALLY want to get into some battles with people!!! I moderate at one and the fur flies at times, believe me!!

Sorry for writing a book, but I wanted to get everything in! ;)

Lisa

Sometimes a post can sound a whole lot worse than it was meant. Your mood when reading it can influence it too.

I'm not saying your interpretation was wrong, just that it is possible that maybe the post wasn't meant at all the way you believed it was. (I have no idea what the post was - hope it wasn't me!)

So far, I have found everyone here to be extremely nice and very generous. I'm the queen of sticking-foot-in-mouth and wouldn't be surprised at all if I have offended people here. (So, if it was me, please forgive me!)

I used to play yahoo pinochle. There are some realy big bullies and babies there, let me tell ya. I had to give it up for a long time just because of them. Still, I rarely play because of them.

Guess I'm in trouble again ( yet )
foodonastump:
Lisa:
Oct.:
You are all right!!!
I should have never put in that Post.
Although it is the way I feel.

There were so many subtle things said and done to me,
If I mentioned them, you would think I'm Crazy.
There were things I Posted that were given a thumbs down,
( not right ) or I don't do it that way.

Even when I was proven Right, it was never acknowledged.
And I was left to look like a dummy.
These members know who are !!!

I don't have the Eloquence with words as some others.
Often,I use the wrong choice of words to describe or explain things .

But I know one thing that I said many times.

I am not better than anyone and there is no one better than I, except one person.
He is Supreme.

There are a lot of people who can't smell themselves,
because their noses are so high up.

I don't mind if my Recipe's are not used but

when I go thru the trouble of Posting one, that someone asked for and it is not used, that's OK.

BUT !!!!! When I hear about all the others that are so great and may be from Siberia,
That's a bird of a different color.

I came back here to help, if I can.
There are other places where my experiences would be very much appreciated and have been.

Don't need Notority. I have gained enough, thru the years.
In many fields.
I'm not bragging , just want to let it be known.

I have many Talents , which I like to pass on to others.
That's what experience is for!!!

Lisa:
You are right about your first comment. And the CF Hotline.
There are Cliques in every Organization.

There are a lot of CF members that have left for the same reason.I am a Die Hard

I was a Member of GFD in Delaware Co ,Pa. , for 12 years.
Left as a Lieut.of the Aerial Ladder.

When I first started I noticed 3 Cliques . When I tired of this, I wrote a Long letter addressed to the Chief. It was about him and his Collegue Clique members.
I decided not to read it at the monthly meeting and gave it to him.

Well, he went and read it. It got so quite, I thought everyone left the room.
After the meeting everyone came up to me to shake my hand.
I didn't know half of them.

What was happening before was , the different groups were talking about things they didn't like,
eg. the older guys who put in 30 or 40 years and were now Fire Police.
I said in my letter, everyone has a job they can do, even if they are " to old " to fight Fires.
And it should be appreciated , not knocked .
Well that letter straightened out the Fire Co.

I'm going on too long . I have to leave room for all the comments that may follow.

If anyone does not like the way I think. TS !!!!!
That's one abbreviation I remembered.

Have a nice day,
LOU

.

I will be brief...I originally came here some years ago from the garden forums looking for cooking help; I have gotten too many bonuses to name. I take the good with the bad just like anything else.

I know Lou first hand, he generously tries to share his vast cooking experience and numerous other unrelated skills just to be helpful. It just may not be exactly what others are looking nor their chosen method but he has had many successes in his life and I for one appreciate his efforts.

In recent years, I have made friends with CF members who have turned out to be my best friends regards of the fact that we don't see one another face-to-face often.

I go to the grocery store, I see someone looking at a product that I know nothing about or know a lot about. My fist impulse is to strike up a conversation about the product just as we do here but then I bite my tongue.

Much to my kids dismay, I just strike up that conversation anyway.

I think that's a good thing! I find most people are friendly back, when you're friendly towards them to begin with. And you never know - you might learn something from them!

I don't do it much at the grocery store, but I've been known to butt in at nurseries if I overhear someone questioning about a plant I know about! 99.9% of the time, the person is very nice. Don't let the .1% get to you!

Lou - I haven't been here that long, but I think you're a doll! I can't pinpoint it, but you remind me of a couple of my uncles (altho we're probably around the same age!!)

Lisa

Cliquey or not, I enjoy this forum, although I'm not on it very much at all. Long ago, I learned not to care about cliques, and I just butt right in anyway. Who cares what people think of me. Cliques can only be cliquey if others let it affect their own personal self-image.

I love Lou's contributions, and have to say, last night, I made a pizza crust using a recipe from Food and Wine (instead of Lou's, gasp!) and my kids hated it. They much prefer Lou's recipe, as do I.

I have also enjoyed the contributions and recipes and commentaries with others, some of whom have no doubt been involved with Lou's negative experience. Again, we are a varied bunch of people, from all walks of life. Although I would like to meet many of you some day, in all likelihood I probably won't, sad to say. I can't keep up with my RL, much less my forum life. :)

It would be nice if we all just got along, and no one got hurt feelings or was caustic with others. But that's not real life, and it's utopian. Life really would be so much less interesting if we were all the same.

I think we should all remember that we are real people, and have real feelings. As long as the golden rule is observed, "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you," everyone will be much happier here.

xx to all of you,
Nancy

I GET a lot more from this forum than I GIVE. There are so many knowledgeable people here who give endless advice, answer thousands of questions, don't mind answering the same thing or posting the same recipe over and over again.

I think the reason it SEEMS cliquish is because there are lots of people here who have "known" each other for YEARS. So they tend to communicate as old friends. To someone coming in new who doesn't know everyone else, this might seem like they're a clique.

But take it from someone who has never been able to break into an existing clique, that is absolutely not what is happening here. From the minute I "set foot" in this forum, everyone has jumped in to answer questions and be kind to me. People I hardly knew and who hardly knew me. Over the past few years, I've been lucky enough to meet some of them in person, and they are the nicest, friendliest group you could ask for.

As foodonastump pointed out, there are lots of different ways to do things, and the fun of this forum is reading through them all and deciding which ones might work for you and which ones you want to try and which ones you want to comment on from your own experience.

When someone comes here new and doesn't really yet have a feel for the group dynamic and jumps in implying that a particular method is the one & only way, and that whoever doesn't do it that way either doesn't know what they're doing or doesn't want to expand their horizons, it's inevitable that those kinds of words have an inflammatory effect. Especially to some of these highly experienced knowledgeable cooks.

I think everyone's opinion is valuable... we just need to be open to all opinions. Even if we might not agree with every thing people say here, it's just not that great of an idea to stamp our feet and insist that we know better than everyone else.

fotomat, I highly recommend sticking around, voicing your opinion and gleaning lots of great recipes, ideas and advice here. Just relax and try to get to know us. You might find out that we ARE, in fact, a great bunch!

Aah and here I thought Lou was being thanked for his cheesecake recipe :)

I've been hanging here since before it was....I remember when the cooking forum was brand new....
I would say, stop whining! If the only reason you post on a forum is to have someone tell you how clever you are and how wonderful your recipe is, why then, you are here for the wrong reason.
We are a very wide variety of people, with very different styles of cooking, different tastes and different life experiences. But, we all meet here to share recipes experiences and opionions....BUT we are different!
I would never in a million years make a cheese cake with melted ice cream as an ingredient, but I am sure others would never make a carrot cake which contains 6 cups of sugar!
I would never make lasagna or spaghetti sauce using soup base, garlic powder nor onion powder, but I am sure there are lots of people here who would never make bread by dumping flour, yeast, salt and water into the food processor.
But I hope that my posting my method for bread, someone might realize that you can make home made bread very easily, and I think there are lots who realize that you can make spaghetti sauce without chopping onions and garlic.
All posters are valuable...
While this forum is read by thousands of people, most of whom never post, aren't registered and may only pass through here once, all posters lend something to the mix.
But to hold the expectation that every time you post a recipe or hint that someone will post and say..."Wow! I tried your recipe and it was the best ever!!" is very unrealistic.
So when no one directs a post to you and says that they tried your recipe and it was the best ever, don't get your panties in a wad and walk away or post a whine.
We are many.....we have different experiences, backgrounds etc...like I said above. The whole of this forum is bigger and stronger by sharing our many traditions, ethnicities and experiences.
Hang in.....eventually you'll see what it's all about!
Linda C

Ah gee, I guess I'm pretty oblivious. I'm not a great cook so I don't have much to contribute. I come here usually looking for help for myself and my DC/DH. What I really like about this forum is how nice and how helpful to each other you are. Please don't make me feel stupid. Please continue to be what I think you are...kind...helpful...knowlegable...good natured,,,good humored...better spellers than I....and that means you too Lou.........Tache

I too when I first came on this forum felt like I was being ignored when ever I posted something. Seemed like my recipes were never being tried out, or were being looked over. But after a few months I found people warmed up, became super supportive, offered the greatest advice, and even phoned me personally at home to offer their experience! (that was a personal highlight, and no Ann I have not taken the plunge and made them yet as it is one of those things I have to work my way into, and plus I have had no time, but I promise I will let you know when I do).
I too read this forum every single day and sometimes more, and yet sometimes don't reply to anything for weeks. Sometimes it's a time issue, sometimes it's just I feel I don't have anything worthwile to contribute, and sometimes I start to post and think that it doesn't sound right and never get back to it.
The talent, the fun, the friendship that is shared on this forum would be hard pressed to find on another.
It's not clicky, it's just we need to get to know each other before warming up, just like in a personel relationship.
I started a job a few months ago which I absolutely love, and I find it takes up alot of my time. I am so lucky however to be working in the food business, and I find I pass on alot of info from thia forum on to the customers that come into the store. Thank you all for that. You are all a wealth of information, and the customers are so benefitting from it, lol.

Shelley S.

Lowspark:
I hope your comments are not being directed at me ?????
If they are, You have it all wrong.
And I cannot believe someone would say things like that without mentioning names.
I won't go into who or what I am troubled with, no one would believe me.

There is a saying " what goes around , comes back around "

I don't intend to stay here and defend myself any longer.

LindaC:
I assume your Post is directed to me
I've read your Comments, in fact the first Paragraph sounds just like you.
" Here for the wrong reason "

You have a nice way with words

I don't blame you at all, for not liking anything I've done, from my first Post.

Remember the " Platted Bread " and the Bagles , you had a ball with that one.
I saved a lot of the old Posts , just in case my memory
fails.
Good thing I did , someone pulled them out of the archives

Who would ever think of making Cheese Cake using Ice Cream.
Let alone finding an easier way to make Spaghetti Sauce using Soup base and Powdered spices.

I must be a real Wacko!!!!!
That's it for tonight. Hope you have enjoyed yourself.
Lou

.

I have no idea what someone can say.....my post was intended to point out that there are many ways to do things....not just one.....if you didn't understand that....well, I don't know what I can say more.

My first real "aquaintance" with Mae/lowspark was during an exchange a lot of years ago. Seems that the person who was to send to her didn't or couldn't or something. So someone arranged that lots of us send lowspark a surprise package.....that was fun!!
Linda C

It seems that just about everyone except Ann, Lowspark and me has completely lost sight of the fact that this thread is about FOTOMAT not about LOU.

Not at all foodonastump. I've been biting my lips so bad I'm probably anemic by now. I really resent foto for trying to drag Lou into this. Maybe it was misinterpretation on MY part but foto did come off as insulting and condescending. Starting with.. "If it is your goal to never make anything more challanging then white bread...." Then about "I realize that some people don't have the time or inclination to expand their horizons." Sigh.... This to a forum full of people who spent months learning and debating about the no knead bread recipes. Helping all the time with those who are learning bread and sourdough as well as all the other things shared on here. Yup, I know who this thread is about. I would like Foto to share. Many of us here have our own very strong opinions. I know I do and I get a bit forceful about them at times, but, I try not to insult people to get across the idea of how much I hate oregano, for instance. Smiles. Btw, I spent the 15 minutes watching the Reinhart video and understood it very well. I didn't find the concepts all that revolutionary, but I did find he went over his points a few times too many. I found it rather boring and was really mad there was no recipe. LOL Anyway, this post is about being included, ignored, not made to feel welcome. Gotta give respect to get respect. This post didn't further your cause in MNSHO foto.

Thanks Foodonastump for keeping us focused. Actually, I responded as I did because - I knew Lou felt targeted with some of the followup comments; I haven't had any issues with Foto in order to respond specifically to him; it was an opportunity to make general comments about my continued participation on the Cooking Forum.

Lou,
Not at all!! As foodonastump reminded us, this is about fotomat. There was a bit of a ruckus on another thread which apparently was the impetus for this thread.

Matt, stick around.

"In recent years, I have made friends with CF members who have turned out to be my best friends regards of the fact that we don't see one another face-to-face often."

Cathy is so right in this. And we don't always agree on how to cook something either. But we agree to disagree and put on out big girl/boy pants and move on to other fun things. Now if you find that you cn't work with that, then it might be best to just lurk. I do that on other forums.

Lou, keep posting recipes. Just because we don't respond does not mean we didn't copy and paste and hit save!

Peace all, the full moon is over.

I have been annoyed / thinking about this thread since I read it yesterday; came back to it this morning to make a comment. I was confused - Foodonastump pointed out : "this thread is about FOTOMAT not about LOU".
For Lou's sake - I suggest everyone understand this as I did not, even though AnnT addressed the poster as Matt. Lou did not make the original post & it appears he has been dragged into this and feels he needs to defend not only his honor, but his contributions to this group.
I don't ever get involved in these kinds of posts as they get ugly fast & result in alot of hurt feelings.
I hope I am not adding fuel to this fire - my intention is to point out this is not about Lou.

Thanks ladies :
I hope this is ended, because I Don't like it at all.
I don't know what the problem was, with " Matt "
May have been away at that time.
I'm sure she didn't mean to cause any ill feelings.

As far as my feelings I could care less. Like I said before,
I can give help where it is appreciated. If I left the CF.
There are some who might like that !!!

I just don't like having to defend myself, because someone wants to make themselves look better.

Like the hatchet is kept handy to come after me.

I've even tried talking very nice to certain parties but apparently the Hatchet is still kept handy.

It's not true that the members Post Recipes and don't expect to be recognized.

Everyone that Posts here here expects some recognition.
That's what it is all about. We are not shouting into a Vacuum.

Everyone wants recognition !!!!!
Ann C, Mama Mia , Cathy,Kathleen, Shawn, the list can go on forever.

It's nice to be recognized for your efforts.
I realize that my Posts are not for everyone to like.
and I usually state that, when I put in a Recipe,
that I've come up with.

I don't like it when I'm made to look like a Dummy, for doing things my way.

And when it is found out.I was right all along.
It is never acknowledged
That's OK too !!!
- - - - - - - - - -

When I first joined the CF, I was warned about a Wild Animal and to be on Guard.

I must have recieved 25 emails congradulating me and saying just about the same thing.
I answered them " Don't worry, I was reincarnated as a Wild Animal Trainer."

Problem is people don't like to make waves, Just sit in the boat and go with the flow.
If they get knocked out of the boat, because of Obsticles,
Just jump back in and go again.

I'll do that too; for just so long , then I have to knock the Obsticles out of the way.

In conclusion,I have to say, I think I have made many friends on the CF.
And there are those who don't like me. That's OK !!!

My Grandfather used to tell me " keep trying things,
eventually you may acquire a taste for them "

That may go for people too !!!

LOU

Lou, I remember when you first signed on. People didn't get your sense of humor and were put off by your remarks. Hey, the written word is difficult to say how we feel and sometimes when we are kidding around it doesn't come across that way. We are all unique and have differing opinions about a multitude of things. Hey, no big deal. Nobody should get hurt feelings. I don't post recipes because I 'wing' everything and sometimes don't have time to cook much of anything. But I enjoy the personalities here and love to look at the pics of everybody's great dinners. Sometimes it inspires me and sometimes it costs me alot of extra $$$ because I then have to go out and buy things I normally wouldn't get! Thanks folks! Just remember that we are all different and yet so much alike in many respects. Nobody should slink off mad because of a suppossed slight. Really, LindaC doesn't like my brand of comedy but I'm sure she is a fine person. So she doesn't like garlic or onion powder. Who cares? Do what you like and enjoy. Many people will like and appreciate your contributions and some will not. Big deal. That is life. Do what you do. Enjoy yourself and the interaction with some nice people, and there are many on this forum. It is really a unique and great place to hang out. If you get your feathers ruffled take a break and come back. Sometimes that is all that is needed.

Duane

Well, on topic of what the TITLE of this thread is, if not the content, thanks Lou--I finally tried your pizza sauce as well as your method and we all loved it. (The strange looking bacon chicken animal with 4 legs, though...dare I try it?)

Not to speak for Linda, who is certainly able to speak for herself :) , but I interpreted her comment as sort of like we all cook differently and even though some recipes sound bad to some of us some of the time, the general smorgasbord of ideas is what makes this a fun place. Variety is good, even though we may not choose to test out some of the things that are really far from what we are used to cooking.

Anyway, I just ask questions here, and someone always answers. That's pretty darn nice.

Duane: I appreciate what you are saying . I have had my share of ruffled feathers and
I know how to straighten them out but when someone keeps ruffling them ,
I have to do some ruffling of my own.

When I first signed on, I didn't use any sense of humor.
I just put in a Recipe and said how I did certain things.

That was my first Feather Ruffling experience.
It sort of Snowballed from there and then the snowball melted.
That is the experience that was burned into my brains
computer.
And that is what I was speaking about,

Being made to look like a Dummy and it didn't end there.
No one does that to me.

Read my Threads again. Maybe you missed something,
because I think I've said just about the same thing.
LOU

Fori:
Thanks for the thanks. You are welcome.
You can try the Chicken but leave the legs up.
Or it may come out of the oven after you.

As far as your interpretation , I'll leave it go at that.
I want to get on with other things.

Maybe some of the problem is some people need more fibre in there diet.

Lou