I make demi glace. It is ''easy'', in the sense that you won't break a sweat, the total amount of time actually spent working is maybe an hour or two, and the chance of botching it are pretty much zero. But it takes a good while, like 24 hours, and if you don't trust your range to simmer unattended overnight or while you are out doing stuff, it will take all weekend. You will want a large stockpot - 20 quarts is the minimum, but it can be a cheapo aluminium one - to end up with enough demi. Because what you want is three or more ice cube trays of demi, so that you can wrap the cubes tightly and sock them away in your freezer and not have to make demi again for six months or a year. It is very nice to have demi on hand! I've never tried commercial demi glace.

I do. Check out the recipe on Saveur's web site, saveur.com. It is very labor simple but time intensive, lots of simmering and waiting. The main advantage over store-boughten is, as with so many things discussed on this Forum, that you can control what goes into it, especially sodium. Once you have tasted home made demi, you will never go back to the jar from the grocery. It adds a depth and umami to so many things, much more than the bouillon from the store. You can also make it from chicken, same procedure, just sub chicken bones for the veal bones. I wouldn't dismiss it until you have tried it. It's really worth it.

Steve

Yes, the time consuming part is what threw me off. :) If you don't mind my asking, what recipe do you use? Do you use Madeira or Sherry? And re. the bones, have you made it with regular beef bones or just veal?

Steve, didn't see your reply before I posted. I didn't know chicken bones could also be used, thanks for the tip. And thanks for the website, the recipe is different from the one I have. I kind of figured home made would be superior to store product, it usually is, darn.

I have yet to find a butcher that can give me 10# of chicken bones, and saving them in the freezer takes forever! What I usally do is 5# Chicken Wings and 5# Legs and using a cleaver or my biggest knife, try to break most of the bones to expose the marrow, gives that unctuousness to the final product from the gelatine in the bones.

I learned a tip from one of our chefs. On a really low simmer like this, if you make a collar of aluminum foil around the bottom of the stock pot and touching the surface of the stove, it keeps the very low flame required from blowing out during the long simmer.

If you start Saturday morning, you should be done by Sunday evening. I do refrigerate overnight, I like to be sfae, and then start the reducing again on Sunday. As Jonliu said pour in ice cube trays and freeze for best storage. You will love the results.

Steve

Thanks for the aluminum foil tip, but we are stuck with an electric stove. I miss gas cooking, so much nicer. Will keep the chicken wings tips and legs in mind, it definitely would take a long time to accumulate 10 pounds. Now, to set aside an entire weekend, ha. This might be easier to do in winter. :o)

Steve - Aside from reconstituting it into stock, how do you use chicken demi-glace?

I'd like to make more beef/veal stock/demi-glace but the animal ingredients get expensive. It's not like chicken which you can accummulate over time through the course of "normal" meals, or which I have the option of buying scraps (backs and necks) fairly cheaply.

To recreate any prepared product that
might contain "chicken flavoring", when I cook rice to make a healthier version of those rice packet side dishes. With a little melted butter and drizzled over vegetables. When that roast chicken didn't make quite enough juice for gravy, when I feel like chicken gravy and don't have a roast chicken! Anytime something you are making needs that little bit of depth, umami, whatever you care to call it. It's that sort of elusive flavor you can't identify, but would miss if it wasn't there. I find myself reaching for it at the oddest moments, but it always seems to add.

Steve

Gee, after reading that, I am really tempted to run to the store and get started. :o) Do you let it cook with the rice, or do you add it shortly before it's done to prevent diluting it with the cooking water?

Yes, it's a labor of love but so worth it. I use the recipe in the link below. I think Sharoncb gave it to me when I was still up at the lake and first found this place. Chase/Sharon has one too but I don't have it on this computer. Hopefully she or someone will share it. I Love having those little cubes of flavor in the freezer.

Never thought to do the same with chicken. Thanks for the heads up Steve!

David

Here is a link that might be useful: Demi-Glace

Yes I make my own twice a year and it is well worth it too me. It takes a lot of elapsed time but not that much effort. it's my rainy weekend project.

Just love having it in my freezer for fast but delicious gravies, beef stroganof, French onion soup, hunter sauce etc. Would not be without it.

here is my recipe , often times I just stop at the Brown Sauce (Sauce Espagnole) which is one of the four Mother sauces.

Demi Glace and Sauce Espagnole (Brown Sauce) made from stock

For Stock

5 Or 6 Pounds Of Beef Bones, Veal Bones ,Maybe More
2 Celery Stalks Chopped
1 Onion Chopped
2 Carrots Chopped

For Brown Sauce

3 carrots chopped
4 celery ribs chopped
1 Large Onion Or 2 Small chopped
1 cups Butter
1 Cup Flour
3 TBSP tomato paste
12 Cups hot beef stock
Thyme, Bay Leaf, Parsley

For Demi Glace
2 Tbl Maderia
additional beef stock equal to The Brown Sauce

For the Beef Broth
Drizzel the bones and veggie with olive oil and sprinkle with salt and
pepper. Roast the veggies and beef bones in the oven at 400 degres for
30 minutes, turn and cook 30 minutes more or until lovely and carmelized.
Place in a large stock pot and cover with 18 cups of cold water. Simmer
for 4-6 hours. Strain, place in fridge. In the morning skim off fat.

For the Brown Sauce ( Sauce Espagnole)

Saute mirepoix ( chopped onons, carots and celery) in butter until the
onions are light golden brown. Add tomato paste and continue cooking
gently. Make a brown roux over low heat in a heavy pan with 1 cup of
butter and 1 cup of flour. When the roux is a hazelnut color, add two
thirds of HOT beef broth. (Reserve one third for demi glace), and whisk
together. Add the vegetables, as well as a bay leaf, a little thyme and
some parsley stems. Simmer the mixture for 2 to 3 hours, skimming off
the scum that rises to the

surface. Strain it through a fine strainer, and press the mirepoix
gently to extract their juices. CHill over night. Skim off fat.~
Then, for the demi-glace, add an equal amount of beef or veal stock,
bring it to a boil, and simmer until the sauce is reduced by half, again
skimming the surface as necessary. Off the heat, add 2 tablespoons
Madeira. Freeze in ice cube trays.

Note: Totals are:
18 cups water for broth
12 cups broth for Brown Sauce
6 cups broth for Demi Glace plus 6 cups of brown sauce

Lakeguy, thanks so much for the link, what an interesting website! Lots of recipes to read through, I've already found several I want to try out.
Chase, thank you for the recipe!! I've printed it out, it does look fairly easy though time-consuming. Do you find you get more use out of the Brown Sauce or the Demi-Glace? I guess you could keep half of the Brown Sauce, and just use the other half to make Demi-Glace.

petra, Honestly I get way more use from the Brown Sauce, it's incredibly rich and has a beautiful depth of flavour. If I feel I need the extra depth that demi glace gives I simply make some from the frozen brown sauce. Just add Madeira and reduce.

"Note: Totals are:
18 cups water for broth
12 cups broth for Brown Sauce
6 cups broth for Demi Glace plus 6 cups of brown sauce"

Chase,I'm confused. Nothing new about that! And I'm probably over thinking but it sounds as though you are starting with 18 cups of water, the roasted bones and veggies which would give out some liquid, reducing by about a third to end up with twelve cups of broth. Then if you use two thirds of the twelve cups (that is 8 cups) how do you end up with six more cups of broth for the Demi Glace?

I finally have a store where I can easily get/order bones and I really want to do do this but I'm not totally understanding the amounts.

Thanks.

Lee

Or, are you starting with eighteen cups of water, somehow ending up with eighteen cups of broth, meaning the only reduction is whatever additional liquid might come out of the bones and veggies, and then using two thirds of the 18 cups of basically not reduced broth to get the twelve cups of broth for the Brown Sauce and six cups for the Demi Glace.

I don't know if I'm more or less confused now.

L

lsr, that's the way I read it, you start out with 18 cups of water for broth, and after reduction, that leaves you 12 cups, of which you can use 6 for brown sauce, and 6 for demi glace.

Question. I'm stuck with a glass top stove and wouldn't trust leaving it on overnight. If I started early on Saturday morning in a stockpot, then move it over to a crockpot to leave on during the night, put it back on the stove on Sunday morning would it be just as good or would I have to cook on Monday too?

To clarify the liquid amounts.
Lee you are right. I don't find there is that much reduction but I'm sure there is some. Most important thing is to use 2/3 for the brown sauce and reserve 1/3 for the demi glace.

I'll remove the numbers at the bottom of the recipe as they are confusing.

Beverly, there is no need to leave it cook overnight. The recipe calls for a three day process.

Day 1 the stock, chill over night in the fridge, skim fat. Day 2 the brown sauce, chill over night, skim fat.
Day 3 the demi glace

I removed the reference to cups from the footnote and added this. Hope it's clear.

Note re liquid amounts.

Use 2/3 of stock for Brown Sauce and reserve 1/3 for the Demi.

For the Demi use equal amounts of brown sauce and stock.

Thank you so much, it is now perfectly clear. I've read your recipe when you have posted it before but never had an easy source to buy the bones and now I do. I'm really excited about trying this. I shop at the store that has the bones about once a week and will order them the next time I'm there.

Thanks again,

L

Petra, I use the absorption method when cooking rice. 2c water, 2T chicken demi and 1c rice. Bring to a boil, reduce heat to lowest setting, cover and check in about 15 minutes to see if all water is absorbed. Fluff with a fork. Perfect every time.

Steve

Steve, thanks! Have been trying to switch to brown rice as much as possible and it takes a looong time.

Petra, for short grain brown rice, increase the water to 2.5 cups and the cooking time to 30 minutes, or until as tender as you like it and the liquid is all absorbed.

Steve

Thanks for the clarification Sharon!

Beverly

Steve, thanks, around here, it takes about 45 mins. Just have to keep telling myself it's healthier, ha.

Is there an Asian grocery with a meat department, around you? They will often have bags of beef, chicken, or pork bones for cheap. Cow neck bones have a lot of meat on them, knuckles and leg bones are good for gelatin and marrow, etc. They also often have fish heads and carcasses too, if you're making fish stock. I've never seen veal bones there. Also, check out the cow tendons and pigs feet, great source of gelatin for stews and stocks.

I've made it too, once. Using Sharon's directions and hoping that I knew what I was doing, LOL.

It was very nice but I found that I had to keep the cubes in my kitchen freezer over the refrigerator or they got "lost".

Every year when I have cattle butchered I get LOTS of bones. I use them to make stock, and hopefully, some this year will go to demi-glace. I've found that my big 18 quart Nesco roaster works like a champ and I'm not loathe to leave it simmer all day or even overnight, like I'd be with an open flame. Just leave the lid ajar so you get the necessary condensation.

I roast the bones in the roaster, then add the liquid and simmer it, leaving my stove free for other cooking.

Annie

Annie, you have the perfect way to do it and a convenient source of bones.

John, there is a large Asian market, HMart, in the metro area about an hour from my house. I do shop there about once every 4 or 5 weeks because I get my hair cut near there. I've never noticed bones, but I've never looked. They do have chicken feet, pigs feet and a marvelous array of thin sliced meats for hot pot types of dishes, shabu shabu, pho, sukiyaki, etc. And they have nice looking pork belly. Also great produce, I love to shop there.

Lee

I have 3 large packs of grass fed soup bones in the freezer, so I am hoping to get started some time this week. It's fun to try out new recipes, provided they turn out edible. :o)

Lee, I love shopping at the Asian grocery too. Ours has a bunch of seafood tanks, which is cool.

Things I promise myself, or dare myself, to try sometime:
- The pig's faces (I hear that something there - the jowls? - is a delicacy.)
- The lamb brains (my first encounter with fried brain, with FOAS, ended in a draw. I wasn't sure what I thought of the brain, and the brain didn't think much of me, as I'd eaten it. I did have the feeling that deep frying would have been better. Although FOAS chowed down on the brain like an enthusiastic cannibal. Scary.)
- The salmon heads (I once had an awesome sashimi of salmon nose that had in marinated in something - sake? - until it was soft enough to slice and eat. My grandfather used to like fish brains and eyeballs - brrrr).

John, the jowls may or may not be a delicacy, but we have always asked that the jowls be smoked into "jowl bacon" and then used in beans or for breakfast, just like "regular" bacon.

Annie

John, have you tried "Big Red Ruby"?

dcarch

Just wondering what's considered normal price for beef bones in areas somewhat compatible with NY metropolitan area. The marrow bones I roasted for lunch were $1.99/lb and calling around it seems $1.69 for soup bones is about the best I can find.

Not cheap, when recipes are calling for 12 pounds of bones, but then again the remaining ingredients are relatively minimal and cheap. And if the end justifies the means...

p.s. dcarch - No need to quote prices from those funky places you go to in NYC. I will NOT buy dead bones regardless of who tells me they're safe and edible! ;-)

That is a cool site for sure Petra. I hope your first try with this is a success. Like others have mentioned it does take some time but you can take on other things while the reductions are doing there thing.

FOAS, can't help with prices in the NYC area. We always seem to have cheaper pricing compared with that part of the country when it comes to food. Not sure why?? Not sure how much beef y'all consume. I save bones in the freezer from steaks and prime ribs if I don't devil them(thanks ruthanna) until I have enough. That might be an option but it does take some time to save them up.

David

FOAS, Boulder is certainly not New York, but not the cheapest place to shop either. The store where I will get the bones has femur bones with knuckles which they will cut to any size. We buy just the long bone part cut into two inch lengths for our dog, who has shown us quite unpleasantly that he can chew up the knuckle parts in a flash and they don't stay inside him very long.

That store carries natural beef, no steroids, no antibiotics, no growth hormones and no animal feed. I usually roast a few sections for us and freeze the rest for our dog. We all think the marrow is a treat. For the stock I will get half long bone sections and half knuckles which they will cut in half so more gelatin will come out in the stock. These are clean bones, no meat on them. They are $1.69 a pound so I think your price sounds fine for your area. Beef prices have really gone up everywhere. A year ago if I watched the sales I could get a variety of beef for our dog for less than $2.00 a pound, usually I would pay about $1.59 to $1.79 for round steak, chuck roast or lean ground beef on sale. Now a good sale price is $2.99 a pound so that is my new limit for the dog. I can get chicken a lot cheaper, natural boneless skinless breast for $1.59 or bone in skin on thighs sometimes for $ .89 or $.99. He eats more chicken than beef now but is still well fed.

I stopped at a large Mexican supermarket in Denver on my way to a meeting tonight and bought three pounds of lovely, meaty beef shank with marrow bones to make some beef veggie soup. The shank was $2.69 a pound. What they called soup bones were oddly sawn chunks of bone with a small amount of beef for $2.29. For the 40 cents difference the shank slices were a much better choice for a rich beefy soup. They had no cleaned off bones. They also had chicken feet for $ .99 a pound. I was tempted but I really want to try the stock/brown sauce/demi glace and I'm out of freezer room so I passed on those.

The Asian supermarket is 40 miles from my house in another direction in Denver so I don't know yet what they have in bones.

Lee

Believe it or not, here it's nearly impossible to buy soup bones, my local grocery store had some "marrow bones", well cleaned and cut into about half inch slices, for $2.19 a pound, made me glad I don't much like them!

So, although most of my food prices are far cheaper than NYC, beef isn't. I get kind of "out of touch" having my own beef, so when I check the grocery store, I'm always astounded and then I go right out to the farm and give my cows a treat and a scratch and tell them how much I appreciate them!

Annie

Our supermarket marks meat down 50% the day before the best by date.

I watch each time I'm there and pick up whatever beef bones I can get, beef ribs, short ribs, soup bones etc and toss them in the freezer until I have enough. I also save all the bones from any bone in roasts or steaks I cook.

I prefer to have some meat on the bones when I make my Brown sauce and demi.

Which leads me to the next question - I'm assuming the bones I'll get are pretty clean. If that's the case, should I be throwing some meat in there? Any cheap cut? I know Cook's Illustrated likes shanks, but they get pricey.

Thanks Chase, I'll sacrifice the shank slices I was going to use for soup and add them to the bones. I would think that three pounds of very meaty shank would be enough to add to six pounds of bones, is that OK?

FOAS, in our main stream markets beef shank is $5.99 a pound so a real find at the Mexican supermarket for $2.69. Maybe I'll go back and look at their "soup bones" which were the odd shaped chunks. Our markets mark down meat too, but only by about 25%. The Mexican market is still my best choice.

I looked at several videos, including a four part one from a cooking school with a huge kitchen and they all used clean bones, but I know that Chase has been making demi-glace for a long time and I trust her choices. In our house, there is no such thing as steak or roast bones with meat left on them and I think Max would know I was crazy if I asked him to give up chewing the bones.

L

LOL Lee

It's just me with the meat on the bones thing....that is way more than enough!

I think it all works...just don't add beef base powder...that would make me nuts! LOL

Beef base!!!! Isn't the whole reason we are making the demi-glace to avoid that stuff?

Yes, I use it occasionally when I have to, but never without making a face.

Just thought to call a local German butcher. "We sell beef bones, may or may not be some veal in there, $1.50 a bag." It seemed reasonable to ask, "What's a bag weigh, approximately?" He seemed quite annoyed at that. "No idea, there's about six bones in a bag."

Freakin' Krauts. (I think I can say that; I'm German.) I thought the better of asking diameter and length of the bones. I'm hoping this is a cheap option. Over lunch I bought a 20 quart stock pot from the local restaurant supply, and I look forward to making some stock and brown sauce next week!

OK, I'd have asked how big the bags were too! It'll be interesting to see what you get for $1.50.

Annie

LOL FOAS! Sounds like a deal!

Good luck with the brown sauce.....and I don't want to hear you had to pitch it 'cause then I'll just have to send you some of mine!

Darn, I was all set to do this over the weekend. I went to the store that has the bones, they only had knuckle sections and said they won't get more in until the knuckles sell. It looked like they had about ten or twelve pounds of them in the freezer case. The next closest store in that chain was totally out but may get some in next week.

I called two other stores in Boulder, both small chain stores, yes they had them for $2.49 a pound. I called the one family butcher in the area, also a German butcher, who had "a ton of marrow bones" in his freezer, for $2.69 a pound.

So at best I'll get to do this next week, but it may be after Easter.

I'll be watching for updates from Petra and FOAS.

Lee

Does anyone have experience making stock in a pressure cooker? I think it would work well for this process. You might want to boil the bones for 10 minutes or so (without pressure) to draw out the blood and other proteins that foam and cause clouding. Discard that water, add fresh water, your aromatics and make the stock in the pressure cooker in 1/3 the time.

Yes, someone here makes stock in the pressure cooker, maybe Teresa from North Carolina? I don't remember.

I do mine in my big Nesco roaster because I can do a lot when I have beef butchered, and then I can the stock for later use. I'm afraid my little pressure cooker wouldn't make enough for me to can, and my big pressure canner needs to be used to can the stuff!

anyway, you might want to start a new thread with "making stock in the pressure cooker" in the title, and the people who make it that way will answer, when they might not look at this.

Annie