"I've been told that heat pumps shouldn't be installed in homes north of South Carolina. Any truth to this?"

thats nonsense.also if you have over a couple feet of clearance above the unit moving it will be a waste of money.

This winter has had an effect on just about every region. There was a time when heat pumps weren't efficient enough to be used in colder climates but they have been much improved. If the home has been designed with a heat pump in it's design, it should perform well. Could you explain a bit further about the wall insulation not that great? Sufficient wall insulation is important. The outside units should not be located under a deck. Depending on how high the deck is, would make a difference whether it impacts the operation or not. If the placement under the deck doesn't cause the units to recycle the condenser air, and the air flow is sufficient, you should be ok.

Thanks for the input.

The builders were cheap. There were a number of problems we discovered after moving in. Most of it is detail stuff, but they cut corners where ever they could.

It's a 4 story building. We own the bottom two floors, and our neighbors own the top 2. We have insulation in most of the exposed walls, but that's it. There's no insulation separating our unit from the neighbors, and I'm not sure there is insulation on top of the building the way a usual home would have in the attack because of the roof top deck. Not only this year, but the past two years their power bills in the winter are SEVERAL hundred dollars per month. Ours aren't quite that bad, but that's because we keep it as cold as an ice box and they're still higher than anything my friends in the area pay for similar square footage.

Also, we can hear everything in the building. It's like the neighbors are in the next room. I've lived in multi-unit buildings before, but this one is the least sound proof of them all. I can only assume it's because there is no insulation in the interior walls and our ceiling. I don't know what else it could be? I'm admittedly fairly ignorant on building matters, but these power bills are far from normal, and it's senseless that we have to freeze in order not to pay $500+/mo for power in the winter. I don't know what else it could be if not the heat pump/insulation.

Thanks.

"...if you have over a couple feet of clearance above the unit moving it will be a waste of money."

The manufactures call for a lot more then "a couple feet."

To not affect air flow through a fan, the minimum clearance is normally takes as a t least 3 fan diameters, and 5 is more realistic.

If the area under the deck becomes warmer during cooling there is not adequate air flow for cooling or heating.

brickeyee,

let me provide some additional information and see what you think. The two heat pumps are side by side and tucked into a corner beneath our deck. There is about 6-7 feet of clearance above them. The deck is a black metal grate, not a traditional wooded deck (urban setting), so there is not air getting through the planks as you would expect with a wooden deck. Furthermore, they are surrounded on two sides by a concrete wall with about 1 ft clearance on those two sides (imagine a three sided box with a top on it). Does this change your opinion?

We were thinking of moving them anyway because they are outside our bedroom window and are loud (our bedrooms are on he bottom floor, partially submerged--english based type setting). The area where the compressors are located opens onto a patio that we'd like to be able to use. I'd like to be able to pitch to the neighbors that it would be more efficient if they weren't down there recycling compressed air, but if not, then that's fine. Does anyone have an idea how much it would cost to move them?

With the new information, I think the units will have to be moved. I still don't think it should impact your heating but it will definitely impact the cooling efficiency of those units. The costs will vary regionally. The electrical as well as the refrigerant lines will have to be moved. One some systems, the length of the lines makes a difference. If that is so with your units, resizing the unit may be necessary. Just a wild guess, the ball park of $1,000.00 per unit wouldn't be uncustomary just to move them.

The mid-atlantic is a big area. More specific? Also what are your electric rates? Do you know if your backup strips are coming on?

Thanks guys.

david,

I live in D.C. I know electricity in D.C. is expensive and know the perils of PEPCO. Our place is about 1600 sq ft split over two floors. The upstairs neighbors have about 1800. We literally have everything other than major appliances unplugged unless in use (this includes tvs, lamps, computers, stereos etc). When not at home (about half the day) we keep the heat either off, or on about 60. When at home it rarely goes over 65, and that's just for a few hours at night before we go to bed. While sleeping we turn it down to about 60. Even with that, our bills approach $250-$300 in Jan/Feb. The neighbors aren't quite so conserving, and theirs approach $500+. They usually keep it around 65 during the day and 68 in the evening. Last month, the bill was $740.

It seems like our heat pumps are constantly running, even if I keep it at 60. I have other friends who live in English basements that can keep their place at 65-68 and only pay just over $100 in the winter. Granted those are only one story and about 300 sqft less. But does that really make up total cost?

By backup strips, do you mean the auxiliary heat? The thermostat indicates that it comes on, even if I up the heat by a degree or two. Does that mean they are working? I have no idea.

you are doing yourself no favors constantly moving the temp around. you are forcing the unit to run on aux heat much of the time.heat pumps are designed to run much of the time.

if you have 6 feet above the units that is more than enough. moving the units might not be as easy as you think. there are length restrictions on the lines.
you really need to have someone look at the unit to see if its working correctly.

A couple of things. Haier is a Chinese brand. Take that for what you will.

Auxiliary heat is far more expensive than the normal heat pump output. Depending on outdoor temperature, it may be two, three, four, or more times as expensive. You want to minimize its use.

Some thermostats will turn on the auxiliary heat if the room temperature drops even slightly below the set temperature. If you fiddle with one of these, you are guaranteed to drive your heating costs through the roof.

Really cold weather will require some degree of auxiliary heat. The trick is to use the minimum amount and rely on the heat pump for the rest. This requires that the heat pump installation be done correctly with an appropriate thermostat, preferably one that can lock out the auxiliary heat when it is not absolutely needed.

You need a really good HVAC person to evaluate your installation, move the unit if appropriate, and install a thermostat capable of locking out the aux heat when appropriate.

Then you need to set the temperature in your unit and leave it alone, especially when it gets really cold and the aux heat is going to be kicking on and off. If you don't have the lock out feature, you need to set it and forget it now.

If the deck overhead is solid, the units are within a cement structure with only 1 foot of space on 3 sides, the units will have to be moved. This is especially required for cooling. A sufficient amount of heated air is being deflected back down (even with a 6-7 ft. clearance)and raising the air temp entering the condensing unit. This proportionately effects the subsequent removal of heat from the condensing unit. As I said above and vhehn confirms, the length of tubing can make a difference so there is a remote chance the unit may have to be replaced with a properly sized one. The peculiarity of your situation will require a qualified professional to do a site survey and assess the actual situation and provide estimates if corrective action needs to be taken (get 3 estimates). Can 2 of the walls be removed?

I sincerely wish I could recommend a better, easier, low cost opinion but it would surely be a dis-service to you. You need to make it right considering the heat and humidity your area suffers!! It'll cost you more in the long run not to!

I just want to give a 3rd vote to not touch your thermostat. I have HPs that don't get to aux heat unless I touch them. That is pretty typical. I am surprised but if I bump my stat 1 degree, aux heat will come on even if it is 40 degrees out. I don't appreciate that sensitivity (for lack of a better word) but it is there.

Similarly, a programmable stat could be a problem with turndowns at night and when you are away at work. Some stats would be ok with this but I am guessing by your system that yours would not be ok. I have a sophisticated system that can handle gradually heating up a house for a few hours if it takes that to avoid using aux heat.

I've heard numbers of heating bills being 40% higher than usual this year. Obviously your bills are quite high. Do you have electric hot water? A dehumidifier? No doubt the real culprit is aux heat. I think my system can use $1 an hour (at 10 cents a KW). I'm a bit further south so you might have a bigger system despite the small size.

You should know that insulation is not an option and I suspect yours is okay. There may be horrible air infiltration as that is still allowed for some reason. I guess it is possible in an area with failing government (I think DC would qualify but I don't know) to have woefully inadequate inspections and therefore the possibility of inadequate insulation....