I have not read the rest of this thread, just this most recent post, but I got 1/4 beef last week. The cow was apparently on the smaller side, at 610 pounds, so we paid our price per pound based on 1/4 of this total weight, so our portion was 152.5 pounds. We buy through a small local store, so our price per pound includes cut and wrap and everything in one number. We have 36, one pound packs of ground beef, about 18 pounds of stew, stir fry and cubed steaks, 10 pounds of steaks (we opted for rib roast for Christmas rather than rib steaks, and we chose to have more other roasts than steaks, so our steaks are NY strip, top sirloin, tenderloin and tri-tip), about 30 pounds of roasts and 6 pounds of "soup bones". I told them I wanted a share of the organs, they just left it for me to work out with the store, I think it depends what the other buyers want, but you should be entitled to a share of the organs. I'm not sure why, and we didn't get this before, but they also packaged about 25 pounds of bones and 18 pounds of "beef scrap". I have not gotten these when we've gotten beef before, even last year through this same place. Maybe it's because we discussed the organs being for the dogs (though I declined "dog bones" ) but I wanted soup bones, I really don't know. I'm going to thaw a pack of the scrap and see if it's feasible to cook that for the dogs, but I may also share it with my neighbor who hopes to have a deer to process this fall. Anyway, I just had to throw in that last part because all of this, including the 43 pounds of stuff we've not gotten before, fit in 3 cardboard boxes. Heavy boxes, but still will fit in the car with no problem. I think without the extras, it would have been pretty close to fitting in just 2 boxes.

Becky, It is hard to say what is "too late" for tomato plants as their blooming period/pollination must occur during specific temperatures and I am not certain when you have that range of temperatures in your part of the state. And, of course, some plants do set fruit at slightly warmer temperatures and some set fruit all summer long in spite of the temperatures. So, I'll try to explain it all a little below. "BEST" PLANTING FOR TOMATOES AS RECOMMENDED BY OSU'S SPRING GARDEN PLANTING GUIDE: April 10th thru April 30th "Best" Planting Dates For Average Large-Fruited (Slicer and Beefsteak Types) Tomatoes: April 10th - April 30th* "Best" Planting Dates for Paste Tomatoes (Roma types grown for sauces, salsas, and fresh eating: April 10 - June 1st* "Best" Planting Dates for Cherry/Grape/Currant tomatoes (all the smaller bite-sized ones): April 10th - June 15th* "Best" Planting Dates for Plants Bred to Flower/Set Fruit in the Worst Heat of the Summer: April 10th - July 1st* * The catch is that the later they are planted, the later they produce ripe fruit. Keep in mind that even the earliest tomatoes will still take about 8 weeks to produce ripe tomatoes after the plants are transplanted into the ground. The larger, later tomatoes can take 3 months. A few take even longer. So, if you did make that April 10th planting date (and I know you don't expect to), you could expect your first ripe tomatoes around June 10th, although my experience says that it is more realistic to expect them sometime in the last two weeks of June. If you get your plants in the ground by April 30th, you can expect ripe tomatoes no earlier than June 30th and, more realistically, sometime during the first two weeks of July. But, of course, there are some varieties that produce above average yields and earlier than expected and some produce below average yields and later than expected. TOMATO BLOOM AND POLLINATION: Tomatoes begin blooming once the plants are a certain size (and they really don't have to be very large) AND the temperatures fall within a certain favorable range. Basically, they need nighttime temperatures that are no warmer than 75 degrees and daytime temperatures that are no warmer than 92 degrees in order for maximum fruit set to occur. Notice that I said "maximum fruit set". As a market grower, of course you want to get maximum fruit set because you need the greatest "output" (tomatoes to sell) to cover your "input" (costs). However, it is likely you won't get maximum yield in your very first year because there is a learning curve. What happens once "hot" weather arrives that causes pollination to shut down? Well, basically the pollen gets "sticky" and that "stickiness" can keep the pollen from moving from the male part (the anther cone)of the tomato flower to the female part (the pistil) and more specificallly the stigma, which is the pollen-receptive tip of the pistil. (Tomatoes are self-fertile and self-pollinate.) And, even if pollination occurs, fertilization may not happen because heat causes some tomato pollen to become sterile. And, even if fertilization does occur, not every fertilized flower will set fruit. Some fertilized flowers merely fall off the plant once the plant feels like the weather is "too hot". This loss of flowers is called blossom drop and it cannot be prevented. SMALLER-FRUITED TOMATOES: Both the paste-type tomatoes and the bite-sized ones are not generally affected by temperatures, so pollination and fertilization will occur during hot weather. Most paste-type tomatoes, though, are determinates to they produce all their ripe tomatoes at the same time. Most bite-sized tomatoes produce continually throughout the summer. In general, date-to-maturity numbers can help you choose your tomato varieties. Most varieties that will give you the best production in the heat will have DTMs of 70 to 80 days. Some of them will even have DTMs of 55 to 70 days, but these tend to be those with smaller fruit. Some tomato plants ignore the rules and produce fruit even during the hottest weather, but those tend to be the exception rather than the rule. Finally, breeders are now breeding tomatoes that can pollinate and fertilize in daytime heat of up to 96 degrees. Unfortunately, these are not being bred for flavor, really, and some people don't like the flavor of these heat-setting tomatoes. You can recognize these by the use of certain key words in their variety names, mostly "Sun" "Solar" or "Heat". Some of these varieties are Heat Wave II, Sun Leaper, Sun Master, Solar Fire, etc. I hope all this info helps you understand how the date that you plant affects the tomato plants and their ability to produce tomatoes. The one key fact to remember is that tomato plants generally pollinate and fertilize when nighttime temperatures are in the 55 to 75 degree range. In future years, once all your beds are built and you have the whole routine figured out, you will be able to plant at the earliest time when your soil temps (55 to 60 degree minimum) and air temps are ideal to give you early production. Keep in mind that the earlier you have ripe fruit to sell, the more you can charge for them, especially if you are among the first grower at the market to have ripe tomatoes. Later in the season, as more tomatoes ripen and all the growers have plenty of them, you will have to charge less per pound to be competitive. That is a great lesson for the kids in the law of supply and demand. Now, about the tomato cages. Cages are used by home gardeners but usually are not used by market growers or commercial tomato farms. The cages are very labor intensive and expensive, taking a certain amount of time to make and then to set up in the rows and stake. They also slow you down when it is time to harvest. Many market gardeners use trellises and large commercial tomato farms use methods that are conducive to the use of commercial harvesting machines. How many plants are you intending to plant? Let me know and I'll describe the best support options for that size of an operation. Have a lovely day in the garden. Dawn

OK, it's not Brandywine but it's good. I ate my first one today.Looks like they go 1 to 2 pounds with a few slightly over 2. Not the 2 to 4 as Burpee promised. They are big beefstakes and some gravy boat shaped. I don't prune so I am not disappointed in their size. PH makes consistently large tomatoes that taste good so I am happy with it. My plants are very bushy and about 7.5' tall now. Production is very good for such large fruit. I will take pics of individual toms in a couple days when they are totally ripe. The one I just ate was a "little" guy about 10 ounces which is about as little as you can find one on the plant. I am happy with PH so far this season.

A PL version of: I have PL versions of the following: *Neves Azorean Red Big Zac Big Beef Porterhouse *Orange Heirloom *Chapman What am I bid? LOL Why don't hybridizers breed more PL's? Well, you've got your Brandy Boy and a few others I can't think of right now, but take the experience of Petoseed with the Husky series. Those varieties have rugose foliage and they were NOT well accepted by the public at all. So from a commercial standpoint I have to wonder if many PL varieties will come out of the larger commercial hybridizers such as Petoseed, Novartis, Sakata, Known-You, Harris-Moran, Takita, for instance, and all the big hybridizing firms in the Netherlands. They all saw what happened with the Husky series. Most home growers are still growing only F1 hybrids. I think those of us who are somewhat tomato obsessed often forget that we have been exposed to many varieties that the general public has not been exposed to We here know of sources for many other varieties, many of them PL, and we raise our plants from seed while most folks don't. I think that the best chance of having some new PL's is going to come from the breeding efforts of Keith Mueller, Bill Jeffers and a few others who are doing lots of crosses that might lead to some darn good PL varieties, and already have, actually. I'd mention Tom Wagner as well, but he hasn't released anything he's bred to the public in many many years. Carolyn