linnea56,

It's not necessary to knead the dough so you can just use a wooden spoon to mix the water/flour...or, use your hands. Keeping your hands wet will keep the dough from sticking to you for the next 3 weeks! :)

The back of a 'no-side' cookie sheet lined with parchment paper cut to fit your baking stone will work perfect & is, in fact, my perferred method since I'm a clutz with a peel.

Have Fun! You'll be hooked...

/tricia

Any large sturdy cooking spoon works well. I woulnd not use the FP as it doesnt need to be beaten. Sorry, Shadow wants to sit on my keyboard

I had some difficulty mixing it with a spoon so I wet my hands and finished mixing it with my hands. Quick and easy.

Carol

I've been successful making good bread with the simple method shown in the video linked below. It works.

Jim

I used my (wet) hands; it works best. I tried the first time to use a wooden spoon, it was too hard for me to get it all mixed up really good.

Thanks! Im not usually a "hands-in-the-dough" person, but it sounds easier in this case.

terrapots, is Shadow a cat? Gave me real start to read that. I have grey cat named Shadowwho spends a lot of time on a small blanket right next to the keyboard.

I'm not much of a "hands in the dough" person either, but when all else fails.......:-)

Carol

I use a dough rising bucket and a Danish Dough Whisk. A Danish Dough Whisk is the ultimate tool for breads and batters. You can find both at King Arthur Flour - www.kingarthurflour.com - Dough Whisks - items #5568, 5575, and a dough rising bucket - item #5060. You can get these plastic food storage containers, with lids, in a lot of different sizes from a restaurant supply store.

Jim posted the link for the New York Times method. The link below is for the Artisan Bread in Five Minutes a Day video. They are entirely different methods.

In the video linked below they use a wooden spoon and a dough rising bucket (aka food storage container with lid).

-Grainlady

Right. They are different but do have a couple of things in common though, such as no kneading. What's your opinion of the NYT method, Grainlady? Have you done it?

The Five Minute a Day Video only gives quantity info for flour, not for the other ingredients and nothing about baking. Can you direct me to a complete recipe. I would like to try it.

I've been getting good results from the NYT method, thanks to the detailed instructions in the video, but it may be more limiting. For example, I'm not sure if it's possible to make shapes other than a simple, round loaf.

Jim

If one doesn't have the loose plastic bucket with loose fitting top what are you using? ? A bowl with loose saran?
Also has anyone ever tried to 1/2 the basic Artisan Bread recipe?

I have not done it yet, and dont want to invest in equipment I might not use long term. Im going to hold off on buying new stuff until I see if I actually get into this more than once or twice. I have a lot of big bowls, and was just going to use one with saran. So Id like to know too if there is any reason why not. The baking stone seems to be important and that I already have since Ive made a lot of pizza using frozen dough.

The basic recipe is just 4 loaves. I think its the keeping for more than a day in the refrigerator that is supposed to give it sourdough-like flavor, so Im not sure that if just making enough for 2 loaves you would get that quality. We love sourdough (but using/keeping starters seems like too much work) so thats an incentive for me, versus continuing to buy frozen dough.

You can certainly use a big bowl to mix and store your bread for these recipes. The main thing is to cover the dough securely to prevent it from drying out. I think a bowl cover (aka shower cap) with elastic around the edge works just fine.

I use a Danish dough whisk also - it's very sturdy. But a large wooden spoon works just fine also. Because the recipe is left out to rise several hours after mixing, the rising action helps to further mix the flour and water together.

Here is a recipe from The Splendid Table:

From Artisan Bread in Five Minutes a Day: The Discovery that Revolutionizes Home Baking by Jeff Hertzberg and Zoe Francois (Thomas Dunne Books, 2007). Copyright 2007 by Jeff Hertzberg and Zoe Francois.

Serves 4

Note: This recipe must be prepared in advance.

1-1/2 tablespoons granulated yeast (about 1-1/2 packets)
1-1/2 tablespoons kosher salt
6-1/2 cups unbleached flour, plus extra for dusting dough
Cornmeal
In a large plastic resealable container, mix yeast and salt into 3 cups lukewarm (about 100 degrees) water. Using a large spoon, stir in flour, mixing until mixture is uniformly moist with no dry patches. Do not knead. Dough will be wet and loose enough to conform to shape of plastic container. Cover, but not with an airtight lid.

Let dough rise at room temperature, until dough begins to flatten on top or collapse, at least 2 hours and up to 5 hours. (At this point, dough can be refrigerated up to 2 weeks; refrigerated dough is easier to work with than room-temperature dough, so the authors recommend that first-time bakers refrigerate dough overnight or at least 3 hours.)

When ready to bake, sprinkle cornmeal on a pizza peel. Place a broiler pan on bottom rack of oven. Place baking stone on middle rack and preheat oven to 450 degrees, preheating baking stone for at least 20 minutes.

Sprinkle a little flour on dough and on your hands. Pull dough up and, using a serrated knife, cut off a grapefruit-size piece (about 1 pound). Working for 30 to 60 seconds (and adding flour as needed to prevent dough from sticking to hands; most dusting flour will fall off, it's not intended to be incorporated into dough), turn dough in hands, gently stretching surface of dough, rotating ball a quarter-turn as you go, creating a rounded top and a bunched bottom.

Place shaped dough on prepared pizza peel and let rest, uncovered, for 40 minutes. Repeat with remaining dough or refrigerate it in lidded container. (Even one day's storage improves flavor and texture of bread. Dough can also be frozen in 1-pound portions in airtight containers and defrosted overnight in refrigerator prior to baking day.) Dust dough with flour.

Using a serrated knife, slash top of dough in three parallel, 1/4-inch deep cuts (or in a tic-tac-toe pattern). Slide dough onto preheated baking stone. Pour 1 cup hot tap water into broiler pan and quickly close oven door to trap steam. Bake until crust is well-browned and firm to the touch, about 30 minutes. Remove from oven to a wire rack and cool completely.

Yes Linne, shadow is my semiferal indoor cat. She's toothless, has cost me a fortune since she's been here and hisses at everyone except me. She has to "read" every fax, answers the door each time and is fascinated by the laptop monitor and will just walk right across the keyboard. I tell DH she wants her own email account, LOL. She's very hyper but keeps us laughing with her antics and has been very trainable except for the electronics curosity.

I have the Danish dough whisk and really love it. The dough does not stick to it I ordered it through Breadtopia where there are videos on making no knead bread pretty much like the 5 minute, except it's one loaf but variations. There are sourdough variations and very confidence building for me to vary the recipes to my liking. I would check that out also. Just google "breadtopia" and it will come up.

Thanks for the recipe, teresa.

Jim

Thanks for the help! I just made my first batch of dough. I mixed for a minute or 2 with a spoon and then went in with my hands. You were all right, it came together quite easily. I have it covered on the counter for the 2 hour rising and then will put it away overnight and bake some tomorrow.

One thing that might be useful for someone else: The recipe said 1 ½ T of yeast would be 1 ½ packets. It wasnt: at least not for Red Star brand. I decided to measure the packets to be sure and it took 2 full packets to equal 1 ½ T. Maybe I could get away with less but didnt want to risk it for a first try.

I read through some of the other threads on this procedure and have another question. The piece of dough I am supposed to take out tomorrow is grapefruit sized, which is supposed to rise for 40 minutes. My kitchen is always cold (~ 65 F) and I dont have a pilot light to provide some warmth. The other thread mentioned it taking much longer than 40 minutes. Rather than relying on time, how much rising would be the right amount? Double? Anyone have a ballpark size they can tell me is right, like 6"? 7"? Thanks again!

Linnea, it's not about doubling in size after you take it out of the fridge, it's about bringing the dough up to room temp. So, don't worry about it rising and feel the dough or just stick it with a instant read thermometer. I usually do that because my house is cold and I can't always tell by feeling. I just leave it sit on the front of the stove while coming to temp. The bit of heat from the oven preheating brings it up pretty good. Then just give it the slash and throw in the oven. Btw, make sure you use enough corn meal on your peel if you're not doing it on parchment. A friend made it and it stuck to her peel a bit. Just remember it is a fairly wet dough even now, so I just make sure to use plenty of cornmeal on the peel and have no problem.

I haven't been able to resist using all the dough up within a few days, so I've been keeping the last dough from this batch as long as possible. I want to see what the bread is like if you wait longer to make it. I have noticed I like the texture and flavor of the breads I've made after keeping the dough for four or five days, so I can't wait to see how it will do at a week and a half.

Have fun.

Have fun.

Linnea, one of the corrections is: "change 1 1/2 tbls to 2 packets for each recipe".

Ah-hah! Im glad I measured the yeast now. I thought maybe there was a difference in brands, but if mfrs did that, it would mess up so many recipes that call for 1 packet.

I waited 2 hours last night (yawn) before putting the bowl in the refrigerator but I didnt see much rising then. I used warm water and covered the bowl all around with some towels to keep it warmer. I would have left it out but I could not stay awake any longer.

Since I have the baking stone I was not going to use parchment, thinking parchment might affect the crisp crust the porous baking stone is supposed to be good for. I have corn meal around (somewhere). But if parchment makes no difference to that tell me.

I dont think I have an instant read thermometer but have the kind with a spike that you stick into meat, and my husband has this fancy gadget with a beam he got as a prize at work: you aim it at a surface (like the grill) and it tells you the temperature. But room temperature is easy enough to tell. Though it wont be warmer than 65 F in this house. Front of the stove is a smart idea.

terrapots, I will think of your "Shadow" while mine sits next to me. Her blanket is a foot to the right of the keyboard but if she feels neglected she starts encroaching on the mouse. If I still dont give her enough attention she will stand between the keyboard and the monitor or walk on the keyboard.

Thanks for the tips!

recipe should read "40 minutes to 1 1/2 hours". Warm your oven a bit [90F-110F] and turn it off and let dough rise in there. Cool/cold kitchen means longer rise time.

Earl, Yours is prettier than mine! This is the last of my 5 Minute dough. I used the method in Jim's link and cooked it in a Dutch oven.

I just listened to both videos and there is a big difference in the amount of yeast. Can anyone that has made both explain this? TIA

It's a big mystery to me as to how 1/4 teaspoon of yeast is sufficient, but it is. I've made several batches using the NYT method and have found it rises perfectly well at room temperature, whatever that temperature happens to be. Eighteen hours of fermentation is the explanation. Still, it is a tiny amount of yeast compared to any other bread recipe I have seen.

I have not yet tried the 5 min. a day method, so can't make a comparison, except to observe that it uses a *lot* more yeast and is ready to bake in a much shorter time. Since the dough is intended for storage over a period of several days, it would seem that a small quantity of yeast would work with that method too, given enough time before the first batch. But I have no experience to support that idea.

Cathy, I like the looks of that loaf. The roughness where the seam opens up looks natural and attractive. If you prefer a smooth top, place the loaf seam side down when you bake it. How was the eating quality of your bread?

BTW, perhaps I went OT with that link to the NYT method. Should we open a new thread?

Jim

Jim, To your question of the "eating quality"--it was the best of the three loafs from the original recipe. It--dare I say this blasphemy--better as good as my dear mother and grandmother's. Both made bread for 70 years.

I baked my first loaf yesterday after having it the refrigerator 15 hours. Though it rose an impressive amount in the frig, it did not do much after. I set it out to rise for a few hours in my cold kitchen while I ran errands. I wanted it for dinner and did not want to take it out too late and find it did not have enough time to rise sufficiently after I came back.

I came home and found it had expanded sideways but not upward. Is this normal? I then preheated the oven and did everything else as stipulated. It rose a little while baking but the finished loaf was only 2 inches high at the tallest point, not the higher rounder loaves I saw in the pictures on the website. Everyone liked it but did not find it fantastic in flavor. I hope the next 3 loaves will have more interesting flavor. I wonder if those will rise higher?