Hi Schwester5, Thought I'd throw in my 2 cents about Miele dishwashers. I have the Diamond, not the Futura, but apparently they're really similar except for a few bells, whistles and extra cycles, and the Diamind comes with a 5-year warranty (here's a helpful link on the difference between Miele DWs): http://ths.gardenweb.com/forums/load/appl/msg0510233530587.html Anyway, I'm thrilled with the Miele dishwasher. Even though I did have a frustrating problem with a bent prong on a connector, but Miele sent a Master Miele tech 8-hours round trip and he fixed it. It cleans like a dream. My lipstick is kind of a sticky pink gloss that sticks like crazy to the rim of mugs and glasses. My previous DW (Kenmore Elite) didn't even touch those lipgloss marks. With the Miele, everything comes out perfectly clean. I adore the cutlery tray, and although the Miele appears smaller than some, you really can pile up dishes like crazy--I load bowls on top of each other in a big stack--and they all come out perfectly clean. I love all of the wash cycle options, although I like to use the longer Pots and Pans cycle. It looks great, it's quiet, and the overall operation is great. FWIW, I'm also the very happy owner of a 36" Wolf (DF Range) that I love. It was clear from peaking with the appliance people during my research on Wolf, Thermador and Viking that Wolf had the best repair record, was the heaviest (as in well-built, quality steel, etc.), and was favored by a lot of serious cooks. Thermador would've been my second choice, I love the star burners with all that BTU flexibility. Good luck!

Yes! We got it sorred out. So it turned out to be a loose circuit breaker. It was the new sub panel put in for our kitchen reno. We had some electrical work done and hired an electrician tonadd some recessed lighting. He ran it back to the new subpanel and he comes up from the basement nd asks if we were having problems with the stove. I said yes. He said he noticed the breaker wasnt seated properly. It was making a connection but just barely. He popped it out and popped it back in and sure enough I went and ran that oven at 500 for an hour with no issues. The cause imo was the weak current was causing the computer to think there was a fan issue. An anomaly. Want to say we have since moved and it was a relief to be able to have that taken care of. I will buy Thermdor again! They did send us a new range (after repeated service calls). So would so donit again

@Patricia Colwell and any other opinionated readers - I really appreciate your advice. I am about to remodel my kitchen and am struggling with being pinned in by a 42 in built in KitchenAid SBS that I detest. I want to do the Frigidaire columns but they are off the market for now (I did email 5 minutes ago to see when they are returning to market and might hold on remodel until they are back). On the same wall is a Kitchenaid Microwave/oven combo that is near death. I am planning to steal that space to free up refrigerator space. I will then convert the cooktop area (other side of the kitchen) into a dual fuel range in one space. This will reduce the number of new cabinet boxes I need so I can reface and do new countertops. My only appliance requirement is the longest possible life followed by good service and available parts. I do not care what brand anything is. The first bid for a Subzero 48 in fridge and a Wolf dual fuel range is $25k. Again, I do not care about brands and I just can't get to needing to spend this much. Appliance guy just rebid with Dakor professional duel fuel range and built in 48 in fridge for $18k. This is crazy to me as I am reading that Dakor is owned by Samsung, many people get lemons, service before AND after Samsung purchase is non-existent with 3rd year warranties not being honored in year 3. I will give him his chance Monday to sell this but I would probably rather spend $25k as I have the impression this purchase (based on internet reviews) is roughly equivalent to lighting $18k on fire. I don't enjoy cooking but with 4 kids, require 6 burners to cook the typical combo of pressure cooker, multiple pasta pots due to Gluten Free and non-GF along with a few other items - generally 5 pots on the stove at once for dinner. Sorry for being so long winded and hijacking this thread but like Amanda Paulson, I will find the money to buy the appliance that is proven to work the best and last the longest. I do not care what brand anything is so I really appreciate Patricia's feedback with mixed brands. The Betazzoni has some pretty awful reviews also, so can share how long you have had it? Questions for readers: 1. I believe (after many dying appliances) that I never want an appliance again with shared functionality. I really want to separate the fridge and freezer, maintain counter depth/built in look and not spent 5 figures. Any known options? 2. I am breaking my rule in #1 and combining the oven and cooktop into one unit (due to kitchen layout that is not affordable to change) - what is the best dual fuel range and the 2nd best give $10k for Wolf is just not working for me? Reliability is #1 and I do not care about brand names or resale. I care about not messing with the appliance for the next 15 years and it working every time. Thank you, thank you in advance for thoughts, opinions or facts destroying any of my beliefs. I am open to rethinking everything. One last comment: I know the world loves Bosch dishwashers but I have had 2 in the last 12 years and both died around the 5 year mark (household of 6 and we run 1-2x per day but Whirlpool and KitchenAid have lasted longer). I am back with a KitchenAid dishwasher. The first one leaked and messed up my wood floors. Was purchased through Costco so ultimately, dishwasher 3 (yes, there was a problem with #2 but service was great) has worked beautifully and Whirlpool was easy to work with and settled at $5k for repairs to floors. I would buy Whirlpool/KitchenAid again in a heartbeat as a brand and especially through Costco for what it's worth as the problem was dealt with and once I got a unit that didn't leak, it has been perfect for 2 years now.

Hi Abishek, If cost isn't your limiting factor I would recommend buying the one you like best. I went to an appliance dealer that had a comprehensive show room to decide upon my new kitchen appliances for a major remodel. The top contenders were themador and sub zero. I picked sub zero, hands down. I'm not in any way saying the Thermador is bad, it just didn't seem as well built as subzero/wolf, this was apparent to me once I was able to physically touch the appliances at the showroom. Thermador cuts you a discount if you buy a package of their appliances (instead of mixing and matching brands), it was such a steep discount that signalled to me they were overpricing their appliances to begin with, and without this bundle discount the individual appliances were pretty much the same price as the wolf/subzero. While the discount was around $16k (this was for column frige, freezer, wine fridge, range/oven, etc), I just didn't like the Thermador appliances enough to be tempted and felt their prices were probably inflated anyway. Reviews are really tough to use for decision making. It's difficult to tell if there's just a silent majority of satisified customers with a rather vocal disgrunted minority, or if troubles with reliability plagues the brand. If there's an overhealming stream of complaints across different review sites where the purchasors are verified (in other words, verified that the complaints weren't fake) then I think you have your answer. Some showrooms let you test out and cook with the appliances- you may want to reach out to your local showrooms and find out if this can be arranged. That way you might get a better idea of the quality and feature difference and see if one brand stands out over the other for you.