mommabird congrats on moving on and doing what you needed for your sons and yourself to get your life back, it's great to hear things are going so well. one thing in your posts really jumped out at me: " " I really do think hoarding is a control issue." as a former hoarder who did get help and learned to overcome the obsessiveness of hoarding, I totally agree that it is about control. I think often what happens is circumstances that make a person feel like they have no control, that could be a job loss, a death in the family, financial problems, poverty, lots of other things that trigger that sense of not being in control in your life. that was very true for me, and the hoarding is like a way to control your surroundings, as long as you control the stuff you feel like you have control over something. one of the greatest feelings though that I wish all hoarders could experience is just letting go, giving up the need to control things and realize that hoarding doesnt improve your life, it doesn't protect you from all the crap that life throws at you and when you learn to let go you get such a sense of freedom from this horrible obsessive behaviour. it's not easy but it can be done and the rewards are so worth it, but I think a lot of hoarders are afraid to try and get the right help but no one can make them face it head on, that has to come from within and just a desire to change and do the hard yards to overcome it. unfortunately though hoarding does affect other people and mostly those who also live in the house, as frankie said above mental illnesses do have that impact, but when a hoarder tries to control everything in your surroundings, it ends up controlling what other family members can or can't do as well. At the end of the day, you realized what is right for you and your kids.

This is a topic I was interested in reading more about, acutally. I am currently reading "One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest" (I've never seen the movie) and it's going pretty well so far. I am a fan of Shirley Jackson (best known for her short story "The Lottery") and found out she wrote a novel called "Hangsaman" about a girl with mental illness. I can't find the book anywhere... other than at the local university(it's not due back until July!) so I may have my SO check it out at some point. The next book that came up in my search was "The Bell Jar" and I have wanted to read that, so maybe that's next. As for the realistic nature of the portrayal of mental illness... I'm not sure, to some extent this subject tends to be auotbiographical and so as far as you can trust personal experience it's accurate. When I think though of Bertha in "Jane Eyre" I'd like to think that that is a totally inaccurate portrayal of a person with mental illness. Bertha is a described as a monster and as inhuman, two things mentally ill people are generally not and it would not be PC to describe them as such currently.

I am sorry you are so tired and worried. Sounds like you have a lot on your plate. Your question is how to deal with this without blowing up at your DIL and DS. First and most important, go get counseling yourself or with your husband. The counselor will help you figure out how to set boundaries and how much to give of yourselves. Second, take time to exercise, get plenty of sleep and eat healthy foods. That old adage about flying with children...put the oxygen mask on your own face first so you can help them with theirs.... You will be able to do more for the children in the long run if you stay healthy. Third, your grandchildren have 2 loving grandparents who live next door, a nanny, and 2 parents. They have a network of people. Their love network doesn't look like what you wish for them but they have one. They are loved, they are cared for. Stop focusing on what they don't have and start looking at what they do have. I'm not there, you are, and your concerns may be entirely or partially valid. Having said that, they are 5 and 2. Soon the 5 year old will be more and more involved in school, activities, etc. The 5 year old will go to school all day, then have music lessons, sports activities, friends over, etc. That doesn't mean she won't need you or her parents, but she will be busy. The money your DIL makes will come in very handy for college, extracurricular activities, etc. As the grandkids get older you probably won't be needed nearly as much and that time is probably closer than you think. When that time comes, if you have damaged your relationship with your DS and DIL you will wish you hadn't. Also you may find that your DIL is better with the children as they get older. The comment about DIL not allowing anyone else in the family to be a leader in the family is not germane to this discussion. Your son could still have tea parties with his kids, take them camping, build block towers, bake cookies with them, play soccer in the yard. DIL is not stopping him from that. Stop letting those leadership thoughts live rent free in your head. As you said yourself, your son could make different choices, he doesn't, and that's on him, not his wife. I don't know, only you do, so I could be very wrong. I suspect you are enabling your son. I think that because you said he was checking his phone a lot during the day. If he was at home with the grandkids, were you over there taking care of them? There is a fine line between supporting and enabling and a good counselor will help you figure out if you have strayed over into enabling territory. A counselor can help you figure out if part of this is because the family doesn't look like what you expect with your DIL running a demanding business. My husband was building a business when our children were 5 and 2. He would have went on an 11 day trip, returned and went to work the next day and no one would have thought anything about it. He worked long hours then 6 days a week, and on Sunday went to church, came home and napped. He came home every night, gave the kids a bath, ate something and went back to work. This is a tough time for a young family and sometimes that can spill over onto the grandparents. I'm not dismissing your concerns or saying you're wrong. Just one glance at my husband with his little kids and even a total stranger could tell he treasured them, enjoyed them, loved them with his every breath. It's probably not the trip that concerned you but the way your son and DIL interact with their kids when they're present. The generosity issue is a good one to bring up in counseling. I'm not sure why you would want your DS and DIL to be financially generous with you. You have stressed that material things are not your focus, that you make decent money, so not sure why you feel a loss if they don't give you expensive gifts. Perhaps because your DS and DIL give expensive gifts to people they value and you feel not valued. A counselor could help you learn to let that go. Invest in exercise, getting plenty of sleep, eating healthy and counseling. That time will be well spent, and the sooner the better. It may take time to find a good counselor who is the right match for you, so get started now. You may have to try more than one. I hope you find something that helps. Best of luck with your grandchildren.

I hope it didn't sound like I don't have compassion for the mentally ill, Oakley. I very much do, which is why I work with that population. And I know that not all bipolar sufferers are aggressive or at all dangerous to be around, even when manic. Brittney's father may control her funds, but even if it was court ordered, Brittney's case is an outlier. Most "regular" people don't have the resources to contain a seriously mentally ill adult child. Even if they have the legal right to compel the ill person to live in a particular place and take meds, etc., they have no physical way to make that happen if the person wants to leave or refuses medication. I've had clients who routinely skip out the bedroom window, prostitute themselves, run away, use illegal drugs, participate in very dangerous behaviors, and the legal guardian has the right to call the police and report that the person is gone without permission and off their meds. That doesn't make the client magically appear safely back in the house, palm held out and eager to take their meds. I work with families who go through this regularly. They can't afford henchmen to keep the ill person contained or under observation. They can't always physically withstand the ill person as they tear out the door. Etc. Brittney's father has resources that many do not. I certainly do hope the OP's friend has compassion for her husband. I also don't think having compassion for him means you want to play roulette with his genes if you don't have to. I may be a grump about it because of all the stuff I see at work. I have no rainbows and unicorn stories but lots of terrified and worn out family members. NAMI.org support groups are a lifesaver for some of them.