CreatedToCook: How has your planning changed with Steve's input (or others')? Last weekend I actually planted a seven citrus espalier in my front yard along the property boundary wall, where the ground slopes down to the street - sound familiar? It's a LOT like yours. Mine slopes down steeper than yours. But it may help you to know how I got over a couple of bumps. Here's what was holding me up... I had been dreaming for about a year of making it a Belgian Fence or Losange shape -- diamonds. Every time I drew it out on paper it didn't work, because I was focusing too much on planting each tree equally distant from it's neighbor, and treating each tree equally in the first cut. I would have had big blank spots and uneven diamonds if I'd done that. Finally I got out some chalk, and I drew the shape using the bricks as my guide: I counted the same rise over the same run over and over and marked each spot with a dot, and then connected the dots. It really helped that I made the ones leaning left pink and the ones leaning right blue (or vice versa.) Immediately I saw where I should plant the trees to fill in all of the lines. They were not all equally planted from one another! And although I did not build a raised bed, I needed to terrace the earth in the end, because I discovered my soil was pure clay. Each hole I dug was basically just a pot, waiting for excess water and root rot. So I ended up digging a 2 foot wide trench down the hill and mixing in 75% compost, then terracing so that each root ball was slightly above the slope. I'm really pleased with how it turned out. Oh... one other thing, I was reading that these are the ideal citrus for espalier and hedge, respectively, but I think you really can try any kind of citrus as long as you are ok with them growing at different rates. (See list below.) It's kinda like how SteveInLosOsos had that lemon that filled out so beautifully and swiftly. The others just take a little longer. Tom Spellman of DWN is very encouraging about trying out most citrus in various shapes. I'd like to know more about which fruit varieties favor which shapes, as Steve was talking about earlier. (Btw Spice Zee Nectaplum is supposedly VERY much like a Nectarine, and you should probably plan to treat it that way.) If peaches prefer fans, and plums prefer horizontal, what do nectarines prefer? Good Citrus for Espelier: Meiwa Kumquat Nagami Kumquat Eureka Lemon Meyer Improved Lemon Chandler Pummelo DANCY Tangerine Satsuma Tangerine Good Citrus for Hedge: Calmondine - "nearly thornless" Verigated Calmondine - "nearly thornless" Meyer Improved Lemon - "nearly thornless" Pink Lemonade/Veriegated Eureka (green veriegated fruit! and leaves)--has thorns! Pomona Sweet Lemon - has thorns! Sweet Lime doesn't do well in SoCal - needs wet. I may need to plant a thorny hedge to keep people from stealing the fruit from my front yard!

Didn't we see a previous version of this drawing some weeks ago? If I'm remembering correctly, this is a big improvement over that first attempt. I have no problem with the master bedroom opening off the front entryway. It's a relatively common thing here. If you don't want guests to see into your bedroom, you close the door, and you have just a plain old entry hall. I'd leave this "as is". I would open up a door between the study and the kitchen. This would allow any future owners to use it as a dining room, if they choose. Also, if you're coming home from work with materials or a project of some sort, it'd allow you to walk straight into the study rather than walking around the staircase. I would, however, include a door -- even if it's just a pocket door. You probably want acoustical separation from the open-floor plan part of the house. I think the powder room location is bad. And the mudroom /laundry are inconvenient. You're going to have to tote laundry baskets through the entry hall, through the great room, through the kitchen, through the mudroom . . . sure, you can do it, but when you have complete control of the design, why should you? Exterior doors are expensive (and every door is a potential security problem). Do you really need one in BOTH the great room AND the dining room? They're only steps apart from one another. Personally, I'd go with windows in the great room (makes furniture placement easier) and keep the door in the dining room.

I knew a lady who had a 'Formal Room'. Her house was known, locally, as "The Castle", and was a Tudor dating from 1925. Anyway, the 'Formal Room' was a large walk-in closet next to the kitchen, where, when the maids weren't doing anything else, they could go and get a 'Formal' (party dress/evening gown), and "iron-on-it" for awhile. The lady's daddy had owned a beer joint, but she'd been Miss-something-or-other, and had snagged the richest boy around. It was real smart of her to have 'The Formals' where the maids could grab one, when the Lady of the House, or her Daughter, called from upstairs, or from the Country Club, and said, "Vinah! Git me thaaayit blue Dior ready. Wuhrrr goin' ta thuh University Club tanite!", or "Git me up some formals, Queen Esther! Tha inlaws are flyin' us up ta thuh KENtucky Derby." That 'Formal Room', now that you've jogged my memory, was probably the house's original Pantry, and is roughly the size of YOUR pantry. In fact, your house is roughly the same size as 'The Castle'. And its facade seems about as complex and expensive-to-build as 1920s Tudor architecture. Yours is a HUGE, luxurious house, by most people's standards. So, I'm baffled as to why the dining table is relegated to a 13'x13' 'Dining Area' off the Kitchen. I'm guessing you're in someplace like Northern Michigan, where people are very unpretentious. But still, there seem to be a lot of people in your life, and jamming them all into that little space, when food seems rather important in the scheme of things (the well-developed kitchen... the large pantry....) would seem to potentially make for tense and unpleasant meals, when the whole family is together. We recently moved back South, when it turned out we'd taken over another corporation (honestly, I didn't mean to...), and someone was offering us too much money on our almost-complete house outside Portland, and somebody else took our lowball offer on a silly, overgrown "Old-South-Style-Dream-Home" (on considerable acreage, with millions in landscaping and embassy-style electric fencing that we were getting basically for-free). As much as I hate Mississippi, all those tempting numbers made the move back home impossible to resist. So, here we sit. This house had the typical tiny, prissy little Dining Room, just big enough to hold the previous Owner's "Mamaw's (Grandma's) Mahogany Dining Set from Montgomery Ward" (C. 1957). The space was too small. It became my husband's Library. Stretching across the back of "The Gracious Mansion" was some bizarre free-flowing conglomeration of space, that was a den/great room... something... I had that space gutted before I even let my Decorator in the door. Didn't want to give him a cerebral hemorrhage... and it's cheaper to let your design team know the raw dimensions from the get-go. They're going to come in and take measurements, and photograph every stub-up and framing anomaly... So I had studs, sub-floor - tutto - sprayed in white primer, before they arrived. Well, I had sold our Portland house before I was able to use my custom table built for 30. But that table (and a kitchen designed for caterers) turned out to have made the house irresistible to my Best Friend's Daughter, who ONLY entertains formally, and otherwise has meals across the meadow at her Parents' house. I have a history of selling my houses to pairs of surgeons. These particular surgeons, despite their youth, paid cash. Seems they'd each been letting their trust incomes pile-up while they were in residency. Good kids. So, here, in my newly-acquired bargain manse, I wanted the same thing: long table, with three big chandeliers overhead... lots of sconces, mulberry silk shades for really soft lighting... but with a big, long buffet, because this IS the South, and we ALL dine buffet-style. In Portland, caterers and rent-a-butlers are fun people. In Mississippi, they're failed actors and musicians, and are bitter, spiteful little bundles of passive aggression. And anyway, everybody at our table here, even when there are 30, are 'family' in some way, and the Caterers really don't need to overhear whatever schemes we're hatching, or whatever dirt we're dishing. Although we use fancy plates and fancy goblets and Whiting's 'Lily' flatware from 1902, we DON'T DINE FORMALLY. Everybody's too busy, and it's basically an open-house-in-the-Dining-Room: arrive at some approximate hour, grab a plate, leave whenever... But the table seats an easy 30 (three feet for each person), with blazing chandeliers overhead, and my favorite ancestor, a banker from Riga, glowering over everybody, from the center of the longest wall. It's a practical room: brick herringbone floors that can be mopped with strong soaps; fractionally non-parallel walls for better accoustics; embossed velvet 'papering' the walls, for even better accoustics; a tented ceiling where it once 'cathedraled', for soaking-up our family's cacophony; sturdy chairs, and a sturdy table... And "immediate family", for us, can easily fill the room. We totally fill up the room with people, at least once a week. I'm thinking that you're happy 'Yoopers' (or some sort of Central European/Alpine types, in a snowy part of America) with none of our Southern pretensions or obsessions. But still: wouldn't you be able to use an old-style English 'Long Room', with a long, rugged refectory/trestle table (a long, narrow, rustic table), in a more expansive space? A refectory table can be used for reading, computing, etc., when not used for dining. What I see on those plans just seems like the 'kitchenette' in a 1950s tract house... a tract house that just grew and grew. Your house is the size of a MANSION, but the dining area is like a breakfast nook in Levittown.

It looks fine. However, you've lost some of the important features of the plan I proposed, not that I'm surprised or offended. I still recommend increasing the length and width of the kitchen island and allowing 42" of clearance at the counters instead of 48" but that is just my personal preference although it has worked well in a lot of kitchens so far. I would use 48" only where an oven opens toward an island. I intentionally put the refrigerator out of the view of the living room and intended that corner to have wrap around windows above the sink. That requires a longer travel distance from the breakfast table to the refrigerator but a shorter distance from the dining table. I know it is easier to feed children in the immediate vicinity of the kitchen but you have invested in a formal dining room and because I have raised three kids I can tell you that it will serve your children well to eat there as often as possible when they are old enough to stay in a chair, you know, table manners, may I be excused, etc. It is one of the few times in their life when you can hold their attention face to face so it is really important to do it. When I built this plan before the family had no interest in a breakfast table; they always use the dining room but their kids are high school age. At any rate, the window at the sink should be a wider awning type window (operated with a crank) instead of the tiny double-hung shown on the elevation drawing which will be more difficult, even dangerous, to lift open. I would get the stove out of the corner and allow more counter space between it and the sink. Unless you buy special cabinets that allow a stove to fit properly in this configuration it will result in awkward alignments of upper cabinets, lower cabinets, the stove, the hood. I've only seen it done well with high end cabinets. I wouldn't use bi-fold doors in a kitchen; they don't work well and get beat up fast. You'll probably have to replace them in a few years. Regarding windows, don't jamb a pair of windows together with those narrow little trim strips from the manufacturer; put two or three studs and sheathing between them so trim can be put there. The fake shutters are a waste of money because they add nothing to this kind house IMHO. The windows in upstairs bedrooms that are narrow in order to miss the roof below would be more attractive and functional if they were awning windows that match the size and placement of the upper sash of the double-hungs around the corner. Of course, this only works if there is another window that meets the emergency escape requirement. To me the 4 over 4 lights look inappropriate on full sized double hung windows unless they are only 24" wide. I would use 6 over 1 which saves the cost of one muntin per window and gives a nice horizontal visual element to the paired windows. At the back side windows I would at least add one vertical muntin to the upper sash. Sometimes cottage style windows (upper sash shorter than the lower sash) are slightly cheaper than equal size sash windows for the same opening dimensions (at least it's true for Andersen windows). I would add a window to the fake dormer. There should also be windows in the main roof gable ends. It might also look better if the front wall was continuous with the dormer wall and there was no pent-roof (that little roof eave/gutter that sticks out below the dormer. This is a tough detail to pull off and it appears that your designer doesn't have clue about how to do it. There's something overly restrained about the current gable dormer and it would not cost more to improve it but I do like the shingles. It's a bit odd that the shingles don't continue at the gable ends of the main roof. The upstairs toilet/tub room doors should open in to avoid injury at night and I would put the toilet on the wall that aligns with the study wall below to allow easier construction and better sound isolation from the dining room since that's the room where you are most likely to not want to hear a toilet flush when you have guests. If the ceiling height is 8 ft. then depending on the size of the second floor joists (10" instead of 12" I-joists) the stair might be able to have 14 instead of 15 risers which might help out the upper landing layout. But be careful about floor bounce upstairs. Make sure the plumbing stacks will fit in the first floor walls and allow room for insulation. That's not usually possible with 2x4 studs. Double drywall is also a good idea. I would try to avoid offsetting the center bearing wall at the first floor and would try to keep the symmetry of the central corridor. I've built a similar plan and it became so obvious that the center hall needed to be formal that the contractor persuaded the owner to add arched openings at each end. I don't usually like arched openings in an open plan house but it turned out that he was right.