Hi denverdidi,

As near as I can tell, people either love this stuff, or hate it! And since youÂll probably get both opinions here, IÂm not sure this will be too much help. In the long run, youÂll probably just have to try it and see what you think of it yourself.

I hate the stuff! I havenÂt used it for many years now, but, in the past, whenever I did, I always wound up keeping things too wetÂand killed them! But the only thing I ever used it for was starting plants insideÂIÂve never used it mixed into the soil outside. I guess that could be a good way to use it with our dry climate. I just use Canadian peat or a bagged compost or something similar outside. I know some growers use it for starting seedsÂjust never worked for me.

Regarding the asbestos, I hadnÂt heard about that, but IÂm sure if there ever was asbestos in it, there was when I was using it. With the asbestos regulations we have nowadays, IÂm sure you wouldnÂt need to worry about anything like that. When youÂre spreading it, though, I would be a little bit careful about breathing too much of it in if it makes much dust. Where I used to work, there were stories of the bad things breathing too much perlite dust could do to you (sometimes weÂd be working with huge bags of the stuff), and I doubt that vermiculite would be much better for your lungs. We never used that in large quantities.

Let us know what you think of it later this summer after youÂve been working with it for a while,
Skybird

I'm not much help here and hope someone can shed some light. I'm a perlite user, when it comes to choosing from the two I always opted for the perlite, but no reasoning behind it and just became my choice for ammending my soil mixes.

I still use it to root cuttings, mainly because it's sterile, holds enough moisture (some times too much) and it's easy to wash off once the plant is rooted and ready to be transplanted. I bought a large bag last fall, and that should last several years.

As a soil amendment, I have used it in potting soil mixes with perlite, compost, and peat. But thats maybe a total of a cubic yard of soil. With a garden, its sort of like adding sand and organic matter to clay, it would take an enormous amount to make any significant difference in the soil structure.

I just bought 2 small bags today, Denverdidi. But, that was for 2 reasons outside of need - - the perlite bag was too big for my experiment and a branch of one store had it for half the price of the sister store (have trouble passing up a chance like that ;o).

I haven't used vermiculite in years and years. Back then, like Skybird, I was probably working with potting soil made from that crap from the W.R. Grace & Co mine in Libby, MT (pardon my Cherokee).

I can't be as sure as Skybird that we don't have to worry about things like asbestos in vermiculite these days. Well over 100 mine workers and Libby residents have died from asbestos-related illnesses and the Grace company spread that stuff over all the 50 state for use as insulation and in potting soil. The reports of asbestos date back before Grace purchased the place in the mid 1960's. They started requiring chest x-rays but didn't bother to tell the workers the results. The feds were willing to be stalled thru most of the 1980's and Grace closed up in 1990. The US congress continues to try to decide how to pay off the wrongful-death claims which would surely bankrupt the company many times over without the infusion of taxpayers money.

Right thru the stonewall and go-slow time in the 1980's an earlier administration put J. Peter Grace onto the task of teaching the government to operate like a business. Reagan said Grace was the best person he could find for the job. Reagan's deficits still ran beyond 5 percent of the gross domestic product. We didnÂt get them paid off until about 10 years ago. Peter Grace lived to a ripe old age and is dead and buried.

My home is over 100 years old. When I had the insulators in shortly after I bought the place, I climbed up and looked in the attic. I thought, "gee, it already has all this stuff that looks the same as what they are spraying (blown-in cellulose)." But, I had them put in another foot or so. It was only afterward that it occurred to me that it might be vermiculite insulation up there.

Not only am I too decrepit to climb up to try to figure it out but I don't hardly know what I'd do if it is vermiculite that "graces" my attic. As it is, I'm afraid that I'm still being "trickled on" by our ridiculous system that allows generations of people to get rich on the broken bodies of others.

Sorry, very off topic . . . if you ever want to learn about the Libby mine disaster go to the Seattle Post-Intelligencer website and type "Libby asbestos" into search. I guess maybe we can trust the fact that the damn place has been shut down for nearly 20 years and, at least, we donÂt live anywhere near Libby (an otherwise beautiful place in the mountains of MT).

Steve

I recently read a history of that mine and the town, with how they had to create a market for the product all over the country. When we were kids, my folks used it as a base in the bottom of an outdoor grill, with the charcoal resting on top. We used to sift the ash out and use it over and over.

The writing I saw didn't mention that Mr. Grace went on to a successful career in politics, however, which completes the picture.

SW of here, 25 years ago the Navajo children played in the tailings of the uranium mines. Somehow, the cancer rate on the reservation now is much higher than it used to be. Then east of here, on top of Wolf Creek Pass, we have the retention pond from the cyanide heap leaching gold mine that gave way, poisoning 50 miles of river, but they went bankrupt.

More mining legacy.

Thanks for all your perspectives and thoughts. I had heard about the Libby Mine problem and that was my main concern with using vermiculite. As I said, Home Depot told me they didn't carry it because of the association with asbestos. When I talked with the wholesale distributor, he said that vermiculite is added to alot of soil mixes, many sold by Home Depot. The wholesaler said that I did not have to worry about asbestos. (He gave me a long explanation that I didn't quite absorb...sorry I can't pass that along.) He just cautioned me to use it in a well ventilated area.

So, today I mixed 1/3 vermiculite, 1/3 organic compost, 1/3 peat and dumped that in my raised gardens. I'm going to start my lettuce, peas and spinach tomorrow...so I'll let you know in a few months how this combination works!

Thanks again for your thoughts!

I think you should be fine with that mixture, Denverdidi. I cannot imagine vermiculite being on the market from a mine that isn't tested after all the problems W.R. Grace created nationwide.

I would really be pleased to amend my garden in the manner you have. Fully adequate moisture retention would be of great help. After all, the plant food is out there but altering the composition of the growing media is so limited when you start thinking in terms of cubic yards.

My gardens are just over one-half acre. Some of ground has been in production for well over a decade and I can plunge a spading fork into those beds with one hand at anytime of the year. Still, organic content isn't anywhere close to the maximum.

Looks to me as tho' you are going to gain what I've got plus more. Don't forget that vermiculite and peat are sterile. Your compost will decompose quickly thru the season. Regular application of a good dry organic fertilizer &/or more compost may be all you need to maintain the best soil conditions one could hope for.

Steve

The vermiculite I bought comes from a mine in Arizona.

I just bought a bag of vermiculite from Wal-mart last weekend. I use it mixed with peat for starting seedlings. Never have a problem and I am still using seeds from 1995. I bought way too many of some things because they were a good deal (like no one else has ever done that) and I forgot I had them (or that). I am still getting about 80-90% germination on most of the stuff this year (so far). Lets hope it keeps going that well.

B