This has been a fascinating post for me as a biologist. I have so much trouble buying plants because I want to just go by Genus species name, but I can hardly ever find a good label that has that on it. Also lots of confusion with the way the cultivars are named. It drives me nuts and I can see how it would drive a casual gardener even more nuts. There's a lot of variables to buying good plants. How and where they were grown, were they shipped, how, where, what's the soil been like for them, how were they transplanted, how were they cared for, how were they bred. You can run into trouble in any number of areas--or not. For example, right now I have some type of horrible wilt that I think came into my garden last year from tomato plants I got at Home Depot. Meanwhile, I have a japanese maple I got MAIL ORDER from a reputable nursery recommended to me on GW japanes maple forum, it came in a cardboard box, looked like a stick version of Charlie Brown's Christmas tree, I planted it late over Thanksgiving weekend during an extended fall season that year, but had zero expectations for it. And yet is is growing like gangbusters, which I attribute to good breeding!! On the other hand, I have bought scraggly looking somewhat pot bound (not to the extreme) versions of what I know to be hardy plants at K-Mart and they are doing fine. You have to know what you are doing--what is hardy, what is not, what is a good price and what is not. I once bought a whole flat of scraggly looking basil and a closeout sale at a nursery for 3.50, I figured if any of them lived it would be fine. Almost all did, since they were small and basil is an hardy annual that can recover. On the other hand, some of my local nurseries get their shrubs all hopped up on fertilizer and when you buy them and install them they soon poop out--a lot of nitrogen means lush leaf growth but weak overall structure. And sometimes all it takes is one stoned high school summer assistant to totally screw up a local nursery if they're not careful. Still, IMHO, if you can find a local nursery where they really love plants and take pride in what they do, you will not be sorry. Somehow, Monrovia just does not cut the mustard with me, marketing hype rarely means real quality, because producers of real quality do not need to advertise, they get their business by word of mouth. As for the big boxes, I have gotten some good deals there, but I am getting kinda wary, espcially after my wilt experience with HD. Pots of tomatoe seedlings seemed like a no brainer at the time. I have no absolute proof they vectored the wilt, they are just the most likely suspects since they all had it last year and the wilt spread to that area of the garden.

I look forward to having you all out again whenever it is easy to do. It takes a while to look around and I know how it is when you need to be somewhere specific. Hopefully, I will be right here doing the same thing for at least 20 more years, so there is plenty of time. Just to expand on the weevil topic, about 20 years ago the general idea in the cycad world was that all cycads were wind pollinated. Willie Tang and Knut Norstog, working at the Fairchild research center performed many experiments and wrote a couple of really good articles showing these specific weevils pollinating the zamias they were experimenting with. Now, there are cycad research people that all they do is look at the relationships between certain cycad species and the insects that pollinate each species. For the most part, there is one species of weevil that only works with a particular cycad species. Things have come a long way since Willie's experiments. Another thing that is good about all this is that people are understanding how important it is to protect a habitat and not just a species in a habitat, because if the natural pollinator gets killed off, the cycad species is eventually doomed to extinction once the last plant dies. In Florida, we have 2 insects that pollinate the coonties. One is a weevil and one is a beetle, they are Pharaxonotha zamiae and Rhopalotria slossoni. One of these spends their whole life cycle in and around the cones of coonties, where the other will feed on the pollen during the season that the coonties are receptive but then they go out and feed on other native species, like Sabal palmetto. We are now finding that the native weevils will also pollinate some of the other Caribbean zamias, which we call "pumila types" so people like me have to worry about accidental cross pollination. The same goes for Zamia furfuracea, "the cardboard plant" Furfuraceas were taken out of habitat by the 1000s a few decades ago and along with these large plants came the weevils. The problem with that is that all the furfuraceas in Dade county, for instance, produce seeds whether someone pollinates them or not. Homeowners with small dogs have to worry about this because if they have a female plant in their yard and the dog, or cat for that matter, eats about 5 to 10 seeds, they will die within 24 to 48 hours of kideny and liver failure. That is why I sell people only male plants for landscape use. Also, there again, there are several species like Zamia picta, inermis, loddigesii, and a few others that can get cross pollinated by these weevils in a large collection, or at a botanical garden. If you are a collector who buys cycads seeds, it is always good to stay away from seeds that come from botanical gardens that say that the seeds are "open pollinated" because you have no idea on what you will get. Anyway, those are the problems, but on the other hand, so far, we can be sure that ceratozamias, dioons, and encephalartos will not get pollinated naturally here in Florida. Sorry for the long post, I got carried away. Tom

Why does this whole thing with Tom & Bob keep coming up? I have bought stuff from both of them and am glad that the world has both of them. Tom posts on several web sites and always has (free) advice & experiences to share. He is never arrogant or disrespectful - always gracious and helpful. As an amateur cycad enthusiast, I have a tremendous amount of respect for the research he has done (and information published). While some of us may get tired of seeing the 10,000 questions asked about 'sago palms', Tom graciously tries to help and answer questions such as the one posed in this thread (and make a point in his crusade against CAS). Thanks Tom. Anyone interested in buying cycads & not sure who to trust on the internet can rest assured that he's the real deal. I have no problem with people posting links to their businesses as long as they are legit & offer a relevant service to those who are viewing the thread. If he were posting links to V I A G R A or some other BS, then it would be unwelcome and he should be rightly shot or hanged. Bob is also a nice guy whom I have bought a few plants from. Always helpful, always throws in and extra plant or seeds or whatever. His web site is not as informative as Tom's, but he knows his dioons & ceratozamias better than I ever will. Another trustworthy source. BTW - Chip, the sago looks great. You have a nice plant. After it flushes, be prepared for nothing to happen for another year (unless you fertilize regularly & have warm weather). As long as it's green (not brown, yellow or covered with white crud), it's healthy. Cheers & Happy New Year!

"I don't appreciate that you hijack a thread to air whatever ill feelings you harbor about past postings. " Then don't read it. There is a button on your "mouse" that you push if you want to read a post. If you don't want to read it, DON'T PUSH IT!!!! " Now, if you have some kind of scientific proof that the cycad special does not do as suggested, then by all means, provide that proof." PLEASE, PLEASE PLEASE, show me where I said it did not work. Don't worry, I'll wait. I never said it did not do what it was said to do. Perhaps instead of getting so mad while reading, you need to calmly step back and carefully read and take in the words that that are written. Because you are letting your anger read for you and NOT interpreting the words. I NEVER SAID IT DID NOT WORK! "Your first post was both libelous and defamatory. " WOW, thats kind of ironic because thats EXACTLY what your post is. I guess in your world it is ok for you make libelous and defamatory remarks, just as long as they are in response. I am a MODERATOR on another board and you are EXACTLY the type of person that I have to explain to that two wrongs don't make a right. "Your sole purpose posting on this thread was to malign someone else who hasn't even taken part in this particular conversation." NOOOOOO, my purpose on this thread is to let the public know of the dishonesty of the person that others have posted about ON THIS THREAD!! I feel that I would be cheating people by not letting them know that there is a dis honesty thing going on.