Native Shrubs & Reputable Suppliers

18 years ago

Morning All.....

I am looking for a Native shrub (preferably with white blooms) for my Upstate NY garden. I have been looking at these three:

- Sweet Pepperbush (Summersweet)

Clethra alnifolia

- Swamp Azalea (Swamp-honeysuckle, Clammy Azalea)

Rhododendron viscosum

- Highbush Cranberry (Cranberry Viburnum)

Viburnum opulus var. americanum (Viburnum trilobum)

Does anyone have experience with any of these shrubs?? I am leaning towards either the Sweet Pepperbush or Swamp Azalea for my back garden. The location I have chosen is against a fence in a raised bed which is 8ft by 3ft. I have no problem with the shrub eventually taking over that corner as there is LOADS of surrounding room. The 3ft side is against the fence and is shaded until lunchtime then it gets 2 - 3 hours of full afternoon sun before falling into the shade of my neighbours tree. The fence is 6ft tall so whichever shrub goes there will maybe end up with its head in full sun for most of the day

Also, can anyone suggest good, reputable suppliers for Native plants in NY. I would like to buy "locally" to the State but if mailorder is the only way to go then so be it!

Thanks for all your help and suggestions

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Comments (18)

adirondackgardener
18 years ago
I'm also looking for a supplier for natives for an area in the Northern Adirondacks.

I'm looking for Mountain Laurel (Kalmia Latifolia) which sounds like it might work well in your area. White flowers, will grow in shade but flowers better in 3 to 4 hours sun. Grows to about 6 feet or so under cultivation.

Wayne in the Adks.
Scbnymph
Original Author
18 years ago
Wayne.....

Thank you kindly for your input, I appreciate it. I had not considered the Mountain Laural, don't know why but it certainly is a beautiful shrub. I think I am going to add it to my "strong possibilities" list!

I have to admit that I am having great problems finding a suppler for this area, especially for shrubs as it seems all the "regulars" only really sell herbaceous & grasses. I would love to hear from you if you come across one for this area

Thanks Again
Claire
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I should note here that Dame's Rocket is one of the one's that tricked me too when I was just starting out. Nurseries and seed companies sometimes list it as a wildflower, but it is an introduced species that is on the noxious weed list in some states. As I mentioned, Most spurge sold in nurseries is Japanese. A native is P. procumbens, but I have never seen it in a nursery. Most honeysuckle sold in stores and nurseries is also alien and highly invasive. http://plants.usda.gov/cgi_bin/topics.cgi?earl=plant_profile.cgi&symbol=HEMA3 breaks honeysuckle found in the wild into species and lists foreign or native, noxious weed, endangered, etc. I myself still cannot really make heads or tails of it all as there are so very many. After my experiences with pachysandra and dame's rocket I would be very hesitant to buy honeysuckle intending it as a native without a great deal of research into both species and nurseries. Yellow Flag Iris is another that I was surprised to find out is introduced. I have it growing alongside my native Iris versicolor - harlequin blueflag. I like mine and have no intention of pulling it out. It hasnt moved much in 40 years but it has alot of competition. It is a big problem in some states though, or so they say. The USDA does not list anything with Yellow flag as a common name. I am guessing ours is Iris pseudacorus - paleyellow iris, as it is the only yellow one shown in NY state. All of the native Irises are blue. The most common is I. versicolor -harlequin blueflag. I. verna - dwarf violet iris is also native to NY. I. virginica looks much like the versicolor and is endangered in NY & Penn. I. prismatica - slender blue iris wraps up the list and is threatened in NYS. see: http://plants.usda.gov/cgi_bin/topics.cgi?earl=plant_profile.cgi&symbol=IRIS (scroll down for the maps by species - click on each for info and pictures for that species) Hemerocallis lilioasphodelus, or yellow Daylily is also introduced, as is the orange H. fulva. (see: http://plants.usda.gov/cgi_bin/topics.cgi?earl=plant_profile.cgi&symbol=HEMER ) Besides sheer brattiness, I am trying to illustrate a couple points here. The most obvious is that one cannot trust nurseries for information. Their goal is to make money. Besides that, most people working in nurseries have very little knowledge. They are not hired for expertise, they are hired because they will work for low pay. (present company working in nurseries excluded, of course.) Expertise costs more. If your goal is to buy native plants then it is imperative to research beforehand. The USDA site quoted here is a great place to start. One thing I would love to work toward is a system of lableing for commercial grown plants. Optimally I would like to see it mandatory, but until then I would love to havethe backing to put pressure on commercial sellers and growers for voluntary labling. There will always be people like I was in the beginning, planting in woodlands and wetlands without information. People do not research usually until they get really into gardening. It is the newbies that make the boo boo's and they can only be protected by responsible marketing practices. The other point is the difference between a wildflower and a native. Wildflower is a more loosely defined and subjective word and many include naturalized foreign species. Native is a more specific and objective term and usually means that it was growing in an area before European settlement. A species may be native to the US but not native to a region. (such as Rudbeckia laciniata var. humilis - green headed coneflower, which is native to five states in the SE but not NY ). Some may have varieties native to a region but not other varieties of the same species (Rudbeckia laciniata var. bipinnata, Rudbeckia laciniata var. laciniata: both going by the common name "cut-leaf cone flower" are native to NYS). Others, such as most Monarda, tiarella, huechera, are cultivars of a native species. Again, you may or may not care, depending on purpose, but it is great to make informed decisions. In summary, beware of vague terminology. Look for reputable sellers that give precise information if you are intending to reintroduce species or are trying to create a nature friendly garden of environment. Again, there is nothing inherently wrong with any of these plants. The questions are the where and why's. I have an ornamental garden and a woodland/wetland garden and what I plant in each goes by different rules. Anyhow that got way off on a tangent, as this is supposed to help us know WHERE we can find natives, if that is what we are looking for. Sorry-its a virgo thing *blush*. Anyhow, goodnight. PAX Laurette Here is a link that might be useful: USDA profile for Dame's Rocket
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ellen_s
18 years ago
Tripple Brook Farm is a mail order company that sells eastern native shrubs..they are in western MA so not that far from you, and probably a similar climate. I tried them for the first time this year, ordering 2 American Cranberry shrubs (Viburnum trilobum). They arrived in great condition, and are thriving next to my pond.

http://www.tripplebrookfarm.com

You can also try the Garden Watchdog for reviews of mail order nurseries.

good luck
Ellen

Here is a link that might be useful: Garden Watchdog
ellen_s
18 years ago
Oh - my vote on which shrubs to plant...how about all three :-)

But I think the Cranberry bush would have the most seasonal interest..beautiful flowers in spring, gorgeous clusters of berries, and nice fall foliage. Also, the birds love those berries so you would be doing your bit for local wildlife :-)

Ellen
adirondackgardener
18 years ago
Tripple Brook Farm looks like a good source, certainly closer to Clifton Park then up North. Not too long a ride from my daughter's house so may take a ride out as fall planting time comes around.

The cranberry you listed is recommended for native plantings up here so it is on my list for my native garden.

Wayne in the Adks.
Scbnymph
Original Author
18 years ago
Wayne, I think I'm gonna drag my husband to the Farm one weekend, maybe pick up a Cranberry & Pepperbush. I hope that you get there as its nice to have one thats fairly "local"!
Elaine_NJ6
18 years ago
The clethra and the azalea both want fairly wet sites. Since yours is a raised bed, it will not be wet. Go with the viburnum. Another possibility if the area gets a lot of sun is nannyberry viburnum (V. prunifolium), which has, as its name suggests, cherry-like leaves. This species can want more sun and can take a drier situation than many viburnums. Cranberry-bush v. is quite adaptable, however, and does well from sun to shade, wet and dry. Just be aware that it is not a bird magnet. The berries, which are gorgeous, will stay on the shrub until the next spring.

All viburnums take several years to bloom. Cranberry bush blooms sooner and more profusely than most.

Another possibility is elderberry (Sambucus canadensis). Again, adaptable to any type of site, wet to dry, sun to shade, gorgeous in bloom (the lacy white flower clusters can be almost a foot across), and a bird magnet.
Soeur
18 years ago
I had R. viscosum in my garden when I lived in NY state and it did beautifully in an ordinary garden setting with no extra water. Fabulous fragrance, BTW. Is size an issue for you? The viburnum you list gets majorly big; the azalea grows fairly slowly and thus stays much smaller over time; the clethra gets quite large if you just use the species, or stays smaller if you use one of the little cvs. like 'Hummingbird', 'White Dove' or 'Sixteen Candles'. Clethras are deliciouly fragrant, too, and bloom in summer when most other shrubs are just hangin' in there.

I love azaleas, so that would be my first choice, with the clethra second and the viburnum third. If you're leaning toward the viburnum you may want to check out a cv. called 'Redwing'. It offers bronzy red new growth and a dwarfer habit.

Soeur
Scbnymph
Original Author
18 years ago
Elaine.....Thanks for your suggestion on the Sambucus canadensis, sounds like another shrub I would like to add to my landscape. I love the flowers!

Soeur.....I have been leaning towards the "Hummingbird" Clethera due to its potential lack of size!!! I definitely want to include one in the lanscape tho' as I just love the sound of it! I would just LOVE a Swamp Azelea but I CANNOT find a supplier for this shrub

Thank you both for your comments and suggestions, they are greatly appreciated
ellen_s
18 years ago
If you are willing to drive, New England Wildflower Society has a new nursery farm in Whately, MA where they sell native shrubs and perennials. We were there earlier this year and picked up some nice plants including a Flame Azalea..

Ellen

Here is a link that might be useful: NEWFS - Nasami Farm
Scbnymph
Original Author
18 years ago
Ellen.....Thanks for your suggestion about the farm in Whately, there is also one in Framingham as well (they have two locations). I actually joined the NEWFS recently and am planning to visit at least their primary site in Framingham in the near future, although it will be a 3 hour trip from our weekend house in western MA. I'm gonna drag my husband out to Tripplebrook Farm this weekend which is MUCH closer! Hopefully I will be able to bring a couple of shrubs back with me!
Soeur
18 years ago
About the clethra... both 'White Dove' (patented) and 'Sixteen Candles' (not patented) are superior to 'Hummingbird', in my opinion. 'Hummingbird has a kind of messy, sprawling open habit, while the first two are much denser and shrubbier. Mike Dirr introduced 'Sixteen Candles', and I believe it's a sibling to 'White Dove'. I've grown 'em both and they're a whole lot alike, it seems to me.

Soeur
Flowerkitty
18 years ago
This spring I ordered a wetland package from the New Hampshire State Forest Nursery. They only sell seasonally so you have to watch their website for availability. Attached is a link to show you what was available this year. They accept mail orders from out of state

The wetland package I recieved was 25 shrubs: 5 each of elderberry, arrowwood viburnum, buttonbush, winterberry holly, and swamp rose for $20 plas reasonable shipping. The plants recieved were absolutely beautiful barely budding seedlings 4 to 6 inches high with huge, moist, healthy root systems. The roots showed they were grown in woodland soil, the kind of composted leaf mold. light, fluffy and sweet I wish I had on my land.

They were the healthiest plants I bought anywhere and they have done very well considering the drought. Several the elderberry are over 2 feet, highly branched. One that was broken off to the ground by animals already has a new 10 inch growth with many leaves

Here is a link that might be useful: New Hampshire State Forest Nursery
Scbnymph
Original Author
18 years ago
Well....I took a trip out to Tripplebrook Farm and picked up my first two native shrubs - Clethera 'Rosea' & Highbush Cranberry. Both looked fantastic in growth and the plants given to me were very healthy looking. TBF is a GREAT place to visit and ask questions, Steve the own could ramble on ALL day if you wanted / allowed him too

Kittyflower.....Thank you for the website, I will visit them and see what they have available, might be a good source for future orders
adirondackgardener
18 years ago
Claire,

I found a grower up in northern New York that has some natives like highbush cranberry. Certainly all their offerings are cold-hardy for my area and yours. I'm going to be be placing an order for cranberries from them. Link below.

I also found a local source of native Mountain Laurel. As my cliffside trail reached creek level, I found it growing in abundance along the creek. I've transplanted a few that so far, seem to be doing well. But since the new trail will be going through a natural stand anyway, I don't really feel the need to plant any more and can focus on other plants.

Wayne in the Adks.

Here is a link that might be useful: St. Lawrence Nurseries
fairy_toadmother
18 years ago
i thought i saw swamp azalea while i ws shopping! i placed an order earlier this week- first time. but, it has been suggested by others.

Here is a link that might be useful: swamp azalea
Scbnymph
Original Author
18 years ago
Swap Azalea is one that I DEFINITELY want to get for my gardens, it always sounds wonderful in the descriptions I read! I'm glad that you found one - I'm JEALOUS!!!
patty_z6_ontario
18 years ago
If you still have room, consider Itea virginica 'Henry's Garnet'. I have two, and I adore them. White flowers in June, height 4' x 4', sun and shade, takes some drought, brilliant fall colour.
Patty

Here is a link that might be useful: Kemper Centre

Native Shrubs & Reputable Suppliers

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