wouldn't it be nice if intros only had one or two word names. that would make it easy to remember parentage. this is how i started emerald starburst x magic of oz could be esxmoo-7-18, but when the names now have 14 words in each, it'd look like the alphabet.
my number system is something like this. 2009-7-18. 2009 being the year it bloomed, 7 is the row its in and it would be the 18th plant in the row.

It seems like a lot of the pros use short codes - Stamiles seem to have four digit seedling numbers most of the time.

I would think one thing you could do to simplify, if you're using some version of the parent flower names, is to make a list of your plants and assign a two-letter code to each one. Then your HOW BEAUTIFUL HEAVEN MUST BE (coded AA, for example) x SNAKE IN THE GRASS BOO (coded AB) could be simplified to AAAB. A two-letter system will hold 676 cultivars, and you can almost double that if you mix in numerals also.

If you're not opposed to using a computer spreadsheet (MS Excel for example), you can easily give your seedlings somewhat or completely meaningless short numbers and have all of the information linked to it in the spreadsheet. That's my plan right now. I'm using a combination of my initials, the year, and the row/column where it's physically planted for the seedling number, and the spreadsheet has the parentage information.

Just some thoughts.

Nate

I keep track of crosses, not individual seeds. I personally use a maximum of four characters, hybridizing code for each cultivar. Some of my crosses have started to get hard to keep on a marker, so I'm starting to look at another system I've seen used by another fellow. He records each cross on a annual cross sheet, prefixes the cross with a year, then the cross number. So 10-001 would be his first cross for this year, and the full information of the cross would be recorded on your cross ledger. He uses that number on any selected seedlings also, whereas, I like to assign a selected seedling number: 10.001 would be first selected seedling for 2010. If the selected seedling has a sib that I like, I use 10.001A, etc for any sibs. All other seeds get two years to become seedlings and get selected, or go to the compost pile. If you're in a colder zone, you might give them an additional year.

For what's it's worth. Ed

Not trying to sell anything but I use the flower Program. I use the program to create the crosses, pollintion date, harvest date, # of seeds harvested, seeds germinated from each cross thru flowering. Mike.

04-1, 04 is the year the seeds were made 1 was the first cross planted. I keep a master list in 3 places. The pad I write them on while I plant, this computer, and my wifes computer. I also send a copy to one of my friends as a download which he prints oa copy of and keeps safe for me.

Here is how the listing looks:

04-1 03-27a seedling x Prague Spring

03-27 is Flutterby x Trahlyta so the above cross is (Flutterby X Trahlyta) sdlg x Prague Spring

When I select or use a seedling from a cross for breeding it is given a letter to distinguish it from the others. There were 3 seedlings from that cross I used so they were designated 03-27a, 03-27b and 03-27c.

Thank you to everyone for the great ideas. Right now I use a combination of several of them. My seeds are started in water in cupcake/muffin tins ( each tin prenumbered 1 thru 12, 13 thru 24, 25 thru 36 etc. etc etc...)All seeds of the same cross go into one compartment. The crosses are recorded in a note book with the muffin tin #. This number stays with the seed forever. When I transplant into cups, I add the year and the tin # and write it on the outside of the cup.When they get planted out in the spring, each seedling of each cross now gets a letter added starting from "a".Thus the third seedling of FL Ragamuffin X Fringy translates to 1017c...the forth is 1017d ...etc. I like Cody's idea of tracking where they are planted in the transplant beds. Again, thanks for the ideas...And a Happy Healthy New Year to All.

Very interesting thread. Over the past 10 years I have tried all of the methods above plus some others and have settled on the method below. I have learned that the most important information is "who is the seedling and where is it in my garden" Controlling the identity of seedlings from two named plants is quite simple. However, when you start crossing their silblings, your own seedlings, the identy of the cross becomes more complicated depending on how much history of the seedling you want to keep. Crossing two of your own seedlings involves at least four named daylilies. When you cross two of their siblings together you have to double that again. It's like creating your own family tree, how far back do you want to go? How long will your ID code get? I have not answered that question yet but would appreciate your thoughts on this matter. The history of some of my 2009 seedlings is close to a page long and I have a few thousand seedings. Maintaining this history is very time consuming and using it for future crosses is complicated to say the least. I guess my message is that when you consider a numbering system you might want to think ahead a few years. If you are like me you will be crossing your own seedlings and creating a new family tree for each of your crosses. It becomes next impossilbe to keep ID information on signs in the garden. The only way to maintain this information is on your computer and/or on paper. Many of you mentioned the year as part of your ID code. It is interesting information but after you have several years of seedlings in your garden, do you realy want this information? After digging and linning out several years of seedlings it just didn't matter to me when I started the seedling. What mattered was knowing Who and Where. Back to the IMPORTANT INFORMATION - WHO AND WHERE.
My method:

1)Collect seeds and place each cross in a zip lock bag and label Pod x Pollen parents for named plants. For seedling crosses I record the garden locations of pod and pollen plants. I already have the parents names on my garden index. I also include the number of seeds in each pack.

2)After all seeds collected place seeds from named plants in alpha order (Pod Parent) and seeds from seedlings in numeric order by location of the Pod Parent.

This makes it easier to find a specific cross in the bags,in the pots and later in your garden.

3)Number the zip lock bags from one to the end.

4)Record this information (cross #, number/name of P X P parents),(number seeds) on your computer and print a copy for daily use. example
001 PxP 8 seeds.

This record will become your garden index by adding the garden location, after you plant your seedlings.
Garden#,Row# and Plant numbers within the row for each cross.

example
001 P x P 1-1-1 to 5

001 (cross #1) PXP (pod and Pollen) 1(garden 1)1(row 1) 1 to 5 (plants 1 to 5)

5)If I have 100 crosses I buy 100 white plastic knives and number them front and back,(1-100 )so they are visilbe from all directions.

6)Plant the seeds in numeric order, cups or boxes and insert the plastic knives to identity the cross. No need to write anything on the container. If I plant in boxes I put the knife at the beginning of the cross being planted which save alot of wasted space. In boxes I divide the rows with a piece of plastic cut to fit into the box. The divider makes it easier to remove seedlings for planting.

7) As the seeds germinate I count and record/update the number of new seedlings daily on the paper index next to the number of seeds planted for each cross. Ok I lied, 3 or 4 times a day.

8)When/if a cross germinates 100% I colour the top part of it's knife with a fat red marker so I do not have to recount it every day.

9)Plant the seedlings into your garden and record their garden locations on your paper/computer index. Now you know who and where. I put the plastic knife in the garden at the beginning of each cross. When I finish planting I do a double check of my paper record and remove the knives at this point. No need for signs in the garden, use your paper index.

10)I have several thousand pictures of my plants filed on my computer by the garden location code.

PROBLEM WITH MY SYSTEM:

1) Removing the duds to the compost creates alot of wasted space in the garden not to mention a weeding problem. This is a problem with any system.

2)Digging, disgarding duds, dividing and lining out the keepers requires massive updates to both the garden index and the location codes of all the pictures.

It's not a perfect system, but I have several thousand plants and I do know "who and where" they are.

Any and all comments would be welcome.

Each time I want to use a seedling in a cross, I ask the question: if this plant is good enough to use in a cross, shouldn't I give it a seedling number? A seedling number to uniquely identify it. Otherwise, I may have a thousand seedlings with the same cross information, and it could be any of them in the cross. By the time the seed is planted, germinates and grows big enough to bloom, which seedling it was will be long forgotten.

I also don't understand the merit of keeping track of germination rates. I throw away the majority of all crosses. Seems like a lot of work. Ed

Hi Ed: Good point. There is no reason to name seedlings until you determine that you are going to keep them. If you plant 1000 seedlings you need to know the location in the garden and the pod and pollen parents of all of the seedlings. If you choose 10 seedlings out of the 1000 as keepers you can reference your garden index by the location code of the keepers and determine the parentage of the ten seedlings you want to keep. I agree that you only name seedlings that you want to keep. The name I give them is there new garden location code followed by the cross information. After you toss the 990 you will probably dig, divide and line out the ten keepers. If your keepers multiplied you will probably have around 5 each of your 10 keepers which means a total of 50 keepers. Now you need to know where and who your fifty new keepers are. In a few years you could have several hundred keepers and if you give them each specific names/codes you will end up with several hundred names/codes. The new question will be "where is Joe"? If you name your plants using the location code followed by the parantage they are very easy to find and identify. As I stated earlier you have to change the location code on your garden index after you line out the keepers and toss the duds. The only time I would give a seedling a name would be to register the plant. Like you, I do not retain information of germination rates as I see no value in it.

I actually don't understand the process of numbering all the seedlings. I guess I don't understand that part of the process as new seedlings are planted out, isn't the most important thing to just know who the parents are and the year it was planted? Why give each seedling a number so early on?
My thought process is I know the parents and the year it was started so the row is marked with that information on one marker only. If any survive their first winter in the ground, and has a bloom, then I would tag and number it. Is that wrong to do it that way?

Julia

Hi Julia: I don't think there is a wrong way of numbering as long as it works for you. I plant over 100 different crosses each year which is well over 1000 seedlings. I have 14 different gardens, each have 100 rows and I plant 8 seedlings across each row, which totals 800 plants per garden. To locate a particular cross I need to know the garden number, row number and plants numbers within each row that the cross is planted in. I keep the year/parent information on paper/computer and add the garden, row, and plants numbers, from and to, within each row(s) as I plant the seedlings. This eliminates the need for signs in the garden completely. However, you do need the paper index to find a plant when in the garden. It takes alot of time to write signs and they fade, move and disappear. I call my index the GRP Report, Garden, Row and Plant index. The index makes it easy to locate any cross in the garden or if I see a flower I like I can easily identify who it is. This system works well for large plantings but may be too complicated for small numbers of seedlings.

3

I don't think you're wrong Julia, but I also don't think it's a bad idea to have a locater map of the crosses you've planted.

Back in 2008 Hurricane Ike wiped out about half of my cross markers, so I have lots of Unk seedlings from that year. If I had made a seedling map, I could have replaced most of the markers. And there's always a potential problem with squirrels, jays and crows taking your markers.

I also would not give a seedling a number just because it blooms. Only those seedlings that I want to keep for further evaluation and possible registration get Unique numbers. But as I said earlier, if you use a seedling in a cross, you should give it a number unless it is the only seedling of that cross that you have.

All I want in my seedling beds is the cross and the year planted. I always plant front to back and left to right, so any seedlings behind a marker are the same cross, and so on to the right until I hit another marker.
Ed

I appreciate the additional info and I was hoping I didn't miss something in keeping accurate records. Our biggest challenge here is getting them through the first winter and if they don't make it, I guess I won't have too much work to do in the springtime.

I did map my seedling beds just in case some animal decides to move,pull or trample my markers. I noted also how many seedlings are in each group of crosses as some of my rows ended up taking up half of another row.

How far apart do you all plant your seedlings? I've been doing them about 5 inches apart maybe sometimes less but now thinking perhaps that is too close.

Julia

Right now, I'm planting 6" between rows, and 4" between seedlings. But it is really too close. Makes it very difficult to get selected seedlings out of the beds after a couple of years, without damage. But I'm limited on room, so have to make do.
Ed

In 2009 I planted my seedlings 6" apart and rows 6" apart. I put 5 rows together in a group and then a 24" walkway. It was really too close. I was amazed at how they developed in 1 season. It was the most difficult to photograph seedlings and figure out which one was which.
In 2010 I used 8" apart and 8" between rows. I am hoping it is a bit better.
I use venetian blinds to mark my crosses one at the beginning and one at the end of a cross. I found these too hard to find last summer when my 2009 seedlings were blooming so I put in some taller markers every once in a while just to help me figure out what was what. I labelled each cross with a set of letters for the parents and then when I was photographing, labelled each seedling in that cross starting at 1 so I can keep each seedling straight. I put all the photos of that cross in one file etc.
I also make a map of my seedling beds but that is more for me to plan out when I am planting them. I keep track of the cross and number of seedlings. I just make any necessary changes afterwards if I did something different than my plan and I have a map!
I would much rather work with names than numberswhen keeping track of seedlings. Then I know what the parents are when I am out there working without having to refer to another document. Maybe when I select some to keep I will give them a number but probably I will just keep using the letters and number in that cross.
I also keep a binder with pages for each cross that I can write down data on such as date of blooms, foliage type etc. When I buy seeds I just print off the page for the cross. When they are my seeds I make up a sheet with a photo of each parent and their info. I file the crosses in the binders in the same order they are in the seedling bed so I can take the binder outside and write down as I go along. I have one binder for each seedling bed. I really enjoy keeping statistics and love nothing better than taking a stool outside on a nice spring or fall day and writing down info.
Debbie