guavalane Thank You. I want all the info I can get. Does your friend buy seeds and if so what varieties and where does he buy the seeds. etc. why higher ? How big are these. You are in a great warm long grow region. I am zone 5 and must plan carefully. So I am interested in what comes quickly and what takes a long time. I can probably do with plants to about 105 days as some pumpkins are 105. not sure on the maximum but it probably depends on the temperature. Right now it is cold here. high of the day below or near 50. just to give an idea. But of course all information is eagerly sought. how is the eating quality difference between winter melon and fuzzy gourd. I had a oriental melon gourd that I liked. It was pretty good. it grew sort of like a square long melon. the melon had 4 creases running the length that caused it to have a sort of square cross section. the crease was indented along the length. the melon was nice in soup. It might have been a winter melon but no white on the melon skin and it was ready very early. The skin was tough so it was easy to cook. I could put it into a microwave and after it was cooked the skin would come off in one piece instead of falling apart. I just grab the skin and pull it off. well more or less. worked great. the "melon" was nice and firm. light color. sort of clear when cooked. moisture came out of it. the moisture with the seeds was a little more sweet. but this was for cooking not for raw eating. Does anyone have any idea what it might have been. what kind of oriental melon or gourd. I saved some seed but then the seeds might be crossed with all the other stuff grown there. Mostly I want to know what it is so I can buy some good seed that is properly correct and not some half wild cross.

devon gardener: thank you for the 2 recs! I will look them up pronto. ann: that's amazing about your 4 bloom cycles with pruning Leander. I wonder if having a real winter helps with the rebloom. We have let our Leanders grow for probably 4 yrs without a trim, but it didn't improve the repeat. In fact, we started trying to trim them back every 2-3 yrs to see if the repeat would get better. Our best repeats have followed the winters with the heaviest rainfall (El Nino years). It's a rose worth keeping even with only a massive spring bloom - magnificent! I agree with you about RMV - I think the earlier imports of grafted Austin roses were generally healthy (all the roses I bought in the early 1990's thrived. When the English roses became quite popular, say from 1996 on, many were weak (& often mislabelled!). I had particularly bad luck with Star roses. Hopefully now the bigger nurseries are paying attention and cleaned up their rootstock. I have had good luck with some ownroot Austins, but certain varieties are hard to get going.

Good time to update this thread :) To me, the attributes of a good melon are (in order): 1. Taste (If it doesn't taste good, it's a waste of time) 2. Ease of growing (How easy is it to tell when it's ripe? Does it have a bad habit of splitting? Is it overly vulnerable to weather or disease? etc.) 3. How long does it keep for once ripe? 4. Production/Size 5. How hard do I have to fight the critters and insects for it? Just to clarify so there's not confusion, when I say something "slips", that means that either it separates on it's own when it's ripe, or if you touch it with your finger and just BARELY nudge it, it separates when ripe. Here's what I've grown so far that isn't my own creation: Banana Melon - Large, prolific, oblong melons. They don't slip when ripe, and even though they do change color as they ripen, determining the right time to pick is tricky. The mice absolutely love them so be prepared to share. Taste is only average at best. Sometimes these do split, but not frequently. Late melon. Charentais Melon - somewhat small melon, decent production, doesn't slip. Somewhat difficult to determine the right time to pick. Taste is better than average, but by no means the best. I've had some mice difficulty with these, but not to bad. These will split. Crane Melon - medium to large melon shaped rather like your typical balloon. They get an orange hue when ripe and will slip from the vine. Production was pretty decent, though they seem a bit overly sensitive to cold. A cold snap will affect the taste of some of the melons. The melons also tend to go bad if the underside is overly damp. They're orange inside and are quite possibly one of the best if not the best muskmelon I've ever tasted. I'll grow these every year. The mice left them alone for the most part, but the ants love the thing. If you see ants checking it out, it's almost ripe. If there are several of them next to the stem, then it's ready to slip and you don't know it. Once it does slip, the ants will drill in the slip and eat the melon on you if you're not quick. These will ripen throughout the season. Ginger's Pride - An extra large bigger than football shaped melon that turns orange when ripe. It almost slips, but not quite. They seem to have a really narrow window between green and rotten, so once they're ripe you only have a few days to pick them before it's too late. They have a really good taste. This is a late melon. Healy's Pride - Large netted melon. This was my first year growing it, and only one reach maturity before the frost hit (but everything got a late start due to weather this year too), but the one I had tasted really good. This doesn't slip either, and it seems to be at least somewhat difficult to tell when they're ripe. Jenny Lind - This is a melon with a different taste. It will slip, it gets a light orange hue on the outside when it's ripe, but -surprise- it's green on the inside. I like the taste myself and will probably grow it again. The closest I can come to describing it is to say the taste is about half way between an "American Cantaloupe" and a Honey Dew. The melon is small, but the yields are heavy. It's about mid season in terms of ripeness. Minnesota Midget - small netted melon with a really good "cantaloupe" taste. It's early, yields heavy, slips from the vine, gets a light orange hue when ripe, and is one of the family favorites. The mice like them too. Prescott Fond Blanc - Looks like a big ugly (warty) pumpkin shaped gourd. They're large, but the eatable portion inside is average (there's a LOT of shell there - and they're heavy because of that shell). The mice went nuts over these. They will sometimes slip when ripe, but not always. The orange hue tells you they're ripe. Taste was average at best. I doubt I'll grow these again. Mid to late season. Valencia Winter Melon - Mid to large football shaped melon. DARK green when ripe. They don't slip and it's pretty difficult to tell when they're ripe. They last a really long time when they are ripe though and it's a late season melon, so the best approach seems to be to wait until the frost has killed the plant and pick them. I've got a ton chilling in the garage right now that are still good. These in many ways remind me of the Amarillo Ora, except they're not yellow, and the Ora doesn't last near as long. Taste is somewhat similar. I like the taste, but it's hard to describe. More like a Honey Dew than an "American Cantaloupe", but it's still different than a honey dew. Inside is a light green to pale tan? sort of color. Mice didn't touch these. There isn't much smell even when you cut it open. It does have taste though if you get them when they're ripe. Amarillo Ora - all the same attributes as the Valencia except they're yellow instead of green, and don't last near as long as the Valencia when they're ripe which makes the difficulty of telling when they're ripe very problematic. I didn't manage a single one I was happy with this year, though I did manage several last year. I really like the taste on this when I get it right. My wife has nicknamed it the "Sprite Melon" because when it's ripe it has a hint of Sprite (as in the softdrink - the lemon/lime taste they always advertise) in the taste. Early Hanover - Medium size melon with wonderful growing attributes - good shell, doesn't crack, slips when ripe, netted, very prolific, early, etc. However... it taste like dirt. Literally. I'm positive I got them ripe. I even tried green and overripe to make sure. It taste like dirt. Why would anyone want to grow these? They may be good for crossing because of their growing attributes, but make sure you breed the taste out. I fed all of mine to the chickens. They liked them. Noir De Carmes - Small to medium size, typically doesn't slip, turns orange when ripe, has a better than average taste, prolific, one of the earliest I've tried, however - warning - these crack worse than any muskmelon I've seen. It's almost impossible to get a ripe one that isn't cracked if you've got 20 ripe ones, you may have 1 that isn't cracked. They also have a strong odor and the mice love them for it. Due to the cracking alone, they're off my grow list, it just isn't worth it. Petit Gris de Rennes - didn't get a good sample and need to try again. Early Frame Prescott - unless you own a greenhouse or live in a place without much winter, don't bother. They'll never get ripe before the frost hits. Ali Baba - Good size melon in the 30-40 lb range mostly, oblong, good shell, keeps longer than many I've grown, red fleshed, and has a good taste a fair bit better than store bough, but still not as good as I would like. Red fleshed. Katanya - didn't get a good sample from, need to try again. Cream of Saskatchewan - medium size, round, thin shell, white fleshed, Not much taste (has some sugar, but not much taste). I don't care for it. Golden Midget Watermelon - turns yellow, very very small, red fleshed, never found one with a much of a taste. Don't plan to grow again. Thai Chatchai 185 - This always seems to grow and produce a good melon regardless of conditions. Medium size, red flesh, fairly good taste (better than average, and much better than store bought), but it does have a lot of seeds. Royal Golden Watermelon - Medium size. Turns yellow/orange when it's getting close to ripe. Red flesh. Can easily be mistaken for a pumpkin when it's ripe. Has a great taste (one of the best tasting red fleshed watermelons I've found so far). Amount of seeds seem reasonable and tolerable. Decent shell. Doesn't seem to produce very heavily, but does okay. I like it. Sweet Siberian - one of the larger "small" melons. Could potentially be considered an Icebox, but it's oblong in shape. Flesh is somewhere between white, yellow, and a very light orange. There's a hint of an interesting fruity taste, but the taste is so mild you almost can't taste it. Seems to produce fairly heavy. I don't plan to grow it again because of the taste. Charleston Grey - I find this to be a lot like the Ali Baba, except when it's ripe, you have a fairly small window before it's rotten. It doesn't keep long in the field. Taste also isn't quite as good as the Ali Baba, but it's close. In most other respects, it's very similar to (and inferior to in my opinion) Ali Baba. Blacktail Mountain - fairly reliable producer, good yield, red flesh, small to medium size, good taste (though I'd still like something better), produces early, has a lot of seeds. Tendergold - didn't get a good sample. Will have to try again. Tom Watson - Heavy producer, seems to be both durable and hearty. Red flesh, Good taste, large (around 30 lbs), but always seems to have one flaw that drives me nuts - even when ripe, it tends to have a green heart. All of the flesh not in the center taste great, but there's a core right down through the center which is green - obviously it's not the heart in this one that ripens first. Orangeglo - A wonderful melon. Large, Early, orange flesh, very good taste, tolerable seed count. The only real flaws I'm aware of is that they will occasionally split in the field, and it's not a heavy producer. I'll probably grow this every year. Congo Watermelon - Didn't get a good sample. Need to try again. White Sugar Lump - small, white flesh, almost tasteless, decent production. I probably won't grow these again. Stone Mountain - Large melon, late, good shell, red flesh, all of them I grew ended up with a very stringy/hollow inside with not much taste (did not look like a watermelon should). I've never seen anything like it and am not sure what to make of it. I don't know if I'll grow it again or not. So what have you tried? What have you tried and liked? Why did you like it?

I have had Polka for a long time now. It has been a fairly consistent performer for the most part. It usually winds up with a lot of dead wood in the spring from our tricky winter-spring transitions, but I can prune that off. The flowers do not age to a bad color like some others do, but they can fade in the heat like many others. As for Bathsheba, I would have to plead ignorance because I have not seen it yet or grown it. It is fairly new as far as I know. As to how either of them would do in PNW I cannot say, and it may depend on where you are as in west of the Cascades, in the Cascades, or east of the Cascades. Good luck with whatever you decide.