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why do young conifers die from the center out.

12 years ago

Here are some examples of mine.

I took two back to the garden center where i bought them they said they were watered too much.

I don't think so some do and some don't.

Some examples.

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Comments (7)

Toronado3800 Zone 6 St Louis
12 years ago
I have always assumed it is because the outside foliage is the future of the tree the inside is the past.

That and conifers are generally "exterior bud growth only". No dormant buds. Kill the branch tips and you kill the tree.
ken_adrian Adrian MI cold Z5
12 years ago
i dont know..

but one thing for sure.. it has nothing to do with ONLY too much water.. because they do the same for me.. with too little water on high drainage mineral sand ... after being fully established ...

i also wonder if they are not just very short lived .... do you ever see pix of large plants [which of course we will as soon as someone wants to prove me wrong.. lol] .... [but then.. did iseli grow it big .. and ship it to dave .... meaning he may have skipped all the 'hard part']

the finally.. there is the theory that dead needles accumulate on the inside.. to the point of the rotting material causing bacteria .. molds .. mildews .. which eventually weaken the plant ... i will leave the more scientific explanation to others .... one thing for sure.. they will suggest you go anal on them every year and clean them out ...

i doubt you will get a proven theory ... i predict it will be more along the lines of my speculation ...

now all that said.. you dont mention if these were new this year .... if so, add the following variables .. shipping and transplant shock.. along with hardening off to your sun [dont recall where you are] .. as compared to iseli .... and perhaps whether or not the tiny babes are shadehouse protected .. and then you slam them out into much more intense sun ...

bottom line.. based on all those variables.. WHO THE HECK KNOWS ....

ken

ps: honestly now.. has anyone grown one of these from tiny to big.. ????

pps: i wonder if the rocks retain extra heat.. and have some negative side effect ... on plants that grow less than an inch per season ... i mean really.. there isnt much room for error.. if you fry all of this seasons growth ... compared to say a pungens which puts out 18 inches of growth, when happy ...

all your damage is near a rock .... and hot rocks.. deep into the night.. can increase molds and mildews.. and all the other bad stuff.. they may not be cooling off enough at night???? [at least i think that is a rock in the first 2 pix]
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Drat. I posted a long reply a few days to this and for some reason it didn't save. Argh! It even had pictures! I was wondering why I hadn't gotten any responses... Here are answers to your questions: -They were potted. -Bought and planted in mid/late May. -The nursery guarantees plants for one year--50% rebate in store credit (pretty pitiful, right?!). We were a few DAYS past that deadline, so they're offering nothing. I'm trying to decide the approximate probability that this is my fault versus their fault before I post some negative reviews. I want to know how angry I should be. -We're in Western NY state, so it's real winter, but this one was not especially cold. Nor dry. Nor wet. -We're very good about watering. We planted a lot of other perennials last year in the same area, and I believe 100% of them came back and are thriving (possibly lost one--can't remember exactly how many penstemon I planted). We watered the trees more than the rest of the bed, with good soakings at least 1/2 times a week, more or less depending on rain and temps. -Yes, they were mulched. -No idea about the %. I fixed it--thanks! -Planting hole (and entire bed) heavily amended with compost. Both home-grown and store bought. -I believe the two dead ones never showed any new growth this spring (the living one has lots of buds). So I think you're right they died some time ago. Here are some photos: This one is much browner in person than it looks in the photo. I do recognize that it's a bit crowded now. That's new--the plants around it really exploded this spring (which tells you something about the watering and soil quality). For what it's worth, I generally have very good luck with not killing plants. It's rare for me to lose them, and I usually assume it's a poor fit of plant and soil/climate. I would do that with these, except that they were about $100 each (!!! We used this nursery because of gift certificates.), and the owner assured us they were both good choices for our area.
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davidtree
Original Author
12 years ago
Ken
The ones i showed were last years.
The ones i took back were bought in june and were same.
As far as rocks i have fond the side closes stays green.
I live in union city mich.
Last year i bought a small pine it was dead in two weeks i bought the same plant this year and it is doing fine.
I have grown some for 6 years and are doing fine.
I wonder if the roots just can't suport the plant?
here are two 5or6 year old plants one died in 3 days and the other took about a week.

thank you
dave
ken_adrian Adrian MI cold Z5
12 years ago
are you completely bare rooting.. and doing root surgery at planting???? .. and then planting in native soil???

ken
PRO
Dragonfly Farms Nursery
12 years ago
I have asked Will this question. I have had whole lots of trees die and I was told by the grower too much water as well. I think there was root damage in the winter and sometimes it doesn't show up until later in the summer. Were there nice white roots when planted? Many of these wholesale nuseries have way too many plants and from the outside look fine but are rootbound and stressed. Many are planted in bark but then the bark rots and hold too much water.
davidtree
Original Author
12 years ago
Ken
I usualy plant out of pot just tese the roots and plant in the potting soil.
When i took the two trees back i picked out three at more money.
Abies koreana piccolo in a gal. container that some white roots on the plant/
Pinus densiflora golden ghost in qt. container had no white roots showing.
Pinus strobus mini twists in qt. container had no white roots.
The lady at the nursery said the lack of white roots on the plants i took back showed that i over watered.
I find the trees with tighter folage die the worst.
PRO
Dragonfly Farms Nursery
12 years ago
I don't think it is totally your fault. I own a nusery and got plants from a grower with no white roots and they started to die within a week. I am very careful on watering because I was told by the grower I was over watering. These plants I got had no new roots right offthe truck and I think there was winter damage and the results don't show for months. A perennial can die right away conifers can take a while. Unfortunatly the wholesalers are sitting on alot of plants and they are always in the best of health. They might look good on the suface but once they are taken out of their perfect world and broguht into a different environment they go into shock.

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