Mike, I pretty much go your route.
I first clean the area plants will settle during winter. Walls, floor, carpet, shelves. I like PineSol..nice scent.

Each plant is then individually hosed in front and back, then set on porch or table to dry.
While they're drying, I remove dead leaves or weeds that found their way into the soil, then add fresh soil to those that tipped over or soil evaporated.

Then plants are brought to the kitchen sink/shower, and rehosed. After they dry, they're sprayed w/Fish Emulsion and my home-made insecticide.

Last, they're placed on shelves.

I used to accilmate plants..shadier areas everyday..The last few years, we've haven't had much sun during the months of Sept and Oct..it seems as if Mother Nature is doing the accimating for me. lol.
Also, because of the number of plants I now have, it's impossible to acclimate. No room. lol.

I would like to make one suggestion. Don't know if it's me, but I noticed, when citrus are brought indoors after they've been in cold temps, (40-50F) and heat is turned on; there's more chance of leaf drop.
In the 80's I only had 3 citrus. Each year, I'd bring them in when temps were between 45-49F..our heat was on. They didn't lose all their leaves, but a good number fell. The following year I started bringing citrus indoors in late Aug. No leaf drop whatsoever.
I believe, there's much less stress on a citrus, if they're brought inside before our heat is turned on for winter..

One last thing. Aside from area cleaning, I make sure my humidifer is cleaned and fresh filters are available.

Everything I've suggested is only my opinion. Nothing is written in stone. They're little bits and pieces I've discovered, w/citrus, throughout the years.

Take care, Toni

Toni:

Great point about bringing them in when still warm out into a "heated" home!! I thought that the other day and forgot to mention that here....

I bring mine into an unheated room with windows open almost up too Christmass day...The room is also quite humid without heat..

I also lost leaves when bringing them inside while I left them out for cold, for days, into an heated room..That is why I no longer heat it. The leaf drop use to be phenominal! Days after bringing them in.....Great point..

Thanks for the tip about cleaning the rooms out, way back when I first started here, and the reminder last week.. I am done with that..

Oh yes, I still use your bug mix when as needed during winter months..

I used ahchohol and that was a dumb mistake..I didn't see the water iwth alchohol fall on the wooden floor, and guess what happened?:-(

Now I will use PineSol..:-)

Mike

Mike and Toni, Hi,
This is my first time on this forum and I'm hoping you'll help me. Mike, I've read a lot of your comments and and am impressed with your knowledge. Please tell me how you rid the soil of pests and what sprays you use on your plants before bringing them indoors. I have a Myers lemon, a Persian lime, a kumquat, Brugmansias (of which I'll take cuttings), and a Bougainvillea and other plants. Also, can I use the sprays on my orchids? And what can I do to stop the tiny fruit from falling off the plants? Any help that you give will be appreciated. Thank you.

I wanted to try and experiment this year. The original point of this experiment was mainly to see how temp changes from outside/to inside would effect my meyers, but I decided to try it on all my other plants, too.

The first week of September, I put half of my plants (1 of the 2 meyers, 2 of the 3 navels and my oroblanco) under the shade of a large oak tree, where they got difused light for a week. I wanted to bring these in while it was roughly the same temp as my living room would be. They stayed there for a week before I brought them inside. A month has gone by and not a single leaf has dropped on either of those plants. The oroblanco has actually put out some new growth and flowers.

The other plants (1 meyer, 1 navel, 1 calamondin, one ponderosa and one eureka) were going to stay out till it got down cold enough to frost. Unfortunately, we had a week of bad storms here with two of my containers (eureka, ponderosa) being blown over and the plants being knocked completely out of the pot, so I just bought them all in. No shade, going from 55 degree stormy, rainy weather to a 67 inside location. The calamondin dropped a lot of its new growth, none of its mature growth and none of its dozen or so flower buds. The new leaf drop stopped after about a week. The two that were barerooted out of their pot on those days are still losing leaves, unfortunately. The meyer and the navel had absolutely no leaf drop whatsoever, though they had no immature growth like the calamondin.

Next year I intend to bring anything with new growth in while it's still fairly warm out, just to see what that does as far as leaf drop goes. Otherwise, I'm going to leave most of my stuff out till it is too cold for them to safety be outside.

well last night my trees had their first stay in the greenhouse. Low was predicted to be 39 but it never got there. they will be back out for atleast another week since the temps are going back into the 80's day and mid 50's at night.
I sprayed them down with FE and now the greenhouse smells like a fish market.LOL Good thing the meyer is blooming to make it smell better.

As of today.....Not a one has a bug, thank God!

Some are in their final resting place, for the next 6 months that is, in the plant room in choice sitting spots in front of the sunny windows, next to water fountains, just about ready to bust out in blooms.

Some are in the pop-up greenhouse, crowded but very happy, with no roomn for me to sit in there and share a spot, ready to bust forth with blloms..

Some go into the garage and porch at night, when the temps are going to dip into the 40's, ready to bust in blooms..

And, any other tropical plant where future pests could possibly hide any type crevices, or hard to see places, or those that can not handle the very cool temperatures I plan on the leaving the room at, are in the hands of friends as gifts, or outdoors until they freeze up, or in the house scattered about down stairs, no where near my very cool plant room and all my citrus..:-)

Mike:-)

You guys are fancy.

I just bring 'em inside.

But then, my citrus are basically house plants. They have a full time place with permanent lights near the front entry. They get at most a couple of months where they are outdoors for a couple of hours each day, and maybe a month when they stay outside full time in a sheltered spot.

They are brought back inside full time as soon as the fall winds kick up. I don't want their leaves all blown to Idaho.

I got a bit of leaf drop this fall. Against my advice, my son shortened the timer on the lights to reflect the daylight hours outdoors. My suggestion was, that since the plants were doing well, to leave them alone and not change anything.

They've got new growth now, so they weren't made too unhappy by shortened daylight.

I've got pepper plants and tomato plants coming inside very soon. It's getting close to freezing. They will just get inspected and then moved to the plant propagation room inside the house, where there are permanent shelves and lights for them.

I don't do anything for bugs until I actually see bugs.

The most acclimation I do is to try to move the plants indoors on a day when the windows are open. Any sudden, large swing in temperature makes the tangelo drop a ton of leaves, so I attempt to avoid that.

I do harden them off to sunlight in the spring when I put them outdoors, but I don't bother to acclimate them to shade before bringing them inside. I probably should, though.

Oregon. We're fancy? lol..
Nope, just cautious.

The reason we spray before bringing citrus/plants indoors, 'even if they don't have bugs,' prevents insects from haunting our plants once they're inside.

As for acclimating. To be honest, I don't have the room to move plants in shadier areas each day..too many. lol

When someone asks if acclimating should be done, I advise them to go ahead and do it. It is a good idea to reduce sun a little each day though. Much less stress on a plant and less chance of leaf drop.

Another thing to consider, I am terrified of spiders and Earwigs. My citrus soil is hosed not once but twice. I certainly don't want creepy-crawlers in the house, let alone, on me! Eeekkk. It's difficult keeping spiders outside of a warm home even for those who don't have plants,' doubly worse for those who do. lol.

Just my opinion..Toni

Hi Toni!!! Hi everyone!

As for moving into shadier spots, that is only if I had them in sun from sun rise to sun set..Typically the ones in the open field, or on the roof top..

As for the majority around my yard? By the time fall comes, the sun has already lost it's intensity and lack of height in the sky..So by the time I bring them in, the amount of sun they get is minimal in the same spots because the sun is obstructed behind trees and lower on the horizon..By nature, they are getting hours less in the same local as in July...

Toni, I also treat for insects, just as you do..Do you have any idea of how many spider mites, thrips, mealy and scale that people do not see they bring in that take a ride on their plants, and do not show up till the dead of winter..Not the chance I am willing to take..So far so good...

Take care,

Mike

Mike, you are SO right. Sometimes eggs hang around, without us noticing. When plants are brought indoors, the eggs hatch. That's when problems arise..
Then we wonder, where did 'x' bug come from? What did 'I' do wrong or different?
Unless one has 20/20 vision, and the patience to inspect every plant, 'especially when we have a good number' it's likely an insect will make a home on our trees/plants.
Mites are so tiny, they can barely be seen with the human eye. Only when a plant is mite infested and/or webby, do we notice insects attack.

You're also right about the sun losing intensity in autum. It's a natural process. Even if we don't move plants in shadier spots, Mother Nature does it for us.

Think about outdoor, native plants/trees. Every season there's change..spring-buds, summer-leaves, autumn-color, winter-leaf drop..(deciduous) It's natural. We sure don't have to relocate a ground-grown tree for it to survive. lol.

I don't want to chance losing plants either..Some insects cause such damage, an entire house filled with plants can be wiped out.
That's not being fancy, just cautious, lol, Toni

Oregon, the last sentence is a ha-ha...

Toni:

For instance, one summer when I did not spray FE, and, I inspected ALL my plants and never saw a darn thing...That same year by the time December came around, I had spider mites all over my trees, and thrips and mealy bugs all over my plants at work...I never saw a one when I brought them in, not a one..
Not going to go through that again..
I spent the whole winter trying to spare my plants from certain death, chopping off many down to the trunk, tearing off many leaves, washing them constantly in the tub, and spraying oils and pesticide soaps on them as they dripped onto the towels on my hard wood floors, and throwing many out..If it is as simple as treating them outside where it is much easier than indoors to prevent this reoocurance, I'll do it..Nothing fanacy about this..Although my prancing around all my plants indoors trying not to tip any over as I was spraying away that year was kind of fancy..lol

They say the best way to prevent disease is to take measure to stay healthy? Well, that is the way I view my trees too...It is worth the work.

Toni, you like birds? Guess what I had to do to prevent ear and feather mites every winter on them? lol..You know...If I just waited till the pests showed up, they would be dead, I would have no chicks, and they would be unsellable to any pet store...

Don't you just wish we could leave them out doors all winter? So much eaisier..The benficial pests do all the work for us...No wonder many are against harmful chemical pesticides...

Mike

Mike, that's my point...the chance of spotting insects, especially certain types or young, are almost impossible..
That's the reason I suggest spraying before critters not only infest one plant/tree, but others, too.
I'm so happy you decided to try FE. It worked for my plants..the time I received an Olive tree..a Scale-infested Olive tree..while misting leaves days later, is how I noticed, at the minimum, 100 brown lumps on the olive, and neighboring citrus tree branches closest, on either side of the olive.
I immediately phoned 'a woman who owns a citrus nursery in Fl,' asked for the dossage..she's the one who told me they use FE as a preventative against scale and a few other insects on their Citrus. I made a batch after the call ended, and sprayed. Within 2-3 days all signs of scale were gone.
That poor olive had scale on every branch! Who'd have thought?

Mike, do you use the insecticide I invented? lol. I normally spray twice a month, and thankfully, no bugs!

Yep, again you're right about taking care to prevent illness. The comparison is exact. To be honest, I take better care of my plants, birds AND dogs than myself..lol..

What did you use to prevent your birds from mites? Yep, mites even attack birds, and people..Dust mites are awful!
Worse, they're microscopic..I don't think spraying our entire homes and bodies w/FE is a good idea though...lol..

Oh yes, keeping plants outside yr round is a dream. Not only would citrus be in the ground, but palm trees and other tropicals. 'if I had a lot of land,' lol.
Did you ever visit the Palm forum here on GW? There are a few people who grow palms and succulents in Chicago and Canada. You should see their trees! Amazing. Toni

I can't wait for the day Fl can ship citrus to other states. Wonder why it's taking so long. Man can go to the moon, but can't cure Canker? or the common cold? lol..

I spray them for pests, put them on the hand-trucks and roll them into the greenhouse. Depending on the last time they were fertilized, I may throw a couple of tablespoons of Miracid into the pot. That's it.

Tsmith..you must have huge citrus trees..hauling with a truck! I lift w/a dolly, then roll in. Great invention.

Hi Toni..

The insect spray you taught me to use is no longer applicatable..lol

I didn't have any pest's the years I sprayed with FE or treated with Neem...In fact, I also think what helps keep the pest's at bay is the constant movement of air in a very coold room...I don't think I would like it either..lol

Hi Tsmith...You must have huge trees..!

Mike..

I just put them in the greenhouse, on a sunny shelf, and they were so relieved after having been sunburned and nearly died all summer, they immediately broke out in new leaves all over. I have not yet taken the shade cloth off the greenhouse as of Oct. 7 (a little behind, but there has been a lot of sun still).

However, the issue of pests is real. Pests LOVE greenhouses. Maybe it's the high humidity, but I get creatures I NEVER got in the house. I plan to get those bombs for greenhouses HPS and others sell and set them off periodically and close the greenhouse up tight. This will not be good for the bees and flies that pollinate the citrus and the tomatoes and cukes and such, but I'm not going through all those mealy bugs and mites and such again.

Hello Mike and Toni,
I am going to be preparing all my plants here pretty soon. I did order an HPS light thru HID Hut. Only $241.99 for 600 watt complete system including light bulb. All is needed is to plug it in. Our weather forcast for the next 7-10 days is warm! Days in the 60's and night in mid t ohigh 50's I even heard a few days in the 70's!!!

I need to buy this FE. Knock on wood, I have NEVER had any trouble with my plants with the exception of my 6ft tall 5ft wide gardenia tree. It is a spider mite magnet. Every winter, it ends up infested and I cut it 2/3 back. Well, not this year!

Thanks for all the help you guys. I am hoping that with this light set u p maybe I can get some growth and FLOWERS on my Oro Blanco grapefruit trees. My replacement tree even with the white vinegar and FP never went thru a growth spurt or bloomed, same with the other Oro that I rescued.
Andrew

Andrew, you are so welcome..You yourself have helped many here too!!
If you fine your self getting new lush, fresh green delicious pest food, just keep am eye on it..Watch for curled leaves, deformed and dehydrated..Also watch for the new growth just as it starts to growm turn brown and fall off..This is a signal..make sure you invest in a good magnifying glass and ask Toni about her pest spray to be ready and on the defense..I found that pest LOVE warm temps, dry, and artificial lighting..

Your Oro will break forth in new buds very soon..Mine is starting..They do in spring and in fall..They are a weird tree for sure..lol Are your till outside..Mine are today and yesterday in the rain..They loved it..I swear the amount of bloom doubled on all of them after the rain..

I hardly ever get just leaves, but flowers with leaves and then it stays the same, no growth after this growth until next time..You should see the size of the fruit..I will post a picture soon here.

If you get the FE, you will love it's workings! Congrats on the lights!About your gardenia..You can also keep the pests of this plant by placing it in a very cool bright lit room and it will not grow, but it will stay pest free until the spring...

Phebe:

They sure do LOVE greenhouses! So don't we all too, right?..Warm, humid, and fresh smells!!! I would sleep in mine if there was room left behind, or just sit in it on cold days and read a book....lol
Thank God no pests in mine yet...

Mike

Andrew:

Spider mites are easily controlled these days. They used to be my nemesis, and I would have an emotional breakdown whenever I saw webbing on any of my trees. They killed numerous plants in years past, including my first and best-loved lemon sproutling. ;_;

However, I do not fear them anymore. Spider mite predators are incredibly effective, and in the past 5 years or so have become really affordable. Last winter I saw webbing and got out the magnifying glass to confirm two-spot spider mites, bought 1000 mite predators, and never saw a mite again until spring.

Earlier this summer, my raspberries became infested with Southern red mites, and by the time I noticed they were EVERYWHERE. $60 worth of predators took care of them in less than a week, and that was outdoors in an uncontrolled environment.

I've never found a spray or drench or anything that works as well as mite predators. Fear not the mites!

Displacer, you are two funny!

Where in the world did you get your predators? I tried that route, and spent money on them one year 3x, and they never stopped my mites..I even bought lace wing bugs, and withing 3 days, they were the only dead bugs I saw on my floor...
The only thing that worked for me that year was cooler temps, shutting of the warm lights, washing my plants down, and the Neem, which didn't work for you..

What the heck is up with the mites? Do my mites differ from yours? lol

Mike..:-)

LOL mike. :D I'm sure your mites were the same as mine! Two-spot spider mites are the bane of everyone!

Predators must be used correctly. The most common and effective predator mites are tropical. They like high humidity (70% to 90%) and temps (80~ F). If you can't provide them with these conditions, you have to go for a different species of mite, and up until recently the other species were hard to find and even more expensive than the tropical ones.

You see, the sucking mites gain their moisture from the plants they're biting. The predators don't have that moisture source and can dry out fast.

You should also buy many predators and blitz the mites for fast control. 1000 predators for 4 trees at the first detection of mites was definitely overkill, but I prefer overkill to underkill.

The ones I used last winter were from Nature's Control. They sell a "triple threat" package with three different species, on the theory that at least one species can match your environment. I bought a humidity meter and turned up the humidifier and the thermostat for about three weeks, and that seemed to be long enough to do it.

The predators I applied to the raspberries this summer came from Evergreen Growers Supply. I bought 2500 Amblyseius fallacis and 100 Stethorus punctillum and released them in the yard. The Stethorus punctillum is a tiny (and unbelievably cute) black ladybird beetle, while the Amblyseius fallacis is a type of predatory mite that can handle a low-humidity situation, like what I had in the back yard. They don't work as fast as the tropical predators, which is why I used a ton and supplemented them with the beetles, but in theory they can establish a colony in the yard that can survive a Kentucky winter and depress pest mites next year, too.

Indoors, in a controlled environment where I can raise the humidity easily, I would go for the tropical predators, which work fast and are cool to watch.

If you are concerned about mites, they would probably work well in your greenhouse!

Displacer,

Thanks for all that info..I had no idea..I learned more from you than the company that sold them to me..

Funny how many people think that spider mites only thrive in dry hot conditions, and yet there are many I think that also thrive in very warm and humid conditions..

Have a fun day.

Mike.:-)

Your common TSSM, which is what most people will have when they see mite webbing, does indeed thrive in hot, dry conditions. But there are many types of spider mite, and some are more tolerant of humidity than others.

The tropical predator mites want a much higher humidity than the pest/prey mite, and I think this is why they fail for many people. A typical indoor relative humidity during the winter is in the 10-30% range. When you start to get the RH above 50~%, you begin to risk dry rot in your window sash, due to condensation on the cold window. In the 70~% range, your risk of dry rot extends to any wall in the room that isn't moisture sealed.

So, most people aren't going to want 80% or 90% humidity in their house. :)

That just means that you can't use the tropical predators, and need to select a different species, one more suited to your environment.

The customer service at Evergreen Growers Supply is excellent, by the way. I definitely recommend them.

Displacer, you are so right!..

I had my room with a humidfyer going last year which raised the humidity levels to about 70 or better in the dead of winer...I had noticed mold building along my walls near the windows and the skylight..The condensation dripping from my skylight would soak the floor//The plants were happy, but not the house..

So I had to cut the humidifyer and the humidity never fell below 50 with so many plants in that room anyway..It helped that I supplied no heat to that room with fans going and the temps in the low 50's...

I suppose the mites didn't like these temps either, actually no pest, since I couldn't find a one all winter..

Thank you for all that you share!

Mike

Oh, lord, if I had water dripping from a skylight, I would flip out. :D

I create a sort of microclimate around my plants using plywood screens, which makes it easier to humidify just the one area. I will take pics when I set things up later this month. It's not completely enclosed, of course, but the partial enclosure helps to raise the local humidity around the plants without splashing water all over my walls.

The temperature is probably what did it for you. TSSMs stop breeding around 50 degrees F, and slow down a lot as the temp drops near that line. They may actually enter dormancy if the temps are low and they are getting a short "day" period. Outdoors, they start to enter diapause when the days get shorter, but the warm indoor temperature where we keep our plants in the winter typically overrides that.

Thanks everyone for all of the great information. I have a question -- Does anyone do a soil drench before bring citrus inside? I have not tried the FE spray but will do so this year. I sprayed with Dormant Oil Spray about 3 weeks ago as a preventative. Is there a recommended amount of FE to add to gallon water for bug spraying?

Thanks!
DL

I do not do a drench myself. I always bring in fungus gnats, but it is easy to deal with them by letting the top 3 inches or so of potting mix dry out two or three times. For the adult, flying gnats, I have carnivorous plants that eat them.

Hi Displacer,
I wish I could lower my grow room's temperatures to 50 degrees but the problem is that my house is heated with base board heaters and they don't have individual controls. I think part of the problem with the spider mites last year came from the fact the gardenia tree really wasn't recieving the light it needed. It was barely getting any, definetly no direct light. This year it will be under that HPS light and hopefully that will do the trick. If not, I am done with it!! I will keep it thru the spring and then try and sell it. If I can't finda local buyer, I will call the greenhosue it came from and see if I can take it back to them and possibly exchange it. I hate to think that I will have to just throw it in the woods but even though I paid $125.00 for it, it is still not worth risking the health of my other trees! I may just toss it in the basement and put it under flourescents. The problem for me is that I cannot keep it cool enough during the fall and winter and when spring roles around I can count all the blooms on one hand. It just isn't worth it anymore. The first year I had it, it was coverd in at least 150 blooms and it was great but not since then has it bloomed that nicely:(
Andrew

Andrew,

Hate to think of you disposing of a mature plant. One of the things that has triggered bloom on my gardenias is Miracid, that is, as an addition to good fertiizing practices (Osmocote for acid loving plants) and watering with neutral to acidic water. Also since I used beneficial nematodes several years in a row (haven't used them for 3 years and am beginning to see more fungus gnats again so they're due),I have only had a few scale that were easily controlled. You might try them and and increased humidity - a plastic bag would probably be easiest. Hope this helps.

Cath

Andrew:

Lowering the temp is probably what did it for Mike, but there are other ways to protect plants from mites.

If you are very concerned about mites (or certain that you will have them, sometimes you just know that they will come back) one idea is to launch a preemptive attack. As soon as you bring your trees inside, seed them with predatory mites. The predators will hunt down any spider mites you might have hiding in your leaves and eat them before they do any damage.

The species I used in the yard (Amblyseius fallacis) makes a good preventative mite, because it can eat pollen in the absence of prey. It has a functional temp range of about 40~ F to 100~ F, and at room temp (70 F) doesn't require a burdensome amount of humidity.

They move slow, so if you wait until you see spider mite webbing, it will probably take them a while to clean up. If you know you're going to get mites, and you're anything like me and the sight of mite webbing gives you a shot of despair, then preventative predator application might be a good strategy.