I have a science background, so for me, there isn't a big debate for me. Thoughts: 1: Al Gore. The movie was too fluffy. I realize he was trying to reach out to the broader audience, but it wasn't enough science for me. Call me a geek.... 2: Ethanol. Dumb, dumb, dumb. Not thought out properly. So, we convert our farm fields to this ethanol corn and South American is destroying rainforests in order to grow corn for said new fuel....we need to be feeding people with corn. 3: Listening to pundits online or on tv isn't the way to go. If you really want to understand global warming read a scientific publication. Be careful on listening to a non-global warming scientist...many are in the pockets of big businesses. 4: There is a huge difference is weather patterns versus climate change. It annoys me to no end to listen to this yearly when the north gets too much snow and they complain about 'where's global warming??!', when the bigger picture is noticing when the earliest signs of spring are, when does winter start, noticing the migration of the birds, plants that are moving northward that used to have a southern limit. THESE are the changes you should be noticing. It's called phenology. US Phenology Network. 5: I know some people mentioned here that just because they don't 'believe' in global warming that doesn't mean they don't care about the environment, which is great. I like to hear that. I can't stand to hear people go off that they don't believe in global warming so it doesn't matter if they drive their car the world over, or throw their cigarette out the window, or leave litter on the beach. Trash and pollution have huge impacts that are costing us taxpayers a lot of money every year. If you don't 'believe' in global warming, at least recycle, reuse, grow your own food (easy on this forum!), and find better alternatives to chemicals you use around your house. You can make the area around you healthier at least! 6: Trinigemini, I'm going to point you out here, sorry...you said something about the government just wants to make you think the Earth will suffer but that you don't think that is true. The earth IS suffering from everything we do. With 6+billion people, we have a huge footprint. This isn't the wild where there are other predators to take us out. We're conquering diseses all of the time, which IS good, but it's also allowed us to continue on the path we are. So say, if the many third world countries were to be brought into first world status, do you not think that they would exploit their natural resources to the point that we already have? Damming rivers, relocating water, pushing plants and animals into extinction, polluting cities, producing mounds of trash. This will happen. It's inevitable if we keep increasing our population. There is a threshold of having a balance of keeping our ecosystem in a shape that still benefits us but also allows it to survive, and then we can keep going because if we have supposed...

"if this accurately represents tree hardiness, a number of trees deserve colder ratingscolor>" Let's look at which trees those might be.... From experience (three winters) I would say Picea breweriana is quite happy in my zone -- versus the Z6 designation above. Especially this year, the new shoots are extra long ! By contrast, I would probably move Pinus thunbergii from Z6 to Z7 -- no end of grief with this one (yet). My Taxus baccata 'Fastigiata Aurea' is doing a lot better, despite being rated the same Z6. That Z8 rating for Sciadopitys verticillata seems totally out of whack with what I've been told recently on this forum, although I have no experience with it myself. Z7 for Picea sitchensis seems a bit overblown too.... and probably likewise for Cephalotaxus harringtonia. And Pinus contorta rated Z7?! ....give me a break ! Not easy to find a reliable list, that's for sure.

Thanks, Shrubs n'bulbs. I agree Philadelphus has a gorgeous fragrance but it can be a bit dull out of flower (and get rather big). I had one in the last but one garden but it was a bit odd because I never could detect any scent from it at all. I also fancy a viburnum but which one.....? Actually I think I've got problems - now the trees at the bottom of the gardens of the houses behind us are in full leaf I realise that I lose the sun by 2pm!! Why plant horse chestnut, lime and sycamore in a garden? And the shadow will only get longer each year. I'm tending now to think in terms of foliage and ground cover. My other half is happy - he likes ferns. I love roses, though - am scouring the catalogues for those happy in woodland conditions. At least I get a good window for spring bulbs. Hello, Melanie. Thanks for telling me about Chadwick Park allotments, will investigate. I think I will invest in a little plant house to overwinter my tender plants - I like to keep my ger...sorry, pelargoniums, going from year to year and they will definitely bite the dust. My soil doesn't seem to be clay, though. We had a metre deep trench dug for a new water main and it's nice dark and loamy right the way down. Haven't had the chance to do much digging though as we're still frantically decorating. Plant swapping - great. Especially if I get a plot, will have to grow all the things I can't in a shady garden! What are your favourites? Christina

What an abomination! Shouldn't we burn it or cut it down? How will we every explain something like this to the children? What is the world coming to?