Need Help on transplanting my mature Meyer!

17 years ago

Hi all. I have read everything on this subject, but I still am in need of advice with moving my Meyer. It is about 4 years old and is now in a 3 ft. deep flower bed with top quality soil. I guess its a tree, but you have to lift up foliage to see trunk. It has southern exposure and gets sun most of the day, but not late, hot afternoon sun. It is about 5 1/2 feet tall and 6 ft. wide. It has about 15+ lemons on it now (small and green) and a ton of blossoms. Also, has alot of new growth.

Questions:

Is this an okay time to move it? If I have to wait, I can, but prefer not to, as I want to plant Tree roses in its place. The place I would like to move it to would be to the front of the house, where it will get north exposure, with all day sun, but morning and afternoon filtered sun. The new area has clay-like soil.

Should I amend soil at all?

Should I prune it?

Is a tree this age and doing well very vulnerable now for moving?

I love this tree and would absolutely hate to lose it.

You experts out there, what is your advice?

Thank-you so much in advance for your input.

Teresa

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Comments (15)

birdsnblooms
17 years ago
Teresa, I really know little on outside planted tree since I live in IL and the only citrus' I grow in the ground are Flying Dragon and Poncirus.
But of what little I know, don't you think relocating your citrus from a south to northern exposure be too much on your tree? Citrus want more light not less..
I know roese like sun, too, but wouldn't it be best just planting the roses in the newer section..Also, I'd say moving will be a lot of stree for your tree, no matter what time of yr, at that age.
Though your citrus may be young in some respect, but mature in others, I would think transplanting to another, low lit area would be a strain. Toni
bencelest
17 years ago
It is a strain alright for the tree no matter what but if you must move the tree I believe you can and be successful. I have done it several times because of the need and beauty and my personal taste and satisfaction. I believe I am the architech around my house for its beauty.
Yes, with that size you need to prune your tree preferably the bottom branches so you can see the bottom trunk and ease of handling. It is also preferable to trim the sides and top. So the more you trim the better for the tree because you will be certain you will cut some or maybe the majority of the roots. The roots have already spread out perhaps longer than the width of the tree. It is best to leave as much as the original soil to the roots and it may take 3 people to do this because it's going to be heavy. Prepare plywood and 2x4's and cart to transport the tree to the new location.
Dug the hole a little bigger than the rootball. It is better to put a good potting soil mixed with the clay soil. If you can dug a little deeper you can put steer manure mixed with the original soil for future use of the tree.
Here's the secret of your success: Once you put the tree to the new location at the same level as before, get a hose and stick the nozzle as far as it will go at full blast until the soil is like a pancake mix or the water starts to overflow over the hole. Do this at least 4 times equidistant to each other.
If you can get something to curtail the sun for a few days off your tree so much the better. Use the 2x4's and some of your bedsheets will do it. Or plywood.
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It IS possible to move it, but it will cost, in terms of time, and either in major sweat on your part, or on money for the machinery to move it. And doing it now isn't perfect, so you WILL have to be assiduous in your watering. I would go for moving it - if it dies from that, it would probably die from cutting roots. And if the fence post will be right next to the tree trunk, they won't co-exist too happily. Either the tree will grow around the post, or it will push the post out of line as the trunk grows out over the years. If you have more time and muscle than money, then plan on digging up the root ball. First question is whether you know if the tree is planted or sprouted where it now is? Since you are new to the property...?..., but if you have any idea, it would help. See the recent thread on help with a maple and you will see why. Anyway, the first thing to do is dig the new hole, so you can move the tree and replant it ASAP. Dig it deeper and wider (about 4-5' wide) than you think you will need, but not SO deep that you think you will have to do a lot of backfilling to get the level right. You can always test the depth and remove the tree to dig deeper if you need to. For the moment, save the dirt you dig out, on a tarp or in a wheelbarrow - you will use some to back fill around the root ball and the rest to fill in the hole where you take the tree from. Water the tree well in the afternoon or evening before you plan to move it - you don't want to be digging in mud, but the less stress on the tree the better. Start to dig, out from the trunk about 2', digging almost straight down for about 8-12", then begin to dig in under the root ball. While you want a managable size of rootball to move, it is true that the more roots you can manage, the less stress on the ttree and the quicker recovery. Keep moving around the tree, so you get as evenly round a root ball as you can. (It will be more saucer shaped than round, but it's still a root ball...) Dig out any roots you can that seem to go only a short distance into the "outer" dirt, and cut them when it's obvious they keep going for a long distance. After you have loosened all the dirt, and the tree is free, CAREFULLY work a tarp under the rootball - try as much as you can NOT to lift by the trunk, tempting as it is, as that will tend to loosen the dirt in the rootball - loss of the dirt will lead to more stress on the tree, which is to be avoided.... Move it by the rootball as much as you can. Tie up the tarp, to protect the dirt, and to give you handles to carry it by. I trust you have enlisted several of your weightlifting buddies to assist, as this will be HEAVY! Again, try not to drag it across the ground, using a wheelbarrow or truck (hand or pick-up) to move it. Lower it carefully into the hole to see if the hole is the right size, lifting it by the rope handles to make any adjustments. Make sure the root flare - the spot where the trunk and roots start to differentiate, will be at ground level. Replace it if you removed it to dig deeper or to add soil - then carefully remove the ropes and tarp. Back fill carefully, watering it in half way through, and then water again after you are done. If you have the money, and especially if you have a bad back - call around to the landscapers and tree companies, and get them to give you quotes on bringing in a tree spade to dig both the new hole and the tree - this assumes that you can get a heavy truck both to the present site and to the new site. They will dig the new hole, bring that dirt over to the tree to refill the hole once the tree is moved, then dig the tree and take it over and drop it in the hole. If they give you a choice, go for the 90" spade, not the 60", as the more roots the better, although for a 15' tree, 60" may be plenty. I don't know how much they charge now, or in your area - it cost my brother about $300, about 5 years ago, to move a 20-25' maple (90" spade), in NC. Replacement cost for a comparable tree was about $1500. He had to move it in May, almost fully leafed out - it's about 35-40' now and looking good. It was a little stressed, sparsely leaved, etc. for a couple of years, but recovered fine. However you move it, mulch it well, about 4" thick, putting no mulch on the 2-4" right next to the trunk, and out as far as you can - at LEAST to the edge of the root ball, and another 2' or so would be better. This will keep the roots cooler, moderate moisture extremes and limit root competition from grasses, weeds, etc.. Since you want the roots to grow out as far and fast as they can, encouraging them is good. Water every couple of days for the first week, daily if it's really, really hot and/or windy, and then taper off to weekly. Dig down next to the root ball to see if it is dry, down about 4-6". 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bencelest
17 years ago
Expect to lose your fruits and don't expect too much fruit next year because of the lost roots and lost foliage. But your tree will live again. You will see a lot of new foliage once it settled in.
As for me when I transferred my matured citrus and pome plants, I don't lose foliage, fruits or leaves because I try not to damage the roots and minimize the stress.
Here's some of the trees that I transferred for the last 6 months:
Page mandarin
{{gwi:587085}}

melogold
{{gwi:587086}}

oroblanco
{{gwi:587087}}

Chandler pomello
{{gwi:585314}}
center citrus is calamondin. It's over 10 feet tall
I retain the wine barrel but cut the bottom and plant it
{{gwi:587089}}
You can transfer anytime of the year provided that try to lessen the stress as much as possible.
tapla (mid-Michigan, USDA z5b-6a)
17 years ago
Hi, Teresa. Here is what I would do:
Remove the fruit and keep the tree free of it. With a sharp spade, root prune about 50% of the circumference around the tree, taking into consideration how large a rootball you can handle. In Sep, I would prune the entire circumference again. This severing of long roots forces finer rootage near the trunk and reduces stress on the tree when you do move it - in early spring. Do not dig the hole overly large and/or amend soil with anything. This creates a 'bathtub' effect in clay soils and invites root problems. Backfill hole with native soil. Also, prune only the lower branches you need to in order to facilitate digging. Hard pruning of canopies when moving trees is considered counter-productive, unless the tree is growing hard, in which case it might be necessary to reduce stress. Trees moved in spring will activate buds according to what the rootage will support.

Al
bencelest
17 years ago
Although these are not citrus I transferred them to the ground for the last 6 months

Prince Ranier cherry
{{gwi:587090}}

Stella cherry
this is about a year since I transferred it to the ground. Again I left it on the wine barrel but the bottom was cut off so it is on the ground permanently
{{gwi:587091}}

Oh, BTW the calamondin up above was I got that from JoeReal's house up north of California and transported it to my place in Salinas almost bare root. So I cut the top off to fit in my car up to 5 feet I think and trim the sides. Now it is over 10 feet tall and giving me lots of fruit
bencelest
17 years ago
Here's Joe's calamondin that I transferred when it was 6 feet tall and I had to dig it from the ground. The roots were broken pretty bad when I dug it and I had to transport it from northern California to my place.I put a wet burlap to keep it moist on the way. and
I had to trim the tops off to fit in my car.
Now it was over 12 foot tall. It did flower on its 1st year and I did the same method as I describe above.
Taplas' method is the ideal way and the right way but when you don't have the time like I did, only hours before I get back home then you have to do some drastic measures and did like what I did.
It is just like in my backyard, when I thought of something to be done, I want it done right away. This goes true also when transferring my plants.
{{gwi:587092}}
birdsnblooms
17 years ago
Ben, your citrus are really coming along nicely..They look so good this yr, not that they didn't in previous yrs, but there is something different about them..They really fille out..How many trees do u have in all now? Toni
bencelest
17 years ago
Toni:
The same number 38. But wait, I just added a Lisbon lemon last week because I heard that JoeReal had budded 42 cultivars in one lisbon. Imagine that. And oh, I bought a kinnow mandarin about 3 months ago thinking that it was a Kishu ( those Japanese names seems like all the same)since Kishu is my favorite now when I went to a citrus tour locally and tasted its fruit.
The only difference is that I transferred the majority of them to the ground because I thought they outgrow their 15 gallon and wine barrel pots.
And thanks for the compliment Toni.
So that makes it 40 citrus altogether but it seems that they all will not fit into my yard. I've been spacing them now every 5 feet apart and to think that you have over 400 plants!!! Yikes!!!! Wow!!!!
bencelest
17 years ago
Toni:
I'd like to know.
Why do SOME people here don't reply when you tried to solve their problem. It takes time to type, to research so you can resove their problem then NADA. No reply.
Why would they bother to ask questions and ignore the replies afterwards.
That's my worst pet peeve in this forum.
Then when I ask this, I get flamed.
I don't understand.
rickjames
17 years ago
Well bencelest I will step up to the plate and formally thank you for all the help you have given us as well as the inspiration you provide by posting the lovely pictures of your beautiful trees. Even if there is no formal response I can assure you that I pay attention to what you write, and I am sure I am not alone in this.
bencelest
17 years ago
Rickjames.
I sincerely thank you for your kind words sir.
Also you got email from me.

Benny
paradisi
17 years ago
firstly prepare the site where the tree is to be moved to - build it up with as much good compost as you can find - make a mound at least half a metre above the surrounding soil - this stops any chance of root collar rot from the roots sitting in water collected by the clay soil

mark out an area around the tree with a spade - as big as you think you might be able to move - dig the spade in to chop off the feeder roots, then prune the tree by at least a third - you will need to chop off this much growth to compensate for the shock of moving the tree. Get rid of the fruit and any blosasoms on the tree.

the professional way is to then dig a trench and bring in a backhoe or digger of some sorts to lift the root ball and line under the root ball with hessian - to stop the loss of soil and to help minimise the damage.

My only experience with moving lemons was to pull a poorly performing tree up from the hole it was in and plant it in a compost heap - shocked the tree back to life and got lemons the next year.
birdsnblooms
17 years ago
Ben, I can't answer your question as to why ppl post a thread then are not there to read or ever heard from again.
Calm down, boy..lol..don't allow your to bp rise because of this problems.
I imagine some ppl have things to do..for instance, I might post a question on Fri, but I usually don't get online on Sats. Therefore the post is unanswered till Sun. But that's me..Or, say someone from NY asks a question and you who lives in Ca answers..well, that person, being 3 hours later, might go to bed..So, if it's 11 pm by your house it's 2 am by theirs. So, relax..no sense in getting yourself upset because someone doesn't answer..Toni
bencelest
17 years ago
Posted:
Need Help on transplanting my mature Meyer!
Posted by ths44 8/9: Northern CA. (My Page) on Sun, May 28, 06 at 17:08
Answered
RE: Need Help on transplanting my mature Meyer!
Posted by: bencelest z9 CA (My Page) on Wed, May 31, 06 at 7:06 AM PT
answered
Ben, I can't answer your question as to why ppl post a thread then are not there to read or ever heard from again.
Calm down, boy..lol..don't allow your to bp rise because of this problems.
I imagine some ppl have things to do..for instance, I well, that person, being 3 hours later, might go to bed..So, if it's 11 pm by your house it's 2 am by theirs. So, relax..no sense in getting yourself upset because someone doesn't answer..Toni
Answered May 31 1106 AM
Time now: June 4 4:30 PM PT
He lives in California also
I no need to say anymore. Case closed.
My last.
ths44
Original Author
17 years ago
First, let me say I apologise for not having repsponded to the wonderful knowledge and advice given me here re: moving my Meyer. Was not intentional. I expecting to receive email when someone responded, and when I never got a one, there was no reason to come to the site. Well, apparantly that feature doesn't work anymore, because I just happen to check it out tonight, there you all were with your posts!! Wow. Some advanced, garden smartees out there, I should say.

Toni: Good suggestions, you, yes the roses would want more light too, and there is no other place for them to go, then in the bed where the Meyer (is still). Where I plan to move it actually gets quite alot of afternoon sun.

Ben: Thank-you kindly for all your words of advice. And sending the pics as well! Wow, a beautiful garden you have. Salinas is superb for citrus. Love that area. I am in Northern Cal (Santa Rosa), originally from Santa Cruz. Okay, so Tapla doesn't agree about amending the soil, so a little confused there. Wonder if he agrees about the watering you suggested? I'm scared to move the thing now. :)

Tapla: Thank-you for taking the time to repond to my questions. You suggested I wait to transplant next Spring, if I understand correctly. I'm not as pro as you and never heard of "root pruning". You mean dig up enough to cut back the roots, and then plant it back down? What does "growing hard" mean? This tree has a great deal of new leaf growth on it.

Paradisi: Thank-you also for the time spent writing your wise words. Compost huh? Okay, Tampla doesn't believe in any amendment at all, and Ben says potting soil. Oh, dear, Now i'm really confused. :)! After re-reading your post, maybe you mean Compost on top of existing soil, not in it, yes? The area I want to move it too, is in front of the garage doors, (in the driveway), its about 42" wide, and 120" long, and surrounded by concrete. Has an old shrub there now.

Looks like EVERYBODY believes I should remove the lemons (and flowers), yes? Kills me to do that, but if you all are in agreement there....I shall.

Please accept my sincere appreciation.
Teresa

Need Help on transplanting my mature Meyer!

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