There are a couple of Eupatorium (?) that are more tolerant of dryness, but they would mainly have to be started from seed or mail ordered. I think one is E. perfoliatum and the other is E. hysoppifolium (sp?). Both white-flowered, late bloomers. They should fit your overall size requirements, too. I grow E. purpureum 'Little Red' and it is still settling in after being fall-planted last year. It is in partial sun in the most consistently damp soil I can muster (not an easy task in my sandy soil). The jury is still out on ultimate performance since it is not mature, but it appears to be growing well. It was among the latest of all my perennials to emerge, right before the hardy hibiscus. If you do not want to go with a Eupatorium, how about a baptisia or an aster? Both can tolerate dryness.

it gets huge. at least 5'. We had this exact conversation 2 years ago, but its gone now. I tried pinching mine early in the season as an experiment to keep the size in check, but it didn't work out. It delayed them way too long and they were too small. I divided and moved mine last fall to at least be in back of the border so the height didn't block out other things. And it is pretty and a butterfly magnet, but watch out! This is in August where the section on the left was not cut back. The two sections on the right were cut back. Not sure just when. Its written down somewehre.

Hey folks, Thanks for all of the earlier feedback. Demolition is well underway, and we are on to framing, and in a few weeks, plumbing/electrical. I need to finalize much of the kitchen layout ahead of plumbing rough-in. So I am updating this thread with current design in hope of getting additional feedback to see if there are any issues/concerns I haven't considered. (Let me know if it's best to start a new thread given the age of this post - I opted to keep it for continuity.) Latest floorplan: Orientation: North (top of diagram): living room area (open) South (bottom of diagram): dining room area (open) West (left of diagram): deck/water view Elevation of galley wall (east) Elevation of island (west) Based on the earlier feedback, we have: Aisle width: Increased the width between the island and galley/appliance wall to 42" Prep sink: Eliminated the prep sink - there didn't seem to be a compelling reason to have two sinks with this layout, and ultimately I didn't want to give up the cabinet / drawer space that this would impinge on Cleanup/Prep zone: Instead, placed dishwasher/sink/trash receptable on island in a way that hopefully creates reasonable separation of the cleanup, prep, and cooking zones (despite the fact that the prep and cleanup zones necessarily share a sink). Dishwasher: We opted to place the dishwasher on the left end of the island so that it was close to the dining area, next to the sink, and away from the cooking area. I considered moving this a little more to the center of the island to facilitate closer proximity to dish/flatware storage, but didn't like the fact that it would likely be close to the cooktop and further from dining area (i.e. inviting more traffic into cooking areas) Sink: We opted to place this to the right of the dishwasher so that it would be accessible to the cleanup area, adjacent to the prep area but mostly out of the way of the cooking area (it is not back to back with the rangetop) Trash: We opted to place this to the right of the sink so that it was near the prep area, but accessible from the cleanup area. (I read several threads that recommended trash being closer to prep area than cleanup area) Cooktop: Centered on the galley wall, both for aesthetics and function Ovens: I looked at a lot of layout options, and ultimately opted to stack the ovens bottom to top with a 30" Convection Wall Oven (bottom), 12" Warming Drawer (middle), and 24" Convection Steam Oven (top), with the 18" (tall) microwave being placed undercounter on the island, opposite the main oven stack. (All Miele - separate thread on this). The top of the oven stack is 68.5" off the ground in this configuration, which is roughly eye level for me (6' / 72" tall). The rationale was centered around assuming that the CSO would be the primary oven so we placed that in the most optimal spot, and that it would also be best to have that higher up for safety of venting steam. We also wanted to keep the warming drawer at an accessible level. The only downside is that the 30" CO/wall oven is at a less useful height (below counter), but there wasn't a great option that we liked for placing this at waist/eye level. I considered this acceptable if this is the secondary oven. We considered putting the microwave next to the refrigerator for easier access (seems like a lot of people like that), but ultimately decided that we liked the aesthetics of the current location + the increased pantry size that this offers. Thoughts/feedback/concerns on this layout? Overall I am pretty happy and thinks it meets most of our design goals but want to see if there are any yellow/red flags in what we have planned. The only things that are giving me a bit of pause are: Aisle width - Once demo is complete I am going to try to get some boxes to mock out the 42" wide aisle to see if that feels sufficient. Taped out, it seemed fine, and from reading this forum, it seems like a good number of folks "get by" with 42" despite multiple cooks, but I know there was feedback on this thread to get this to 48" as a more standard two-cook width. To do that, I would likely take up @buehl's suggestion and reduce the walkway behind the island, and potentially the size of the island itself. But I kinda like those dimensions and chose to compromise on the kitchen aisle width a bit. Dishwasher/sink placement - is this a good placement to have a good flow for prep, cooking, and cleanup? Cabinet / drawer layout - we have a few weeks before we place the cabinet order so have time to fine tune this still, so I plan to go over this more closely next so that I can optimize the layout for my storage needs. If there is anything immediately problematic it would be good to know! Thanks in advance for any insight, everyone has been immensely helpful in helping me with planning and design of this kitchen! Joe

Nidnay you have a beautiful, elegant kitchen. I do like the way the curved apron sink looks and am pleased to hear that it’s big enough and that functionally you have no issue with comfort when you’ve used it. However It’s a shame that the drainage is off especially for the price these Rohl sinks command. I looked at Rohl’s spec sheet which recommended to check the sink’s drainage as well as the finish. Have you brought this issue up to Rohl? I would think they should stand by their product. Has anyone else experienced poor drainage and puddling with their straight front sinks or is it only an issue with Rohl’s curved front sink? Can anyone comment if an offset drain is more reliable than a center drain in these hand cast sinks? Awesome faucet,Nidnay, is it Waterstone? I love their designs and hope to include 2 of their faucets in my kitchen. Your wall paint color complements the cabinets well. My cabinets will be painted similarly. Do you recall what color the walls are? I appreciate everyone taking the time to respond to my post. Your feedback and information is invaluable.