Oooh, I really like that - it might be the solution to a problem area I have too. But, will it tolerate our heat I wonder? Anybody have one?

I have one over here in Georgia, growing in full afternoon sun. It has done great and is so beautiful. The flowers were gorgeous.

I have been lusting after these for awhile. I've never seen them in any nursery here in Charlotte & worried they didn't do well here in our heat. I'm happy to hear that they do.

In the world of elderberries all the fancy leaved or non-green leaf forms are of the European Elder - Sambucus nigra, which struggles in my yard. The native elderberry does fine and doesn't catch the same disease but so far no one has developed purple leaf forms of it. I do know other gardeners in the Raleigh area that grow Black Lace and they have no problems with it but they don't have River Birch trees nearby which seems to be where the disease issue comes from (they both get the same spots on their leaves).

You know the native one has now been classified as Sambucus nigra L. ssp. canadensis. Just for the reason that John mentions, I think we lost something there in the name change. Of course I guess the name change is strictly based on botanical similarities. And if they are REALLY that similar, shouldn't the European one (now called Sambucus nigra L. ssp. nigra) do fine?

I do have the native elderberry growing naturally in my yard, especially along the creek.

I don't have any River Birches (nor do my neighbors), so I guess mine will be fine for a while.

Native elderberries like a lot of moisture (typically they grow in ditches and along streams). They are also Japanese beetle magnets.

Oooh, I'm getting psyched for this one! Couple of ??'s ...

Sounds like they do well in this area - is the description contained in the link accurate, i.e. the size/shaping part and the winter interest part (does it drop leaves or not)?

I was also going to ask about the JB's - alicia says magnet, does this apply to the Black Lace too?

And, are they readily available at nurseries around here for fall planting or are they more a mail order item?

TYIA

i've seen them at the higher end nurseries- i'd think homewood near you would have them. my guess is if the regular ones are jb magnets, the red will be too. but maybe not- you never know. yes, they do drop their leaves in winter. the emerging foliage is quite pretty in spring.

BB's in Sanford has Midnight beauty. We begged John, the owner (seriously...we begged) to bring in the Midnight lace but he didn't, I think he said he couldn't find it this spring but would try again in the fall or next spring. I planted two of the Midnight Beauty this spring. The one planted in afternoon sun is bleached out and sad looking. The one planted in morning sun is growing well and still is that gorgeous deep burgandy. It doesn't seem to need more water than anything else. Adele

Have not seen Japanese beetles on either the Black Lace or the species plants this year. They've been on the azaleas (and I've squished every one I've found).

They do not keep their leaves in the winter.

My Black Lace is in its second year and must be going through the Sleep-Creep-Leap cycle because it is not much bigger.

I actually got mine at Home Depot Landscape Supply, it was in a 3 gallon Proven Winners container.

Thanks - Tammy, Adele & Esh_ga ...... Black Lace is definitely on my list now!

Two remarks. 1. ZigZag, Homewood Gardens told me not to get the Black Lace for this area. Said the Humid. would "melt the plant". I'd be interested in seeing if they tell you the same thing. I'd like to try one myself if I can find one at a reasonable price. 2. esh ga -Where is Home Depot Landscape Supply???? Is there one near Raleigh? I've read that HD was opening a separate Landscaping store but didn't know they had. Are you near Atlanta GA? HD's headquaters.

Looks like they only have HD Landscape Supply in GA and TX right now. Perhaps other retailers that carry the Proven Winners brand would have them.

Here is a link that might be useful: HD Landscape Supply

Maybe Homewood Gardens was thinking of Black Beauty when they said it couldn't take the humidity. Black Lace is supposed to do better, and so far I saw where somebody in Virginia is having good luck with Black Lace; it's her favorite plant in her garden. So it might be premature to say it can't do well here, though Homewood is a fine nursery.

As mentioned above I've been wanting one of these for quite some time. Last Friday, I noticed Wayside had them on sale for $19.99. I'm anxiously awaiting this for fall delivery!

Plans are to put it in the front of the house where it will get morning sun & afternoon shade. I hope it will do good there.

Two weeks ago I was at Rountree in Charlotte and talked with one of the managers there about this. He said they had them in stock several years ago but that they aren't good nursery plants because they require alot of water when in the container. They were high maintenance for them. He said they are a great plant, do well here but definitely need to be in the ground.

I penned a response yesterday, but the #$@^% pop-up erased it - grrrr !

AGP, I will check w/Homewood and see if I get the same answer, or as suggested, maybe that HW person was confusing the Black Lace w/BB - possible, there's soooo much to know about!

Meanwhile, me who has made so much noise about BL is now re-thinking my potential location. What occurred to me is that spring color in the front of my house is not what I need - there's already a riot out there! - what I want/need is a more evergreen (with bloom would be great) to tie the mini-gardens down thru the winter months and still look great thru the summer. Camellias are getting my attention just now ...... (I still do want a BL Elderberry, just not for this specific area.)

I have two fall bloomers - one tall espaliered (sp) on the back wall and another compact shrubby one in front. They're both of pink coloration and bloom their heads off every year. Also have three late winter bloomers - two whites and a pink - they often get nipped, but when they do get to show their stuff (like last non-winter), they're spectacular. If I can get the right configuration for my front areas, they should fill the bill and provide the visual repetition/consistancy I like.

I bumped into a website for Camella Forest in Chapel Hill - looks like they have most every type in creation ..... anybody know of or about them?