Kathy I am so glad to hear how much fun you are all having. I have to say my gardening experience has hit an all new high with Jordan (3 1/2 year old granddaughter) at my side. She is so happy when we are out digging, planting and harvesting! I enjoyed my gardens before but now am at a whole new level of enjoyment. She truly has the gardening spirit and passes it on to anyone who gets in her way LOL. A month ago, we went up north and stopped at a friend's house. She stated that she had been out working in the yard and was planting flowers. Jordan jumped up and said "come on lets go dig some more flowers". The kid would not take no for an answer and the next thing you know we are all outside digging up the soil and plant over 30 transplants. She even knows that plants come from seeds and asks if she can "pick new flowers for next year" when we take walks...the kid is already a little seed snagger ROFLMBO. A couple weeks ago I took her to the zoo and again she wouldn't take no for a answer. Believe it or not this little girl talked the ear off the volunteer coordinator about her plants and they are allowing a her to plant her own little garden area at the zoo (with my supervision of course). She has been assigned a little 3'x5' area. She has already picked out rudbeckia and purple coneflowers we grew from seed this spring and of course a daylily named "Jordan". She is so happy because she can then see the "snow bear" (polar bear) whenever she wants. I'll tell you I see things is such a different light with this little girl around. The sun seems to shine brighter, birds chirp louder and the butterflies abound. Enjoy all you can with your little ones! Kim

Kim said... >My original obsession was outrageously out of hand and I loved it. [...] I'm keeping to the level area as much as possible. Weeding that slope is offensive enough without having to traipse up and down, sliding on every other step, to maintain anything down there. I know I will resent the ones which go on the slope and will eventually allow them to go the way of the Dodo, so I'm choosing to rid myself of them, instead. That's a LOT of roses, quite a few of which are seedlings either generated through my obsession or those shared with me by other "obsessives", but that is what it is going to take to keep this "fun", doable and prevent the water requirements from eating me out of house, home and desire. Weeding through them to maintain those which are just happier to be here with me and those which are endangered, has been a real chore. Now, if there was a ton of level land with high ground water. Hi Kim, Back in the Dark Ages we lived in California in just the sort of spot you are conjuring up as a high ground water fix. But native trees really like spots like that too... and our house had lots of shade, too much shade for most roses. Still, we wouldn't have dreamed of cutting down a tree. We didn't own the house, we like trees, and anyway, removing a tree was illegal without a good reason for a permit where we lived (a Monarch Butterfly preserve). Anyway, we were relative youngsters at the time and didn't know just how wet that property was until our vegetable garden was swimming in water during the winter months. It was fine, fine black silty sand that held on to the water pretty well too. Your post made me think about what we'd do if confronted with your lack of water problems back in California again. What you're doing makes a lot of sense. But I also am wondering whether a bank full of Renaes rambling around might not survive and also keep the weeds down once they proliferated and established themselves? They might take over the other remaining roses, but if you weren't still trying hard to keep those... A bunch of Renaes might not require so much watering once established? I don't think a big crowd of them would look bad at all, depending on personal tastes, of course. In fact, I prefer that kind of look. We've done that crowded thing in a pretty good sized area with azaleas and rhododendrons here; they all grow together and if there's a weed under there somewhere, well, you can't easily penetrate to find or see it. Once in awhile there's a tree sneaking in that will have to be pulled up, but basically it's too shady under all the plant thickness for most weeds to grow. And I adore the looks of those crowded plants! No, we don't have big problems with fungal diseases, even with the crowd. Maybe fewer than average problems, though phytopthera wilt sometimes does require some cutting back of rhododendron limbs. You know a big problem with azaleas and rhododendrons is that they aren't drought tolerant. Well, we have lost huge numbers since our drought problems began big time here around 2001. It's been wonderfully rainy most of the time during the last couple of years, but the next drought period is probably just around the corner... and if we lose some more azaleas and rhododendrons then, well, I'm thinking of trying to establish some Renaes and Annie Laurie McDowells in their place in the relatively sunnier spots... along with some more camellias, which are drought tolerant after the first year. (Though blooming is less than ideal if August and September are dry.) We lost our Annie Laurie McDowell to Rose Rosette Disease last year, but I am figuring that if it's anything like our Renae here, well, it's as no-care, no-worry a plant as any other plant of any kind we've ever had in our yard. Not a touch of blackspot or any other disease here thus far (though that may well change just a bit as we get more shade as the sun angle changes during the fall). Anyway, I'm hoping for another Annie Laurie McDowell eventually too. Ours is a no-spray all-organic yard for everything we grow and Renae fits well into that way of doing things. I think Annie Laurie McDowell will too. I know it hurts to cut back some on what you are able to continue doing, Kim. But I keep thinking mostly about your achievements and how much you have helped so many others in what you have already contributed. Thank you! Best wishes, Mary

Kimmsr, where do you get this stuff? I know where I get mine. My sources (aside from years of experience) include Purdue and "The Complete Compost Gardening Guide" and a class I attended put on by our local solid waste management department. These critters are most certainly not a sign that the compost is too wet. As was mentioned, the sowbugs are found in high carbon environments. You know, like compost with oak leaves. Maybe that's why they are also called wood lice. They don't need lots of water. Your compost pile won't be hot on the outside, so you will find those, springtails, black soldier-fly larvae, etc. if you aren't a militant compost turner (which few of us are) and making sure the entire pile stays so hot it composts in less than a month. I turn mine like crazy in summer months to get compost for fall, but that's the only time I'm turning every three days at max. I still get compost and don't have bad smells. Worms will flee heat and you will find them in the outskirts of the bin if you haven't run them off with the fertilizer. They also flee vibration. So, if you turn the pile regularly they will flee. If it's a sign of too much water, then I wonder why my compost bin even had roly-polies and sowbugs during last year's drought. Jbclem, why do you try to make sure there are no sowbugs in your compost before you apply it to the garden? It's unnecessary and they will help break down any debris in the garden that would otherwise tie up some nitrogen. They have been known to hurt seedlings when no dead matter is left available (insects eat a lot they wouldn't normally eat if it means survival, which is why they will be around much longer than us) and if you want to avoid that you can spread the finished compost on a tarp or something in the sun and the put down a board. The bugs will migrate under the board within the day. You can also use bark off of firewood or some other woody substance. You can do the same thing in the garden, though. Don't want sowbugs to eat your plants? Then provide them with food like bark or a board and move them back to the compost where they do some good. If you want worms, then you are using the wrong method. There is a great book on worm composting called "worms eat my garbage" that I recommend. I have started using worms indoors to reduce trips to the compost bin in winter. It started out as a little science project with the kids. Now it might just replace my hot compost pile as it seems to be tons faster with less hassle. Turning compost can be back breaking work!

Kathy, Well, gardening with kids is more fun than gardening without them! First, from the perspective of once being a gardening kid myself.....I remember working in the yard and veggie garden with my dad when I was a kid and I always loved every minute of it. I had grandparents and aunts and uncles who gardened, some of them on quite a large scale, so gardening was just something that was a part of our life. When I was a kid, it was just part of our routine to sit on the porch and shell peas or snap beans or whatever. And, you know, every conversation with a gardening relative in the harvest season included a line like "I put up 12 quarts of tomatoes today".....or whatever. It never occurred to me, growing up, that everyone didn't have veggie gardens, fruit trees, berry bramble or bushes, etc., in their own backyards. Imagine how shocked I was to learn that some people had to buy their jams and jellies!! I also remember that I always thought home-grown flowers were the prettiest! (I still do.) I'll forever be grateful to my dad, grandparents, aunts and uncles and also neighborhood friends who gardened and were always willing to answer my questions and share the gardening passion with me. How well I remember all those "little old lady" gardeners in my neighborhood who worked outside in their cotton dresses, practical shoes, wide-brimmed hats and gardening gloves.....and now, except that I generally work in blue jeans and t-shirts, I guess I am one of those ladies. (They weren't really "little old ladies", although as a child, that's how I thought of them.) Most all of my gardening relatives and the neighbors I grew up with are gone now, although my youngest uncle is still alive and well and gardening in East Texas, but I will always have my precious memories of them and their gardens! My son, who is in his 20s now, probably cannot remember a time when we didn't garden. We always had veggies and fruit trees, and built our first water garden when he was only about 8 or 10 years old. I remember how fascinated he was when our order of pond plants and bullfrog tadpoles (from Lily Pons in Houston) arrived and we "planted" that first water garden. Later, he, our nephew and my DH hand-dug a second lily pond in that yard, and then we had a third in a large, round galvanized stock tank, Between the ponds and the swimming pool, our whole backyard in Fort Worth was pretty much water, with veggies in one relatively small area, and fruit trees in another. When we moved to the country, our then-teenaged son was a tremendous help in building the raised beds and planting all kinds of stuff. He still pays close attention to what I grow even though he is busy and not around the house much. Some of his favorite things in his younger years included growing all kinds of things on teepees.....gourds, mini-pumpkins, pole beans, morning glories, moon flowers, etc. Of course, the teepees had to be large enough that he and his friends could play inside of them!! He also loved the process of raising pickling cucumbers and turning them into pickles. Making strawberry jam was a favorite activity when he was younger, as was picking all kinds of produce, but especially peaches and blackberries. Nowadays, his time is pretty occupied with firefighting and paramedic school and the young woman who will one day be his wife, but he still is very helpful....especially if I need for someone to come kill a venomous snake in the garden, or chase a bobcat out of the garden! Of course, he willingly eats food from the garden, and cooks with it as well. He's always been interested in the older heirloom varieties that come in "odd" colors....like black tomatoes or purple potatoes. In fact, his fiancee' recently made mashed potatoes from some All-Blue Potatoes I'd grown this spring, and they both thought having lilac-colored mashed potatoes was pretty special. (EVERYONE, adult or child, always seems to love veggies that are unusual colors....like orange eggplants or red-fleshed potatoes or white pumpkins, or whatever.) Since my "little boy" is now a professional firefighter, he's turned into quite an accomplished cook and, during his first year in the fire station, he was constantly coming home and trying out new recipes on us....and this often involved veggies and herbs right from the garden. I think cooking at work broadened his appreciation of having the ingredients growing right out in the yard! Over the years, we've shared our garden with the children, and now--the grandchildren--of our friends. It is always fun to see the delight on a young child's face when he finds a ripe watermelon, or picks a cherry tomato off the vine and eats it right there. Often, the bugs and butterflies in the garden are just as fascinating to these kids, since a lot of them grow up in very nice neighborhoods where everything is very neat and precise and lots of pesticides are used and, as a consequence, you don't see a lot of dragonflies or bees or lizards or butterflies or toads or whatever. Our garden, growing in reckless abandon and full of all kinds of creatures is a wonderland for a lot of "city kids" who've never been around a garden. Although our son didn't seem all that interested in the veggie garden during his later high school years (what with school activities, a job, a car, and girls.....), it suddenly became a VERY popular place with him and his friends during whatever year it was that they had to make a insect collection for biology. A lot of his friends in town came out to our place because they "couldn't find" enough insects in town. LOL At our house, they could find the 30 or 40 or 50 insects they needed in a couple of hours! I've noticed, too, that all his girlfriends have had an interest in the garden....even after they aren't his girlfriend any more. LOL They particularly seem to love all the flowers, but especially the variety of sunflowers in all sizes and colors. I look forward to some day sharing the garden and all of its' wonders with another generation when I become a grandparent. One thing that I think was a surprise to all of us, and not just our son, was what a great icebreaker the veggies and flowers turned out to be. Moving into a very rural location where you can't even see the nearest houses (well, 10 years later you can see 1 house, but only because they cleared a lot of land and removed all the trees), the flowers and trees gave everyone driving by an excuse to stop and visit. We "met" most of our new neighbors when they stopped to admire a flower or the veggie garden. (Because our best soil is in front of the house, between the house, which sits back about 300' from the road, and the road itself, that's where the veggie garden is, and it is a great "icebreaker".) To this day, strangers driving by often stop to "visit" when I am out in the garden, and it doesn't matter if they are six years old, or 36, or 60 or 90 years old. So, I hope DS has seen how gardens bring people together too. It is hard to pick out one particular memory that is more special or memorable than the others, but I do think one of my "proudest" gardening moments was when DH's best friend and long-time police partner passed away after a brief battle with a brain tumor. We went out to the yard later that day and cut flowers and put together separate bouquets for his mom, his sister, his wife, his son/daughter-in-law, and his other son & grandson. Each flower arrangement had flowers that were specifically memorable or important to the person for whom they were intended, and THAT was so important to us. The lesson I hope DS got from that was that gardening is one way we can express emotions when, sometimes, events happen for which words are not enough. I hope DS's memories of gardening with me are as important to him as my memories are to me! If I had to sum up all those times we spent together in the yard and garden, I'd simply repeat that old saying "Ain't we got fun!" Dawn