Everyone has made points I can agree with. Carbon sequestration works better if the roots can go deep. The roots go deep at Rodale because they plow deep 2 years and then use no-till the third year. The organic matter and amendments have been worked deep so the roots go deep. They reduce erosion with cover crops but they do not eliminate it. Any act of disturbing the soil no matter how small allows some erosion. I think we are missing the real solution to the problem. The real solution is to stop buying corn fed beef (eat grass fed). Farmers will grow corn as long as people buy it. It is easier to make beef taste good with corn, but it can be done with grass. It is just harder. If managed properly, permanent pastures are the best way to stop erosion and actually build soil. We should also stop using corn for ethanol even if it is "no-till". It consumes as much as it produces and still causes erosion. It is important to keep pushing for true no-till or even partial no-till, but lets chop off the head of the snake, not the tail. In my garden, I can only use no-till about every 3-4 years. Most of the time I disturb the soil by mowing first. Then I till shallow. Then I till deep if necessary. It gives the insects and worms a chance to withdraw. Then I plant very quickly to cover the soil and feed the mycorrhizal fungus. Everything recovers quickly. Here is a link that might be useful: Garden For Nutrition This post was edited by GreeneGarden on Tue, Dec 11, 12 at 19:25

Hi gonzer, Thanks very much for that. I've only been getting into Tills for a bit over a year and I haven't acquired or seen any Till books yet. That's something I must do so thanks for the pointer, but what will that do to my already out-of-control apetite for more Tills!!! Another neophyte question if I might. When you say "water from the edge", does that mean no direct watering on the plant at all, just misting or light wetting? And Nick, thanks for that pic. Nice plant, and I see what you mean about the pups. My hesitation is rapidly waining - I'm off down the yard to pot up a couple of Tills! Cheers, Paul

Hi Jennifer, Are you absolutely, positively certain they knew you were just an Ordinary Person who was bringing a few of your Ordinary Plants with you---rather than a nursery or some sort of a commercial operation who was planning to "import" plants into the state? I've done several searches and I can't find anything at all regulating INDIVIDUALS who are bringing plants into the state for their own personal use! All that stuff you posted above sounds VERY much to me like something we would have been dealing with when I was still in the Green Industry! Maybe I'm wrong, but I kinda suspect if you call the Colorado Dept. Of Agriculture and tell them you want them to "inspect" the plants you dug up in your yard they might--well--have you locked up! ;-) Go to the site I'm linking and look at the Oregon Word document. That's ALL about commercial operations. I did find info about not bringing pot (not potS, POT!) into the state---guess you're gonna have to start all over again with seed! :-) And there's information about Noxious Weeds--which are included on that document. And while WAY back when, there used to actually be "guards" stationed where you went "into" California to check for Illegal Contraband, even CA doesn't do that anymore, so to whom are you supposed to show your Colorado DOA inspection certificate? I'm not sure how you'd go about checking further! Maybe you should call the Colorado DOA and try to explain to them what you were told to see what they say---and be sure you tell them you're just an Ordinary Person who's planning to dig a "few" plants up in your yard--and will be potting them in a soilless mix, and taking them with you when you move to Oregon. Be sure they know you have NO intentions to either propagate or sell them. And, whatever you decide to do to check further, PLEASE come back and let us/ME know what you find out. With all the people moving here, there, and everywhere these days, I just can't imagine that either the Oregon DOA OR the Colorado DOA is running around people's yards inspecting a few plants here and there. Now, having said all that! The plants you got from me at the swaps were all grown in Sunshine #1. I'm guessing you're gonna use a fair amount of soil to pot the things you're digging up, so I recommend getting a bale of it (30-some dollars) at Paulino's and use that. Bales are by far the cheapest way to buy soilless mixes since it's compressed and you're getting a lot more than it "looks like." Sunshine mix is also what ALL of Paulino's plants are started and grown in (they sometimes use a different # mix for propagation). I'll repeat this one more time! DON'T buy Hyponex---if you want them to still be alive when you get there! And I don't recommend Miraclegro--WAY overpriced, and extremely inconsistent quality. For the perennials, as soon as your soil is workable, I'd dig up small divisions (they'll get big again!), knock/wash the soil off of the roots and pot them in the mix, keeping them in the appropriate light conditions till you leave (say it ain't so!!!). You can probably plant many of them in pots that are smaller than a gallon to save space. I can't imagine you're going to be successful getting a rose that's been growing in the ground into a one gallon pot! Even the roses that are planted up at Paulino's, which all come in bare root and which have the roots pruned significantly before being potted, are put into two gallon pots. If you're wrong about the regulations, you could put them into bigger pots. And you CAN prune the roots when you do them, but I'd definitely recommend doing it while they're still dormant--a/k/a, as soon as possible, and I'd cut the canes down pretty short too. The other thing you could try--and I've never done this--is to take cuttings and root them. I can't tell you how, but there have been a couple threads around here over the years telling how to do it. Now! About the 'Cherry bells'!!! You know I warned you about growing that--even in Nederland! If you really want to take a chunk of it with you, I'd recommend potting it up just like everything else--and then putting it in a BIG POT in it's new home! I very very, veryveryvery strongly recommend you don't plant it in the ground out there. If you plant that stuff in the ground in Oregon it will probably wind up being added to their Noxious Weed List---and it could very well get YOU banned from the state! ;-) You mentioned on another thread that we should get together before you leave! Darn right, girl! Your place or my place, doesn't matter to me, but I definitely want to get together with you sometime over the summer before you leave! Skybird Here is a link that might be useful: State summaries of plant protection laws and regulations

None of my berry bushes or fig trees have gone dormant yet, So I'll have no cuttings, but I do have some well rooted 1 year fig plants that need to get into the ground sometime between going dormant and bud burst in spring. If they can be over wintered in a unheated garage or attic that would be best. unfortunately the tags were lost long ago, so I can't tell you the exact variety, but if I have them they are good tasting and suited to our growing season. I can easily mail dormant cutting later in the winter or you can get them rooted in the spring. I do have some viable seeds from some wonderful melon I got from the Amish in Three Oak's/Ethridge, TN it's not quite a honeydew and not quite a cantaloupe, but it's _way_ yummie! I'm interested in anything that is edible or fermentable. Esp. looking for any fruit/veggie seeds, of course. BREAK Judy, is that crabapple a fruiting variety? And is it self fertile? Jackie, might be intersted in a Sweet Potato vine My darling spousal unit, Karen is interested in anything "pretty" and low maintenance for the flower beds in front of the house. BREAK If anybody want to bring anything, I'll be happy to toss it on the griddle. from fruits/berries(preferably home grown) to put in the pancakes, to eggs, bacon, sausage, potato, etc etc. you bring it I can cook it! and we could always use something to drink since it's kid of early in the day to drink my "juice".