the intensity of any given light has many variables..

e.g... 2 hours of sun at dawn or dusk.. is NOT the same as 2 hours at high noon ....

how any given plant will grow in any given location really depends on just how lucky you are ....

i know you want reinsurance.. but i dont know if we can tell you what you want to know .... about how it is all going to happen in your garden ...

how about thinking about removing a tree or two????? might be the best garden investment you can make... most specifically that norway maple ... ek gad woman ... be done with it.. increase your options exponentially ...

ken

I haven't grown 'Kakome,' but I've grown other filipendulas. I agree with Ken that the quality and time of the shade/sun matters. Deep shade that's penetrated by an hour or two of burning midday sun (or not) can be very different than consistent light, filtered shade. But the main thing I've noticed about the filipendulas I've grown is that they want to be somewhat moist (which is always a challenge in my yard). The ones that were growing beneath an elm are much happier now that the elm is gone, and I water a bit.

Even if you have too much shade for this plant, and this goes for most part-shade-loving plants, you probably won't quickly kill it through lack of sun. You'll just notice that it's not performing all that well. At that point you can try to find a better spot for it, limb up your trees or find a better plant for the spot.

your problem... with shade plants failing... is MOST LIKELY the trees under which you are trying to grow plants under ....

as a hardcore hosta grower.. i know a thing or two about super competitive tree roots ... and the worst trees to grow under are maple.. and more specifically norways ... willow.. mulberry ... and some others that are escaping me right now ...

frankly.. you cant water enough under them... for the plants you are trying to get established ...

under such trees.. NEVER do any of the following...

FERTILIZE ...

AMEND THE SOIL in the planting hole

INDIVIDUALLY WATER only the plants ...

these things tend to make the trees grow roots.. guess where... in the plant you are trying to grow ... to plant such.. you dig a hole.. and truncate all the tree rroots ... and then the darn tree starts growing all these feeder roots right inside your plants roots ...

go figure on all that ...

ken

ps: there is an old post in the tree forum about the most hated.. or worst trees to grow .... link below .. how many do you have???

Here is a link that might be useful: link

I have 'Kahome', and for me it has been a real stinker! I have had it four years and only in the third year did it decide to grace me with its blooms. I will admit they were pretty, but the foliage was a disaster! After it blooms it gets this rust-like spotting on the foliage followed by extreme mildew. The moral of this story? I don't really like this plant, lol. I have two other Filipendulas and both are much better plants than this one. Filipendula ulmaria 'Aurea' has lovely shaped golden foliage. The white flowers are not terribly showy, but it is not a hard plant to grow if given a bit of afternoon shade. And F. vulgaris 'Flore Plena' (according to DG this one has other cultivar names: 'Flore Pleno', 'Plena', 'Multiplex') is wonderful! It has white, cloud-like flower heads and Sanguisorba-like foliage. And, the best thing, it doesn't mind it on the dry side!

Kahome seems to be very picky about placement. I think erring on the side of shade would be a good thing, and make sure it has moist soil. But you may have more luck with it than me- hope you do. All you can really do is plant it, observe it, and move it if it dislikes the situation. Repeat routine if needed ;-)

I wouldn't cut down any trees myself. I kind of think the world is cutting down too many trees as it is...just my opinion

Hope this has helped you some Miriam! Happy Gardening
CMK

Thanks for the advice about dropwort (kakome). Also thoughts on shade, trees, etc. I can't cut down any of the trees (and I wouldn't if I could) because I live in a townhouse and the trees are common property. The trees in my backyard garden are crabapple (under which I can grow hostas and ferns and 3 linden trees, where I can grow things on what I think is called the "drip line"? Is that the right term? It's the ground at the edge of the tree branches. Boy, that sounds weird....Miriam

Filipendula *needs* moister soil - it will get mighty crispy if the soil is too dry for it. I finally ditched my "Kakome", lovely as they were when I first got them - they were toasted in my "average" soil.

mkx3: yeah, I noticed shortly after I planted this kakome that it was gasping and wheezing (no, actually it was just turning a little crispy on the edges) I so watered and watered it, twice or three times a day, and it revived. So I just kept on watering it every day alll summer. Maybe this is what it needs during the hot, dry days of summer in Chicago. Think it's worth it? Did you plant yours in the shade? Miiriam

CMK: I meant to tell you how interesting your description of your various filipendulas. Kakome looked great in the picture on the plant label (haha, falling for an obvious marketing trick). dI agree with you that there are too many trees cut down to accommodate plants and grass. Who needs grass, anyway. Miriam

I have a fondness for filipendula and Kahome is one of my favourites. Not all filipedula succeed every year. They seem to love moisture, which is key to keeping their foliage attractive. I have not noticed mildew on Kahome, though it afflicts other varieties here some years.
It sounds as if your plant needs more sun to perform well. If it is under trees, adequate moisture is likely a problem.
When grown well, though, Kahome rewards with a nice long bloom season and lovely foliage. I always thought it would be a really good plant to grow beside a pond.

My F. Kahome does great. About 4-5 years old now. It took a couple of years to bloom well. Mine is in moist rich soil in full sun. I haven't noticed any foliage problems. I even recall that it was looking so good late into the season it was keeping me from cutting down the bed. It was holding the bed together.

Regarding "watering plants individually under competitive trees" (paraphrase), I do the opposite. I water the entire bed evenly and thoroughly. Same with feeding. I don't want to entice the tree roots to the spot with the individual plants in it. My goal is to normalize the area so everyone is happy and sharing and not to help the trees be too happy.

I'm pretty sure that was a tip I read here on GW. And I think it was from ego45 if memory serves me right (rare!)

I just planted some Kahome in a very wet garden this year. I'd say it gets about 2-3 hours of sun, but the bed is, again, very wet.

I guess it's too early to tell, but so far the plant is doing well. It bloomed this year, very pretty, and the foliage was beautiful - and as Wendy said, it was beautiful well into the late season.

Wendy, I think Ken does the same as you - if you see his post, he said to "never" do any of the following, and then lists watering individually etc. Your and Ken's methods make sense!

:)
Dee

Dee" I was happy to hear that your Kahome gets only 2-3 hrs. sun. As for the "bed being very wet"What's the difference between this and watering it a lot (which is what I did). (sp? My source says Kakome) Miriam

Miriam, this bed actually has standing water in it. Not immediately where the filipendula is, but it is always soggy, often sopping, and even in prolonged dry spells, still squishy wet. I don't have a photo of the garden, but here is a photo of the area before putting in the bed. Not a very good photo, but the dark brown area to the left at the base of the jewelweed is standing water.

{{gwi:252105}}

This bed now has willows, marsh marigolds, lobelia cardinalis, clethra, itea, and other water lovers in it, to give an idea. I also wanted to add that the 2-3 hours of sun is around mid-day, so that may make a difference.

Again, this plant (the filipendula) is new to me, so I don't know how well it will do here (or in your garden) but I just wanted to share my limited experience with it so far.

:)
Dee

> Wendy, I think Ken does the same as you - if you see his post, he said to "never"

ah... first the memory goes then the eyes go...and/or I read/skim too fast

maybe it was Ken's tip that I recall not Georges.

Miriam, water that doesn't linger in the rootzone is just going to be wasted. it may be too well draining or taken up by greedy competing roots.

I once read a tip for astilbes in such an area that may help. I've never tried it, but it makes sense. Create a wider than necessary saucer shaped hole and line it with heavy plastic. poke a few holes in it. and plant. That should keep the rootzone moist for the individual plant. Real aggressive tree roots may still find their way in eventually, but it should slow them down and give the individual plant a good chance to get established.

Dee: I see what you mean by "wet"-- that's boggy alright. My soil (the areas that are not near trees) seems to be pretty normal (as if I knew what "normal" was, haha...). Wendy: I'm growing astilbes (last year was the second year for them) and they seem to be doing pretty well. They're not near tree roots but they are against a north-facing fence. They get about 2 hrs. direct sun (ll:30 a.m. to 1:45 p.m.) Miriam