Carol I think your theory about bugs and weak plants is interesting. I've seen the same kind of thing in my yard. Last year I moved several of my KO's and they were chewed on the whole rest of the summer. Until late September. This year I moved Julia Child in the same bed and its the same thing. Other roses in that bed, no chewing at all. So that's something to ponder.

Sounds like AC's days are numbered in your yard:) Do you know what you will replace it with?

Kate

I dunno, a number of contenders for "dog" this year, being year two for most of my roses. I think Chihuly, actually. Last year it was so bright and full and healthy, then this year CRAP. Bloomed once, then defoliated. Very slow to regrow any leaves, and has one piddly little bud for a second 'flush.' I have no attachment to it whatsoever.

Among my faves are:
Lilac Rose
Windermere
Garden Party (for it's reliability and health despite it's status as an HT)
Ebb Tide
Cream Abundance

Others are still too young/small to count as faves...yet!

Carol, which of the Kordes Valencia do you have, the 1989 or 2006?

My favorite ones so far are Antique Caramel, Falling in Love, Strike It Rich and PJPII, Beauty Secret and Hanky Panky (mini).

Hey! What's wrong with dogs? Let's call them "deer roses, or "rabbit food", or "JB fodder". Something bad anyway, instead of something good. ;)

Hoover and Cuddles--their feelings are hurt!

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I only got 'Lady Emma Hamilton' this year, and she's a good one, so far.

ebster -- don't overlook Kordes' Valencia '67. However, I think it's quite safe to assume that anyone now growing Valencia is growing the 1989 version.

My "deer rose" of the year is Jack Frost, planted it last season. Theres not much I like about this rose at all. It was pitiful then, not much better this year. Most likely will be SP'ed.

Best performer for me is Memorial Day. It's been putting on lot's of growth, The blooms are big, fragrant and when the sun has burnt to a crisp all the other roses, MD still looks perfectly fine. Also, disease hasn't been much of an issue, despite being close to a BS magnet (unknown rose my mom planted, Candelabra most likely.) Neptune is a close 2nd for the same reasons, just not as vigorous.

Hmmm, this is a toughie to pick just one "crap rose" Moonstone (standard). Ugly all around, couple blooms, no smell. It is it's first year with me so I have to give it a chance.
Surprisingly, my best 3 are David Austins.
The Pilgrim - 4th yr. moved from pot to new raised bed this year.

Abraham Darby- Bare-root this year planted in a funky wood open bottom rectangle (it's ugly!)I threw together out of a giant plank we had around. The ground wouldn't drain well enough not matter what I did (clay and hardpan). He is in his second flush and big and beautiful and zero issues. I mean like every leaf perfect! Knock on wood box.... I sit next to him and tell him what a handsome guy he is.

Third, Christopher Marlowe. Hanging in there with the bugs and not getting the fungus among us. The blooms are to die for, like they're hand painted! Especially the backs of the petals. Each one unique. Niiice.

Cool post!

Allison

HOOVB, they are gorgeous, but what's that in the corner? lol. My new faves this year are Countess Sonja, Adam,Osiria, Sandra Renaissance,Coffee Country, and the best "I survived a zone 5 winter"....PEACE! My worst is Chicago Peace.

Kate - winters are so long that I like to leave the pondering until then. I use the local growers, so I like to get their list first. But off the top of my head - Elizabeth Taylor - I lost that one in the move, and it's my fav rose.

Greenhaven - Chihuly must GO!!! :) After I send this post I'm going to check out Austin's Windemere. Thanks for the tip!

Ebster - beats me. But I bought it this year, so probably the newer one. Pope John Paul II is new for me. I admit the fragrance is to die for, but the flowers hung down. Maybe it doesn't like growing in the pot. Now, however it has about 8 new buds that are standing straight up. So I'm looking forward to it.

Hoov - I had the same thought as I was out with my roses after I had posted this. I have two dogs that are wonderful. I made myself feel bad about it! :)

cjoliff - Jack Frost must GO!!! Snow shovel that baby!!! I would love to try Memorial Day. If it's offered at our greenhouse here, I'm getting it.

Allison - Moonstone hmmm. Get the crap bag out!! :) Maybe I'm being overzealous here!! :) I had Christopher Marlowe for one year before I lost it in the move. I LOVED, LOVED, LOVED the color and the amount of blooms. It was pretty small though.

Susan - most of your roses are ones I've never heard of!! Too bad about Chicago Peace - the pictures of it look SO beautiful!!!

I think I should have said, "My crap rose of the year." Crap is my favorite word - just ask my family!! :)

Carol

Susan, I can't believe CP is giving you problems. I had my first one five or six years before it died. I got another one last year but it didn't survive the winter so I got another one. It along with Sonia, Nicole and JFK are my favorite. My pain in the rear one is Purple Tiger, it has beautiful blooms but the damn thing is a black spot magnetic.

HoovB, cute snow teddy bear dogs!

Eluane is hurt too, whaddya mean a dog of a rose! I have a hard enough time with my Mama and those awful roses vying for her attention away from ME! I'm far lovelier than any rose, sigh...!

hmmm, no crap roses, just a crap! stupid newbie Me! my most recent update is that I have one really bad corner of the garden where the plum tree is...my poisonous soil (last year was filled with weedkiller), tree roots and shaded area are preventing my Frederick Mistral and Queen Elizabeth from blooming...The poison soil has also killed off my sage...I will have a later update with my personal struggles...

Hoovb, this is Roxy and her feelings aren't hurt. Why? Because she's a Golden! Happy happy ball ball ball water.

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(told you all I had a lot of rocks! And you are seeing only 1/4 of them! All dug up by hand, fun times :-P)

Allison

{{gwi:307961}}Well I certainly am not going to let the opportunity to show off my babies (dogs...not child) go by without a picture. I do have 3 of them but getting all 3 of them together for a picture invovles a tranquilizer...for all of us ( :

I'm not really at liberty to say what my "crap rose" is this year considering all of my roses are in their 1st year. After my Evelyn and Winchester Cathedral come in the mail today, it will bring me up to 12 roses that I picked up this year.

Both my climbers...New Dawn and Zephirine have been....meh....a little bit of a mixed bag. New Dawn has remained quite healthy and blooms like mad, but won't grow whatsoever, so I pruned out some of the spindly canes and managed to get one basal break from New Dawn...in the process of growing now, so we shall see. Zephirine really has not had any problem whatsoever growing....in fact it's my most vigorous grower. Easily up to 5ft now and has thrown out about 7-8 new basal canes that are readily growing upwards, but gets mildew like there is no tomorrow. After dusting with sulfur and having the sun beat down on it, it seems to be improving. I'm beginning to wonder how much I can fault it though as all of my non-gloss foilage roses are getting a little bit of mildew including William Shakespeare 2000 and Belinda's Dream.

Favorites...all of them?
I don't know....if I had to choose my 3 so far(excluding Evelyn/Win Cathedral), I would have to go with:

-Pat Austin--very robust grower(4ft after 2nd flush) and the blooms really stand out in the garden. Blooms also have a nice size to them and while the fragrance is moderate, it is still quite pleasant. Big point on Pat Austin is gorgeous foilage. She has very brilliant green semi-gloss foilage that really stands out and makes the rose look that much happier.

-William Shakespeare 2000--I suppose I could call him a vigorous grower in the sense that he puts out a ton of growth, but doesnt exactly get a lot larger in the process. It is almost as if he builds a small canopy over the canopy he had before. He is a shapely little shrub that grows somewhat unbalanced, but the blooms are well worth it and the buds are very plentiful. Flowers vary in size from little 2" blooms to larger 4" ones, but they all have a bright magenta coloring as they open that cannot be missed before "fadin" to a dark crimson/purple. The fragrance is the focal point. While not the strongest, it is very complex and very distinct. IMO the best smelling rose I have.

-Red Eden(Eric Tabarly)--Quite an odd climber. The foilage remains fairly healthy looking and it likes to take the appearance of a sparsely leaved Hybrid Tea, but grows very straight and upright canes that are very rigid. The biggest selling point on this rose....by far.....are the gorgeous blooms.....absolutely epic standout, true red, large, romantica blooms. This isn't something you can guage by bloom diameter as the blooms are so cupped that you can't guage the size off of that alone. They resemble slightly larger shot glasses in form and have extremely densely packed blooms. I counted 186 petals on one my older blooms I lopped off. Which is also another point...the blooms last very long. My previous blooms were on for 2+ weeks...and could have kept right on going if there wasn't a period of rain and eventual rust that led to me cutting them off for new growth. A secondary benefit is what I would call at best a moderate scent, but an old rose scent that has a slight tea undertone to it....quite nice when it is on.

Honorable mention: Graham Thomas....quite fragrant and growing well

I wish I had dogs at my place. It kills me not to. I grew up with dogs always around me and now I'm bored without them. I'm more of a homebody compared to other collegiates but live in a nice area in Columbus around a park that is similar in taste to Central Park for NYC. Everybody has a dog and walks/runs with them except for me due to me not being allowed to have a dog on my current property. I'm contemplating sneaking a Golden pup in anyways though. I'd rather have a dog before children. :)

Crap roses: I have to list 2, because there was so much hype about them and they're so disappointing.

Golden Buddha. It bloomed like crazy, but never grew very much. A lot of dieback this year. I could have forgiven the growth habit, but the blooms were always an insipid orange color. Not dark enough to be really orange, kind of dark and not too pretty as an apricot. And never, ever, EVER anything like "golden"--even over a couple of years. Every time we walked by, we commented on how disappointed we were in the color, so it's gone to a new home.

Out of the Night: Balls of crumpled brown paper. Balls when the weather is wet, balls when it's dry. The few blooms I've gotten off it are lovely, and it's covered with buds, but they're all CRAP when they open.

Favs:

I LOVE my Harkness roses. Jacqueline du Pre is a tiny new thing, but she's covered gorgeous blooms. And Louisa Stone is gorgeous. I might have to order more from this breeder.

Lullaby is an incredible little bloom machine, with beautiful old-rose looking blossoms ranging from cream to purest white.

That's 3, but I have to add three minis that look really good--My Sunshine, Fair Molly, and Sweet Chariot.

Aussies Rule! My crap rose is Summer Sunshine. Great healthy rose and the blooms shatter in a day. It has to go, bloom display should last longer. I have mis-tagged rose that is Love and a wretched plant to boot. I just hope they get adopted or the garbage bag comes out.
I got Memorial Day this year and yes it is lovely and healthy. For being pot grown this summer it is faultless. I have Niagara Rainbow aka Marvelle in the U S and it is good rose too. Rita McNeil in Ca.aka Big Daddy [who names these?] has been the best surprise so far. I have to figure in the fall who is really staying.

HOOVB, they are gorgeous, but what's that in the corner? The plug from my mom's refridgerator, which is out in the hall (loooooooonnnng story).

Susan are those soft-coated Wheatens? I adore those!

Allison, Cuddles is part Golden, so I know about the throw ball Throw Ball THROW BALL! thing. 'Moonstone' is a good rose, give it some time.

Serenasyh, Eluane is gorgeous! As beautiful as any rose.

'Tournament of Roses' was a favorite of mine until it died of crown gall. I need another.

Wheatens always crack me up. My neighbor has that breed and I never understand how those guys can see where they are going with all that hair in their face. haha

Awww, thanks HoovB! Eluane gives you her puppy kisses because she is very! frustrated, being the attention-needy Border Collie that she is...When I do my time-consuming once a week sea tea rose feeding, she thrashes and rolls on the ground and wants to play and then flops into a puddle and pouts like a drama queen. Allison and HoovB, Eluane is obsessed with her ball too, but unlike Goldens, she is ball-lunatic...It's the only thing I can do to stop her from herding her arch-enemy the vacuum, but she'll still run with the darn thing in her mouth, softly growling, but running like a Tasmanian Devil in tornado circles...HoovB and Allison, Goldens and Golden mixes are known for their mellow calm natures...Eluane and I are perfect for each other, obsessive and crazy, LOL! Jeffcat, I really feel for you-- how horrid, an apt. complex that doesn't allow dogs... I raised Eluane in an apt. complex that had beautiful landscaping where she and I could play long- distance frisbee... She had so many puppy friends there...I also trained her to have good recall--1st with the landscaped terraces at my apt. complex-- so that even though my yard in my new home has no fenced perimeters, she will stop at its boundaries, no matter how much she wants to keep herding the rabbits.

Oh, I forgot! I think that no matter how many roses I eventually get, I hope that my forever-favorite rose will always be my Gemini tree rose (that it will turn out to be one of those long-lived ancient roses)...It has survived severe winter damage, canker, 1st time chemical root burn, 2 horrific transplants. And it has survived to give me abundant huge beautiful thick-petaled blooms with sweet wonderful fragrance (it ended up inheriting its parentage's very sweet, strong fragrance instead of the only slight fragrance it was "supposed" to have)... I love, love, love my Gemini tree rose!

The ring-tailed rose nosher thinks that "dog rose" is an excellent way to describe a rose that should be removed. In fact, she thinks ALL things dog should get the shovel...

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I forgot my real crap rose....Claire Austin! Maybe she will be better next year, but so far she is a floppy little nondescript white that occupies prime real estate in my yard. Yes, those are Soft Coated Wheaten Terrorists. All these pets are so darling, our winter activity when the roses are dormant. Hoovb, be careful with the plug;I had an Airedale that swallowed a sink stopper and it was quite ill until the vet xrayed him and found the stopper lodged at the entrance to his colon.For the life of me I could not figure out what happened to my sink stopper. Sorry, I got off the rose track

That's unfortunate to hear Claire Austin isn't working out. Is there any reason why that might be? I always admired the pics people had of it online. The nice rounded cup bloom of a decent size looked gorgeous. I liked the bloom the best, but it was far too large for me to grow in a pot, so went with Win Cathedral instead. Does Claire Austin revert to a pink parent color as well? I only ask because on HMF there is a photo with pink blooms around white ones.

Dunno, Jeffcat. This is her first year in the U.S. I cannot figure out why she is doing so poorly. Her neighbors are huge, healthy, monster roses.

You all are just too funny!!! This has turned out to be a great post. Keep the crap coming!!

Lucretia - your Out of the Night post cracked me up!!

All the dogs and the one cat are really beautiful animals. Lots of personality too!!

Carol

This post really isn't about animals, but since others posted theirs, how could I resist? And we needed another feline!
This is ZEUS, the most spoiled rotten creature on the planet. He is actually my 'grandkitten' but when my daughter moved in here a year ago and then moved out,
he became mine. This little guy is the sunshine of my life.

My underachievers this year are the same ones that were lousy last year and I haven't had the heart to get rid of them yet. I keep staying the execution, hoping that they will see the error of their ways and shape up.
Lady Moss
Intrigue
Peace
V for Victory
Tom Brown
Break O' Day
Perfume Perfection (but it smells divine)

Since most of these were ownroots and expensive to ship to the east coast, I am giving them another year to get their acts together. I am such a bleeding heart that it actually makes me feel like 'crap' to shovel-prune a rose.
I still feel guilty for eliminating 2 from last year because they were the first roses I've gotten rid of!

Celeste

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A few years ago Dark Lady posted a "let's play" thread ( In the dreary winter) and we all posted pics of pets...it was so much fun...then we got yelled at !

Out of the Night. Bow wow wow.

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Looking at the picture, I don't know that I'll even give it another year.

My dog rose 'stars'[Aussies Dare and Roxie] and the 'dog' rose 'Summer Sunshine' that does not keep a bloom together for 24 hrs even in cool weather. *I figured out how to post a picture. I drove myself nuts and as usual same mistake until 'oh, eh, dummy moment.'
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I laughed right out loud at your photo of Out of the Night!! It is quite the shock at how ugly it is!!!

Carol

lucretia, that is a beautiful breed of a brown rose you have there. You should consider propagating it for many others. ;)

lucretia1, is that the result of too much rain or moisture? Kinda makes ya sick to your stomach, huh? I would be horrified to find that! Does it always look like that?
Eeeeeeech.

Allison

Allison,

Definitely NOT rain/moisture. We are terribly dry--probably only about 1/3" rain in the past 3 months. I've had one or 2 good blooms of this rose. When they're nice, they're beautiful, but this has been more typical.

Jeffcat, I think I'm going to use the "woodchipper" propagation technique--put that sucker thru a woodchipper and see if anything good comes out! ;-)

Carol, glad at least something good has come out of this ugly rose.

AWARD WINNER Announcement!!!

Lucretia1 for the most "Oh my, please make it stop, nauseating rose"!!! Out of the Night folks. Don't need anymore info on this foul specimen. As a matter of fact we already have too much of this winner with the picture now ingrained in our brain.

Please note: This is not the winner of the "dog, crap, deer, rabbit food, JB fodder, rose of the year" award.
This new award was created out of necessity.

Allison

An award! An Award! My rose won an award!!!

And it's so lovely in all weather--in wet weather, brown and squishy. In dry, it's brown and crunchy.

A prize specimen, for sure.

I bet that not even JBs would touch those rose blooms!!! Blech!!

Brown and squishy/brown and crunchy! What a winner!! You MUST save that for the "winter photo contest" on the rose gallery forum for ugliest rose contest.

Allison - I agree with you. Rose blooms that repulsive deserves an award!!

LOL
Carol

I think it goes right along with the pictures of all the Japanese beetles covering the buds and the ones of Rose rosette disease (RRD). Oh yeah, and that dog puke fungus. (San Diegans are such sissies anyway....)
Poor lucretia1 taking her rose home with beautiful blooms on it thinking it's gonna be sooo pretty in my garden. Then thinking well it must be transplant shock or something she did. Then waits thinking next season will be different..... But no, this is it! That's how it really grows! Hmmmph. Bogus!

Allison

Allison, I ordered a band, so it was sight unseen. The bad news is that I ordered 2, and they both look like this.

In fairness to the rose, I have botrytis out the wazoo in the yard and I don't spray. Plus we're pretty much drought-stricken here--in the past few months we've had about 1/3" of rain at my house, so everything is suffering. So if someone coddled it, it might be a great rose. It's certainly an attractive plant, the blossoms are just crap.

BUT--why would I waste my time spraying and coddling when I can get this without it--

Louisa Stone

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Definitely a new fav!

Wow, she's beautiful!

I've shovel pruned about 15 roses already this year... nothing horrible, just get tired of things, need to have spots to plant newbies, and the garden is still morphing.

3 faves so far:

Tournament of Roses (still blooming!)

Molineux (still blooming!)

Dynamite climber (loooong lasting blooms!)

DOG ROSE: Blue Moon. After viewing so many gorgeous photos of Blue Moon on HMF, I can see one person's favorite is another person's dog rose. Blue Moon has been a healthy and vigorous plant for me with no disease issues. It makes plenty of large buds, but I have not gotten one decent rose so far. The big buds of 40 petals take a long time to open and the rose usually becomes a brown discolored mess before fully opening. See the photos of Out of the Night in this chain--that could be my Blue Moon! BM does not seem to do well in the hot dry Texas panhandle. Ironically, the bush looks good, and it is not suffering from a lack of water, sun, or nutrients. The only thing I haven't tried is erecting a rose canopy used in commercial nurseries.

FAVs: Dream Come True, Kordes Perfecta, Gold Medal, and a Red Double Knock Out for performing magnificently in a spot where I could not get any other rose to grow.

Whoa! Lucretia1, I could not believe that your dogs are the same dogs that I have this year: Golden Buddha that I got from Rogue Valley Roses and Out of the Night from Pickering. Cannot figure out what the GB is doing. It definitely does not resemble the picture of it at RVR website. I was told that it would take a year or two. Have only had one bloom on it so far. Am so sit and tired of the rose sellers showing doctored pictures and giving untrue characteristics. My OOTN looks just like your picture. Another one bites the dust. And in this case we are truly talking about dust blooms. Hey, if your Louisa Stone looks that great with little work it will be on my next years list. Thanks! CJ

Since I've shovel pruned 38 roses in the last two years and have 15 more that are on the watch list, it's hard to pick a favorite "deer". I suppose Route 66 qualifies as well as any because I really liked the blooms, especially the purple color, and in my little spot of paradise it crisped in the sun, even in the spring, in literally a few hours. Favorite roses are probably the two teas, Souvenir d'un Ami and Le Vesuve, for never faltering in the heat and Mmr. Cornelissen for the same reason and for having such an exquisite flower. Burgundy Iceberg gets honorable mention for being such a workhorse and blooming constantly, although its blooms in the heat are nothing to write home about. But, it does try.

Ingrid

The deer rose here is presumptive Fragrant Cloud. I can't entirely blame it -- it was being taken over by Dr. Huey before I bought the house. I also hate the color (I know some people love it... and I can be OK with that if I take my meds).

Mellie says hi to Eluane:

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Lucretia, your Golden Budda is doing nicely here in my garden!

cjrosaphile,

I was looking at OOTN just yesterday--I've been planning to shovel prune it, but of course now it's covered with buds that look like they might open. I'm trying to decide if I should give it just one more year. I hate it when they turn beautiful just when you're ready to give them the axe! If yours looks this bad too, maybe they just don't like the PNW & I should go ahead and make room for someone else.

I gave Golden Buddha away, and I haven't been sorry at all. Looking at the pictures on HMF, it looks like it's just an orange rose. There's a photo of a 4-year-old mature plant---lots of blooms, but plain and orange. If that's what you're looking for, great, but it didn't work for me.

I am loving Louisa Stone. She was just planted this spring, so she's not even established. She still has blooms--a little haggard looking since she has gotten practically no water in the past 2 months of record high temperatures, but the plant looks healthy and shows no sign of disease. It'll be interesting to see how she gets thru the winter. I've put in a couple other Harkness roses (Jacqueline DuPre & International Herald Tribune) and have more on order--Harkness looks like a breeder whose roses do well in my yard.

I have a bunch more roses coming in the next couple of weeks (had to hit that Ashdown final sale), so anybody that's borderline might get the axe when I find out just how much I've over-bought for the space I have!

Another reason to buy more roses--it pushes you to get rid of those that don't really work. Maybe I should get just a couple more...