I'm in a completely different climate/growing region from you, but since no one else has yet responded, I'll throw my "1-cent's worth" into the thread. I've not grown Firefighter, only Papa Meilland. Mine is just starting its third year. The bush is uneven; it is not a rose for landscaping. That's for sure. It will send out very long canes and always produces one-to-a-stem roses. They are smaller and less shapely during our hottest summer months here, but that may not concern you in the slightest. During spring and fall, the blooms are exceptional as a cut flower. Left on the bush they don't last nearly as long,but when I cut them and keep in in a vase in a climate-controlled interior, they look beautiful for a long time. The fragrance is powerful. Classic but also sweet. I've smelled a few other roses virtually as fragrant (only a few) but none that has surpassed it in fragrance. The bloom starts out deep red, has some darker shadings as it opens more; once fully open it will "blue," but not in the dull, faded sort of way many crimson roses do. It actually turns deep purple for me. Once again, that is different cut than when left on the bush. On the bush it just withers before it would get to that purple stage. So far, the rose is a little under par for how much it produces, but my plant is also not very old yet. I'm told it gets better with maturity. So for what it's worth, my grade for it as a cut flower is A-, exceptionally beautiful and fragrant, but not always consistent depending on environment. As a garden plant I have to give it a C or C-. If you don't have it already, you might also consider Oklahoma, also offered by Northland. A duskier red, but still very dark and wonderful fragrance, plus, a better garden grower in my opinion. Pesonally, I'm still hoping to eventually get Royal William, a quite attractive, true red rose from Northland. But it is not nearly as fragrant as the others. Others will have to speak to Firefighter. I only have read about it. Mike

Yeshwant91, you might want to pay closest attention to testimonials from other rose growers near you/in your region. But here's my 2 cents' worth, anyway. If you are seeking a tall fragrant red, as you say, Mr. Lincoln fits the bill--much taller than Papa Meilland by most accounts. I have not grown PM yet, mine (virus indexed) is due to arrive from Roses Unlimited next week, as is Chrysler Imperial. I HAVE grown Mr. Lincoln, both in cool western Washington State, and in hot and humid Mobile Alabama. Both places this rose grew very tall. In Mobile it was easily 8 feet tall, too tall for my preference. In Washington it had a rich deep red color, did not "blue" nor "blow" so quickly as in Mobile, and the blooms were terrific. It also was respectably productive. It would be my pick for fragrant red in a cool summer climate (along with the much smaller Deep Secret!), but I found Mr. L's quality a little disappointing in the Gulf South. Others on the Gulf Coast I know disagree with me, though. I'm excited about Papa Meilland, largely because of ceterum's long-standing rave reviews of him. But many reviews say his form and fragrance are unsurpassed. (yea!) Chrysler Imperial is a much lighter red. I had a cheap (almost certainly) virused plant of it from Walmart a couple years back. Hey, for $4 I thought I'd try it as a disposable. The plant was runty but the blooms, when they came, were wonderful. I'm quite excited to get a healthy specimen (knock on wood) from Roses Unlimited. Healthy CIs are known to be one of the more prolific bloomers, as well as having the same long cutting stems as Papa M. and Mr. Lincoln, and similar Damask fragrance too. If you haven't already done so, check out the photos and descriptions and comments on both roses at helpmefind.com/roses. Raptorfan, I have grown Ingrid Bergman, but only for a year and a half. As rich a blood red color as they come, but the bloom form is variable, and I detect not even a slight fragrance. Perhaps bloom form is better with a mature bush? IB gets quite variable reviews on fragrance. Veteran's Honor is definitely more fragrant, and consistently excellent form, though the color is not quite so rich. Both are impressively prolific bloomers.

Finally back to this thread I started eight years ago. Olde Romeo looks awesome, and also unavailable in the US. I have missed you all and gardening. Last year I was on assignment in San Diego, a temporary arrangement that ended on October 30th. Back at the abbey now, and for any of you who remember me, I wanted to tell you that we are moving into the new place starting on January 11-16...the end of a long journey, and the beginning of a new one. Will there be roses at the new place? Yes. Ambrose and the seminarians transplanted over 100 of the current abbey collection to the new place. I was in San Diego, and I have no idea how they transplanted some of those roses. There was a tea (Rosette Delizy) that was about 10x10 that they basically made a bare root!! It's sprouting tons of shoots at the new location. I am constantly amazed at how tough roses are. When the new garden grows in, I'll post photos for you all. Jerome

Here in Southern California, Papa M mildews something fierce when first planted. Thankfully, however, it sheds that tendency as it matures as a rose bush and the mildew tends to recede while the blooms get bigger and more fragrant than before. A terrific rose, IMO, and I don't normally spray for disease. JimD