Ah, yes, the sore point: WATER! My garden is a 20 minute drive from my home,set in an incredibly beautiful, hilly, wild place-but there is no running water,no streams...it's up on a rocky hill, where you'd have to drill down something like 80 meters deep to get to an underground stream. We often go for many months with no rain at all- drought is a constant threat,and it just basically doesn't rain in the summer-or if it does, not nearly enough to contrast the blazing sun; it can barely dampen the soil surface.Of course I do harvest rain water, and bring in water in 20-liter tanks in my car,but this situation doesn't allow for any primadonnas. So basically I think I'd be childish and silly to desire roses that require pampering. I'd be better off looking into the Hulthemias, for example-called "desert roses" by some. Not that I can't grow full-flowered ones-Sir Paul Smith, for example, does fine-and English rose, bred by Amanda Beales, I think. Of the few Austins that I do have, I must mention Charles Rennie Macintosh,unique in it's colour, and for the fact that here is one Austin that is actually under-rated, an exception to the rule, IME.For some reason, this one seems to do pretty well, even in my adverse conditions.

Now, I just got an email that Heirloom has this own root rose in stock for Spring shipping. I ordered it, even though I have a grafted one coming from DA already. I'm considering it a scientific comparison primarily. It's not like I have a problem.

I have 3 SOF own root plants: it does great here. I got a 1 gallon pot from Chamblees for around $12 plus shipping around 9 years ago that had 3 plants in it. The DAR website says that it grows up to 8 feet tall, but some of the canes on our plants are over 15 feet long. I would not really want to grow it on a rootstock here, as it might get even taller. I live in central CA in USDA 9/Sunset zone 14. Our growing season is ridiculously long here, (roses bloom here from mid March until December) which is why most roses and other plants, grow larger here than most other places. I don't know how it would when grown own root in your area, but I expect that it would be smaller. Perhaps you could contact your local rose society and see if any of its members is growing this variety.

@Kristine LeGault 8a pnw I got Swirly Pop from For Love Of Roses when it was a trust worthy nursery. It is no longer, sad... I heard that KandMRoses starts selling Dave Bang's roses but I haven't ordered any from them. @Tina_Dallas I heard that dahlias are as addictive as roses so I told myself don't get too deep into dahlias because my garden is too small, lol. @Glimmer of Hope (9b, inland SoCal) Thank you. Boscobel and Jubilee Celebration are different enough that you will want both in your garden. SoF has average thorn and has more thorn than Bathsheba. Because you have an active toddler, maybe plant it in a spot away from kid traffic. Helen