Correcting soil with pH 7.15 for acid loving perennials?
paulns
16 years ago
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tsugajunkie z5 SE WI ♱
16 years agobpgreen
16 years agoRelated Discussions
Amending soil with UCGs to bring down pH?
Comments (9)An overall composting plan can use coffee grounds to speed up the process, but it won't be a quick fix. It takes years to improve the soil. Sulfur is a quick fix, but you have to keep up with in, it is never finished. If you add vinegar to the water you water with, it will bring down the ph. I wish I could rig up a system to add vinegar to the water I use with the hose, as my water is very alkaline. But, if you use too much of these things you can damage plants. I am not sure of the correct amounts, but I am always very sparing. But, using straight coffee grounds on the soil is not a great. It will attract flies and form a hard crust, grow mold, lot of drawback to this. But, if you use them in your overall program they will work great. There is a lot of information on coffee grounds if you search this forum....See MorepH question: charcoal as soil amendment
Comments (68)@John, I wasn't trying to pass judgment and apologise if it sounded that way. Just discussing. A meandering discussion: I was trying to draw a distinction between air pollution (e.g. particulate matter) which burning wood does cause; and greenhouse gases on the other. (I was mostly making this point in the context of the charcoal-in-soil issue - where making charcoal may not produce much CO2 but sure does produce air pollution) Air pollution: there are contexts in which burning wood makes sense and for those in more rural locations - I understand it; but it does produce air pollutants like particulate matter that have negative health effets - but concentration matters therefore distance etc from others matters. (I still think gas preferable if available from air pollution perspective but I'm not passing judgment - unless you live next door to me and are burning your wet leaves, in which case you'll definitely hear from me). Greenhouse gas discussion a lot more complex - I won't pretend to know how to best calculate GG trade-off between eg wood and gas, and if you need heat, you need to get it from somewhere. (Apart from other issues, methane leakage from pipelines and production probably worse than the CO2 from burning it). Not everyone gets cheap electric heat from hydro (including me). I was only making the point that when trees rot, not all gets converted into CO2, and how long it takes to get turned into CO2 matters from a GG/climate perspective. But that doesn't say much, the choice isn't usually burn it or leave it on the ground, but rather burn it or get the heat from some other source, and that other source matters. (And there are other factors like cost) And I'm just discussing here. I have an occasional wood fire for pleasure, I'm not a fanatic....See MoreUsing a pH meter and lowest pH to kill botulism
Comments (65)Should have posted this sooner but here is a reply I got back from an inquiry - Thank you for your interest in the National Center for Home Food Preservation. Regarding your question: (My sent message) Background, I am a home food preservationist with an extensive history of home sausage making (both with hot ((refrigeration required)) and some cold smoking ((humidity and temperature controlled to produce country cured sausage, no refrigeration required)), home canning (pressure canning only, I do not trust water bath under any circumstances) and extensive dehydrating experience. I have done a little pickling under the recommendations that the USDA has out in regards to fish and hardboiled eggs (including the need for refrigeration). However in my research into historic preservation techniques I have found references to pickling (especially) fish preserved at room temperature. The references also stated that the vinegar solution used at the time was homemade and was of strength higher then the present 5% available for modern commercial sales. Given that botulism spores growth is inhibited at a PH of 4.6 and they can not therefore produce the toxins, the fact that! a 10% or 15% acetic acid can be readily produced using food safe glacial acetic acid (99.85% available commercially mixed in proper ratio with water (yes, acid to water, I remember basic chemistry) and the PH of the 10% solution is approximately 2.4 and given that 1.5â x 1.5â x 0.75â pieces of fish would readily equalize PH is this theoretically a safe preservation method. Please do not give me the standard rely of not recommended or approved due to lack of experimental data etc. brush off, I am just looking for a theoretical answer. (The reply) This is Elizabeth Andress, Director of the National Center. I personally apologize for not getting back to you sooner, but we have been trying to keep up with people needing help with more standardized recommendations and methods of preserving. I can tell you that under the circumstances you describe with the low pH environments, that theoretically botulism spore germination and toxin production does not seem likely. But that is indeed as much as I can say. You would want to make sure the fish pieces get below pH 4.6 throughout fairly quickly to keep it longer at room temperature (probably at least within 24 hours). It is not a brushoff but a fact that no one here has any practical experience with pickling fish at room temperature (or for that matter, at any temperature). We do not have USDA pickling or smoking for fish on our website or in the USDA canning guide, but there is information from Oregon State University we have shared on smoking fish. I have pretty much relied on contacts in Alaska, or formerly in Oregon, for issues related to smoking and pickling of fish. You also might find an actual food microbiologist actively researching with bacteria at Univ. of Wisconsin who knows more in detail of C. bot. patterns. Thank you, Elizabeth Andress...See MoreLowering soil pH for some new shrubs
Comments (14)Hi - I don't live in Mi but in Zone 5 which I think might be the same zone as you. I have multiple limelight hydrangeas in my lawn and although I don't have an LA dreaming hygrangea, I do have multiple endless summer bushes which I think are very similar and also require acid to lower the pH to produce blue blooms. The limelights don't need any acid, they grow fine. In fact I find them to be extremely hardy. I really don't due anything to them. Mine are about 7 years old, and they don't require any additional watering other than what nature provides. The endless summer hygrangeas are a different issue. I replaced one of them, because one of the bushes failed to thrive, and in general only one of my three bushes grows to any significant height. This is more likely because when they were planted a hole was dug and they were just plopped inside the ground with a lot of clay. The one I replaced I dug a very wide and deep hole and ammended the soil with a lot of mushroom and cow compost (throwing out the clay dirt from the hole) and the new shrub is growing a lot better than the old. I've added two types of "acid" products to make the balls turn blue - both the espoma acidifier (comes in blue bag) and Aluminum Sulfate. The espoma product is very gentle and overtime I've added bag after bag to the three trees (probably 6-8 in total). I put around the drip line and work into the soil. I takes a lot of product and it seems it only works for a month or two -- so it was a constant exercise. Wanting something a little more effective, I started using the Aluminum Sulfate. This product seemed to work quicker and it also tended to last longer -- but just as other posters in this thread have commented, the effects are eventually buffered by the clay. I worry about the long term effects of aluminum in the soil, but I don't really have any downsides "just yet" and I'm not growing the bushes anywhere near a food garden. It also however is kind of a pain to keep adding to the soil. They bloom on old wood, so you need to product the limbs during the winter to get the best bloom growth. I've also found with the bush I replanted -- that if you add the acid to the mulch/top soil preparation during when planting -- you need to add far less acid later since there isn't as much clay to buffer the soil. My best results with these hygrangeas however were to grow them within a pot. I guess this makes sense since I can add the correct type of soid and not worry about the clay, and I take the pots inside the garage during the winter so I don't have to worry about the stems breaking. I take them inside a garage, let the leaves fall off, and only water about once a month. A lot more prolific blooms as you can see in the photographs. Unfortunately with the plants left in the ground, I've either become lazy or sedentary and I've just excepted they aren't ever really going to stay blue. If you're willing to accept the fact that most will be pink, then they are not much maintenance. If however you want the classic "blue" appearance, be prepared for a lot of work....See MoreKimmsr
16 years agokqcrna
16 years agojbann23
16 years agodavid52 Zone 6
16 years agosquonnk
16 years agopaulns
16 years agobpgreen
16 years agotsugajunkie z5 SE WI ♱
16 years agorenais
16 years agopaulns
15 years ago
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